SMALL single turbo project, thoughts welcome!

[ZephTheChef]

The lift is tied up tonight with a half-done transmission swap in a customer's van, so I'll be doing stuff on the ground tonight. I think I'll try to get the vacuum leaks sealed up, and maybe get the inline fuel pump installed and flow-test everything at 70 psi to make sure I'm not going to run into horsepower limitations with the stock in-tank pump.

[svxfiles]

I actually made some out of a pair of cutting boards years ago.
But the Outlaw Engineering ones are much, smoother and can hold a higher temperature.
Between ceramic coating of my intake manifold, some vents cut into the webbing of the manifold, and phenolic spacers between the intake manifold and the stacks, and between the stacks and the heads, my intake manifold now never goes above 170°f.

[ZephTheChef]

Originally Posted by svxfiles

I actually made some out of a pair of cutting boards years ago.
But the Outlaw Engineering ones are much, smoother and can hold a higher temperature.
Between ceramic coating of my intake manifold, some vents cut into the webbing of the manifold, and phenolic spacers between the intake manifold and the stacks, and between the stacks and the heads, my intake manifold now never goes above 170°f.

Nice! That's actually very impressive, especially considering the way the manifold is set up, and that it probably catches a lot of heat rising off the block. Do you have any insulation between the block and manifold? That's something else I was considering...perhaps even coat the underside with expanding polyurethane foam, and topcoat that stuff with my ceramic coating.

We used to cook hot dogs on our manifolds at 3000GT/Stealth gatherings. Quickly. They're actually shaped perfectly for doing so. They would get very hot if you'd been driving, to the point you would get burned if you touched them...even while wearing gloves, lol. They would get nearly as hot as exhaust does on your average car. A lot of guys started running spacers back around 2000 (likely from outlaw, as I noticed they offer them for 3000GTs), and it was amazing, regardless of whether it actually helped power, the difference it would make in manifold temperature.

I went ahead and picked up another cutting board, I'll try that for now but I may well "upgrade" to a true phenolic spacer in the future. It's hard to beat $7 and an hour or so work. I imagine this'll go a lot faster than when I made some for my Q45, as those were 8 individual pieces, and I can just make 2 for the SVX...I should even be able to cut them at the same time. I'm thinking I'll try a little experiment and spray them with some of my ceramic coating, and then topcoat it with engine enamel for appearance. It should keep the heat from affecting the material.

I thank you for bringing it up, because it was something I had been meaning to do on this project and had honestly been somewhat forgotten. Now that I've got some dead time waiting on other parts to come in it's the perfect time to get this taken care of!

[icingdeath88]

What kind of cutting boards are we talking here? How thick and made of what? I might do this when I get some time. Could you also use the cutting board thing between the stacks and the heads? Or would that be more likely to get too hot?

What about drilling holes into the manifold webbing?

[ZephTheChef]

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

What kind of cutting boards are we talking here? How thick and made of what? I might do this when I get some time. Could you also use the cutting board thing between the stacks and the heads? Or would that be more likely to get too hot?

What about drilling holes into the manifold webbing?

Walmart sells "Mainstays" brand cutting boards made of Poly (doesn't specify what kind of poly...ethylene or proplyene or urethane). I was able to fit 4 upper-lower intake gaskets onto one of the $7 boards. They're good thickness...5/16" according to my cheapo calipers. They also sell them in bamboo...but I've always heard bamboo doesn't deal with thermal expansion very well (it has air/moisture pockets that build steam and crack/pop).

Like I said...we'll just have to see how well they hold up, but I don't think it will be a problem if they are coated with a high-temp enamel or ceramic coating.

[ZephTheChef]

Similar to this, except mine is 11 x 14.5 and is flat. It does have a handle, which cuts down on the useable area, but I was able to get 4 gasket tracings onto the $7 one. They have one that's considerably larger for about $10.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Mainstays-...Board/13397991

[ZephTheChef]

Good news! Although I couldn't find any information on the web about what kind of material was used in these cutting boards for sure, the spanish on the label says "Tabla de Polipropileno para Picar"...I can reasonably deduce that Popipropileno means Polypropylene, the lowest melting point in that family of plastics is 130 degrees C, which is 266 degrees F. The highest is 170 C or about 340 F. It's safe to assume these cutting boards fall somewhere within those bounds which I'm fairly comfortable with, with a coating on them.

[ZephTheChef]

On the same note, if these do suffer from heat issues, Plexiglass is good up to about 320 degrees F.

[svxfiles]

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

What about drilling holes into the manifold webbing?

http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/use...svxfiles|34373

3-25-06,Cool!

[icingdeath88]

Originally Posted by svxfiles

http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/use...svxfiles|34373

3-25-06,Cool!

Neat. Ceramic coating probably makes a way bigger difference than the holes though, right? Is that something that I can DIY, or is it something that has to be professionally done like powdercoating?

[svxfiles]

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

Neat. Ceramic coating probably makes a way bigger difference than the holes though, right? Is that something that I can DIY, or is it something that has to be professionally done like powdercoating?

The "speed holes" are DIY,
I had a place in VA do the ceramic coating.
Four years later it's still pretty/shiney!

[ZephTheChef]

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

Neat. Ceramic coating probably makes a way bigger difference than the holes though, right? Is that something that I can DIY, or is it something that has to be professionally done like powdercoating?

You can get some kinds of sprayable ceramic coatings from specialty stores. I got mine from techline, but they only sell to shops.


Update of the evening on my car. I sealed up the injectors and sprayed carb cleaner, the leak is still there, so it's upper to lower intake manifold. No surprise since the black rings are no longer in there. It is a very small leak though, idles and sounds great. That should seal up with the poly spacers, and a light coat of silicone

The issues I was having earlier I was never able to duplicate IN the shop and I finally figured out why they were happening. It was kind of one of those facepalm moments. I don't have the airbox on right now, so the intake is effectively sucking from the engine bay. The exhaust is also dumping under the engine bay. It would never act up in the shop because I always had the hood up. Outside, I'd close it and go figure, 20-30 seconds later it would start hunting for an idle and running like crap. I was doing some extreme EGR action, lol. Another reason to get that exhaust finished up ASAP.

I let it run for about 20 minutes tonight though, and I'll prop the hood and let it run for maybe an hour tomorrow to make sure the coating is good and cured, then I'll let them cool off and wrap them and repeat the process to dry the wrap, then coat the wrap.

[Cam]

Originally Posted by svxfiles

http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/use...svxfiles|34373

3-25-06,Cool!

If I am not mistaken that is an african cychlid and a pleco in that tank, right? Man, those things are enourmous. Kind of funny thats the first thing that caught my eye (even before the engine )

[Cam]

Originally Posted by ZephTheChef

You can get some kinds of sprayable ceramic coatings from specialty stores. I got mine from techline, but they only sell to shops.


Update of the evening on my car. I sealed up the injectors and sprayed carb cleaner, the leak is still there, so it's upper to lower intake manifold. No surprise since the black rings are no longer in there. It is a very small leak though, idles and sounds great. That should seal up with the poly spacers, and a light coat of silicone

The issues I was having earlier I was never able to duplicate IN the shop and I finally figured out why they were happening. It was kind of one of those facepalm moments. I don't have the airbox on right now, so the intake is effectively sucking from the engine bay. The exhaust is also dumping under the engine bay. It would never act up in the shop because I always had the hood up. Outside, I'd close it and go figure, 20-30 seconds later it would start hunting for an idle and running like crap. I was doing some extreme EGR action, lol. Another reason to get that exhaust finished up ASAP.

I let it run for about 20 minutes tonight though, and I'll prop the hood and let it run for maybe an hour tomorrow to make sure the coating is good and cured, then I'll let them cool off and wrap them and repeat the process to dry the wrap, then coat the wrap.

Making some serious progress here. Can't wait too see a video of it making some boost.

[ZephTheChef]

I've become increasingly obsessed about my intake temps...like to the point of being paranoid about it. I know if I don't keep them down, I'll be left of the surge line for the 16G. I can't seem to get dreams of an air to water intercooler out of my head. I'm strongly considering complicating the project some more and going to an air to water intercooler. In fact, I'm done considering it...I'm sold.

I will continue work on the project with the air to air core for now, but this will be my first upgrade as soon as funds are available. Cost will be about $500, but that's well worth it for the benefits. With the big reservoir, you can see intake temps considerably lower than ambient for short periods of time by adding ice. I calculate about an 8% HP difference at 70 degrees F vs 150 degrees F (just as a hypothetical scenario). Not to mention the added pre-ignition and detonation resistance, and drastically improved VE at all engine speeds.

I could also really have some fun with it for short periods of time...like at the races, or for a dyno day. Think dry ice in the tank and alcohol as the cooling medium. -100F intercooler core = IATs below freezing. That's potentially a 20%+ HP gain over what I was anticipating with the little DSM intercooler.

I think it's an absolutely necessary upgrade if I'm going to push this turbo to it's limits. The concept of a passive air-to-air intercooler just doesn't make sense with the lack of available space (without hacking up the bumper/crash bar and destroying the stock appearance). Plus, the benefits from a water-cooled core are just tremendous. I'll of course have to add a radiator and fan, and circulation pump...but I think that's going to be considerably easier than trying to fit an appropriately sized FMIC in there. Plus, my intake piping could be a LOT shorter with a water-cooled intercooler, resulting in much better throttle response and even faster spool.