Mid Engine SVX concept.

[svxfiles]

"When I weighed my spare stock hood I got 48#s on my digital scale, "

[Dessertrunner]

Originally Posted by SVXRide

Ditto! Nicely done. Tony! The Acrobat software has come a long way regarding visualization. I take it you're using a high end CAD program and saving the file as a 3D pdf?? Are the green pieces just your welding jig and the blue representing the mounting points on the SVX frame?

Thanks.

Bill

Yes Bill your part guess is right. The CAD software isn't that costly, its Alibre which for the cheaper version is about $700.

Okay so what I wanted to do was see if we can work out how to put the cars on a massive weight loss program. So when I get a chance I will do up a spread sheet to run some calcs, also see if we can get compoent weight for things that are missing from out list. For things that will no longer be needed for this car, eg rear diff, tail shaft etc.

I am close to completing the rear subframe jig and also have started construction of the first subframe. I will post photos in the next couple of days of were it is up to.

Questions that I need help with.

I need to make drive shafts with rear outter and front inner, does any one have a clue if the splines are simlar so I can just swap ends????


Last thing I have been watching the Factory Five Racing development of there mid engine Subaru kit car. The first images have been realeased and the the thing looks brilliant. Just can't install a EG33 so it no good to me. But the guys that build the kits do a brilliant job.







You can go here to follow the cars at the show in Vegas

http://www.factoryfive.com/whats-new...-is-under-way/

[Dessertrunner]

The jig is taking shape, I now need to locate and install the anchour points were the subframe will attach to the body of the car. Also instead of using a large flexiable bush like on our SVX's I have gone for bush from the shackle on a 4 wheel drive spring, less flex which should improve the handling.

Tony

[Dessertrunner]

Jig is finished and the new mounting point design are done as well. I have played around with the engine mount and whats aviable. I think the final design will us 40mm by 80mm rubber bushes inside a steel housing. That way if I want to get the engine lower I can.
Tony

[Dessertrunner]

Here are a bunch of weight numbers not sure if it will post correctly so I may have to have a cuple of goes at it. Weights in KG for my part.
Tony

SVX parts weight contribution.





Engine 148kg ej20 is 98kg
6 speed 85kg 5 speed 65kg


Glass,
Rear Glass 21lb
times below by 2
Rear Side Upper 6lb
Rear Side Lower 3lb
Front Side Upper Glass 6lb
Front Side Lower 6b








3580 lb car
- 23 lb drivers seat swap
- 13 lb front bumper exchange
- 20 lb rear bumper reengineer
- 14 lb lighter wheels (16.5 ea)
- 33 lb spare tire, jack and tools
- 8 lb trunk carpet + cardboard
- 39 lb exhaust system
+220 lb driver
+ 35 lb gas
3685 lb car




Driver seat (leather with electric controls)- 68 lbs.
Passenger seat- 49 lbs.
Rear seat bottom- 13 lbs.
Rear seat back- 24 lbs.
Factory type spare tire- 28 lbs.
Factory wheel complete with tire, balanced and inflated- 47 lbs.
(Note only a 19 lb. difference between those meaty real wheel assemblies and the goofy temporary spare. Those wheels are fairly light.)
Standard type battery- 31 lbs.
Back glass- 20 lbs
Rear 1/4(stationary) glass- 5 lbs
Rear 1/4(moving) glass- 3 lbs
Rear window regulator- 4lbs.
Front(moving) glass- 8 lbs
Entire AC system (less ducts)- 30 lbs.
Bumper core- 28 lbs.
Entire sunroof assembly (including motor, cables, tracks, wiring)- 29 lbs.
Hood- 46 lbs.
Entire trunk assembly (including lifters, hinges, lights, reflectors, and wiring)- 37 lbs.
Front fenders - 10 lbs/each



From here on down all weights are in KG's


Engine Part Weight.


AC compressor 6.9
Alternator 5.6
AC & Alternator Bracket 1.9
Throttle Body, Intake Manifold & Injector 16.5
Power Steering Pump 4.0
Front Crank Pulley 2.1

Exhaust System 17.7
Engine manifolds 3.5

Front Brake/Hub/Disc/Axle 31.0
Front Spring/Strut/Top Mount 8.9
Front Axles (This weight is included in the above) 7.1
Front Disc (This weight is included in the above) 7.6

Rear Hub Assembly including Spring/Strut/Strut Top/Calip/Disc/Trailer Arm 30.9
Rear axle (This weight is included in the above) 6.5
The pair of Laterial Arms and bolts (One side) 2.7

Standard Tyre & Rim 17.6
My Large Tyre 23.7
Standard Rim 9.2


Driver Seat 30.5
Passenger Seat 21.6
Rear Seat Bottom 6
Rear Seat Top 11
Spare Tyre, Jack & Tool 15

Rear Diff 23.5
Tail Shaft 9.8
Rear diff support cross beam 8
Gearbox Support Beam (Front) 3.3
Rear Subframe (Bolts to 4 bolts) 22


Inside AC and heater unit 9.8


Power Steering rack 10.8
Door Including Windows Etc 34
Bonnet 21.4
Boot/Trunk 16.8
Sun Roof 13

Steering Column 15
Mats
ABS

[Dessertrunner]

Jig finished and started to assemble sub frame. I made the bushes for the anchour point and the small locators plates on the CNC lathe. The rubber bushes are from the spring shackle on a 4 wheel drive. With 6 of them to hold the engine and gearbox it should work out okay if they flex to much I will change them to more steel.
Here the photo.
Tony

Shows the front frame cut in with the two locating washers at the bottom and top of the Bush.


Further shot.


These are the parts that I made up on the CNC lathe, bushes and locating washers. Still trying to get my head around the CNC lathe.

[Dessertrunner]

First version of Subframe is in place, I have decided to make a further version so this prototype will be is old hat. Effectively the reason is that I want to later be able to lower the engine down closer to the ground when I install the dry sump and the exhaust. I am working on a new design engine mount for the job but to start with I will go with this orignals.
In the photos I have included a photo of the concept of the engine mount. It has the advantage of being lower and stronger then the existing one.
Tony

[SilverSpear]

Great work Tony!

[SVXRide]

Originally Posted by Dessertrunner

Yes Bill your part guess is right. The CAD software isn't that costly, its Alibre which for the cheaper version is about $700.

Okay so what I wanted to do was see if we can work out how to put the cars on a massive weight loss program. So when I get a chance I will do up a spread sheet to run some calcs, also see if we can get compoent weight for things that are missing from out list. For things that will no longer be needed for this car, eg rear diff, tail shaft etc.

I am close to completing the rear subframe jig and also have started construction of the first subframe. I will post photos in the next couple of days of were it is up to.

Questions that I need help with.

I need to make drive shafts with rear outter and front inner, does any one have a clue if the splines are simlar so I can just swap ends????


Last thing I have been watching the Factory Five Racing development of there mid engine Subaru kit car. The first images have been realeased and the the thing looks brilliant. Just can't install a EG33 so it no good to me. But the guys that build the kits do a brilliant job.





You can go here to follow the cars at the show in Vegas

http://www.factoryfive.com/whats-new...-is-under-way/

Tony,

So brilliant, in fact, that there is already at least one company that has been formed to just handle all of the donor WRX pieces (engine, etc.)

Bill

[Dessertrunner]

Think that I will get around the rear drive shaft issue by using the front wheel hubs and do some machining on them.

So why do that,
- when they are machined (remove steering arm) they will be lighter,
- Can use the original front axles which again are slightly lighter.
- Will get a different handbrake system so don't need the standard ones.
- The wheel axle is ligther.
- Front hubs have bigger bearings so should be better suited to take the weight of engine etc.
- Wil give better air flow to the disc as there will be no backing plate with the handbrake assembly.

Tony

['E']

Originally Posted by Dessertrunner

Think that I will get around the rear drive shaft issue by using the front wheel hubs and do some machining on them.

So why do that,
- when they are machined (remove steering arm) they will be lighter,
- Can use the original front axles which again are slightly lighter.
- Will get a different handbrake system so don't need the standard ones.
- The wheel axle is ligther.
- Front hubs have bigger bearings so should be better suited to take the weight of engine etc.
- Wil give better air flow to the disc as there will be no backing plate with the handbrake assembly.

Tony

Tony if you use the 05 sti front hubs you'll have a direct fit hub with the front six speed gearbox shafts and the new better bearing packs, abs sensor and tone wheel will match up if needed.

Plus you can run sti brembo 4 pots on the rear and my brembo 6 pots up front

[bazza]

Originally Posted by Dessertrunner

First version of Subframe is in place, I have decided to make a further version so this prototype will be is old hat. Effectively the reason is that I want to later be able to lower the engine down closer to the ground when I install the dry sump and the exhaust. I am working on a new design engine mount for the job but to start with I will go with this orignals.
In the photos I have included a photo of the concept of the engine mount. It has the advantage of being lower and stronger then the existing one.
Tony

Nice bit of work that. Was thinking about it and looking at the pics - how close is the exhaust pipes to the 2 x beams that support the engine mounts and original oil cooler position. Might be worth bringing those closer together so you can ensure the engine can be moved up and down and have no compromise on the NA spec header design.

[Dessertrunner]

Bazza was planning on going out side ways then back with the header, then over the top of the axle. If you see the remaining cross beam left near were the axles comes out I will cut this out completely and that will allow the exhaust pipes throught there.

I just looked at the photo and its confusioning, the beam goes between the exhaust ports and the sump with about 50mm clearance on both sides.

Tony if you use the 05 sti front hubs you'll have a direct fit hub with the front six speed gearbox shafts and the new better bearing packs, abs sensor and tone wheel will match up if needed.

Plus you can run sti brembo 4 pots on the rear and my brembo 6 pots up front

Is the stud pattern 114 or 100mm?

[smc]

114, however this is only with the 05+ STI's.

[bazza]

If it was my car I wouldn't even try swapping hubs / making handbrake nasty to work with and just making the setup hard to work on and hard to fix. You don't want to build something that's hard and time consuming to fix especially if it's track oriented.

I would send the proposed outer CV and the proposed inner CVA to Albins in Ballarat and tell them to make up a new shaft to make it all work and you could prolly add a bit of wheel track at the same time - the current weakness of the SVX (assuming weight reduction goes well) is it's too long. So to reduce that issue make it wider where possible to offset this. The driveshafts will cost $950 including new CV's IIRC (I think shafts alone are half that). They swear they're driveshafts are unbreakable which is a good start. The shafts would then be very strong and CV's are easy to swap out. If you've ripped out 300-400 kg of weight then there's a good chance the bearings will be pretty good.

Now I also say this about the hubs and shafts is because a major issue as shown in all the RWD R160 and R180 STI's etc is that you will chew through driveshafts and probably the diff also. Replace front diffs in a 6MT is quite easy, but still the box needs to be dropped and it's not cheap. PPG most likely make stronger gears.