true spiritual ancestor of the SVX
 

While I was surfing the web, I do not currently remember exactly how it went but I heard some mention of Jenson FF and it being the first production car ever to have AWD. And since with the internet being able to have information at your fingertips in all I decided to search for more info on this car. It took some time since "Jensen FF" did not get me many automotive hits on Google or Altavista under images. But then I switched to just looking for sites came across a Jenson FF fan site that pretty much got me all the information and pictures I need including that FF stands for Ferguson Formula (named after the Ferguson brothers that founded the company).

Just take a look at this fan site and come up with a conclusion.

But for those who are too lazy to search the website I will come up with some things in common this sporty car has with ours.

- Both went through an Italian makeover.

- The SVX and FF are both on a AWD/4x4/whatever car on a sizable sports car and exotic like platform.

- Both are AWD sports cars with engines of ample displacement, I.E more than 4 cyclinders.

- The SVX and FF were bothed designed with grand touring in mind.

- Both the SVX and FF are currently sports cars that are currently virtually forgotten in automotive history.:(

But we're here to change that, like that webring is for the Jensen.

Here is another Norwegian based fan site that shows all the Jensen models made, and would have been if the company didn't go under in 1984.

Ok I admit, the Subaru XT6 is the true spiritual ancestor of the SVX (as far as I know of). But you have to admit the Jensen FF (and later Interceptor) have allot in common. And the designers who developed the Subaru SVX must have had these cars somewhere influentially on their minds.

On a side note I have taken a personal liking to this exotic hatchback looking G-Type, a couple of prototypes of that vehicle have been produced pictured here:
http://www.domestic.dk/jensen/images/g-type.gif
http://www.british-steel.org/models/g-type2.jpg:D

True timeline...
 

If the Jenson FF's manufacturer went out of business in '84, then the FF would naturally be the spiritual ancestor of the XT/XT6. True ancestry should be:

Jenson FF -> XT/XT6 -> SVX

Nice find btw. What are the specs on the FF? Dimensions, weight, engine power & torque?

-Chike

Well, here are the specs for the Jensen Interceptor in the RWD version, but if you read the top they also made a AWD that had pretty much the same specs aside from the AWD, anti-lock brakes and perhaps the suspension setup.

Now this is where the confusion begins, the hp of the Jensen FF stated on this page is at 283 for the 6.3l Chevi V8, while if you read or at least skim through this page it is 330hp. Then along comes this site stating it is a 6.2l V8 producing 330hp. Then I read somewhere that someone had to detune from 330 to 283hp in order for it to be drivable on Long Beach. Now ask me this, why would you have to detune a car that has an America made engine, which has specs that probably comply with US motor vehicle law, or at least classify it as a classic.

Oh well, I guess finding the true specs for this car will be about as hard as finding what truely happened to Chez Rivera. :rolleyes:

I could be wrong but I believe Jensen also used Mopar engines in some of their cars. They were best known for overheating. ;)

Also in the back of my mind is that the type of limited slip diff the SVX employs was a Ferguson design. They also developed what was known as the 'Ferguson System', a precursor to modern AWD design. Something makes me think one of the first to use at least part of that system was Jeep Wagoneer, as 'QuadraTrak'.

Another interesting, little known European make of that period (but not AWD) that used Chrysler V8 power in several models was Monteverdi. Do a search for Monteverdi hai 450ss.

Another memory sifted through the rubble and came to mind: in 1962 Zora Arkus Duntov (father of the Corvette, for those unfamiliar) began a design for a race-syle Corvette, the CERV ll. Even though he had Bunkie Knudsen's blessing (the guy that began at GM, later went to Ford in the late '60s, and was responsible for Pontiac's beak - and the '70-'71 Thunderbird's beak also), it was denied by the bean-counters. Cool platform, started with a small block, later went to ZL-1 style aluminum rat motor. AWD was designed and the test of the engineer's ability was to design and sort out a variable powerr distribution system. So... this was probably the first car to have unequal power to front and rear wheels in an AWD vehicle. Performance stats were impressive: 0-60 in 2.5 - 2.8 secs (depending on who was reporting) and a top speed of around 180mph.

Today's best almost-kinda in-production car only slightly bests that 0-60 time. The Dauer962LM claims a 2.6 second 0-60 time.

Interesting log of production speed:
http://www.webbpages2.com/supercarworld/records.html

Nice facts you listed there, never knew anyone in the 1960s had it in them to engineer a variable AWD differential system. Then again in the age of mock 4 jets and virtual nation destroying nukes deployed from hight tech nuclear powered submarines I should expect nothing less. I never knew about the creator of the Corvette, Zora Arkus Duntov, let alone his contributions to the automotive world. This reinstates my theory that automotive technology hasn't really changed all that much in 30 years, it is just more and more vehicles have access to it.

Also, if you are talking about this Ferguson I don't think he is related to the Jensens Brother who founded Jensen Motors in the 1920s, who probably decided to name their first AWD luxury sports after the man who they incorporated what essentially is his technology into and tied it with their background in Formula 1.

Funny thing is now that I think of it, I can say that the Subaru SVX AWD is as much to what Zora designed as to the Ferguson layout. Unless you cannot count power being variably controlled through electronic torque conversion rather than through physically controlling the differentials. Or I am just confusing myself and in fact everything that has to do with the tires moving has to go straight through the differential, please enlighten me on this.:confused:

All this also makes me think there is a possible way of hacking ECU, solenoid or whatever controls to torque conversion split into sending more power to the rear wheels at times. ;)

Well there ya go. I should have done my homework, I was working from my feeble memory. :)

The SVX, that we in the states drive, really doesn't have a center diff. The trans is basically a fwd unit and the front/rear connecting clutch allows the rear drive to share some of the work. That is, the front, as long as nothing is broken, always has full power applied to it, and the rear is given some of the load as the TCU sees fit. So if the TCU decides the rear should do 20%, the front, even though nothing has been taken away from it, is effectively handling 20% less, or only 80%, of the total load. Hopefully you can now understand why there is no way to 'trick' the TCU into applying more than equal power to the rear, as there is no mechanical provision to disconnect power to the front diff.

Another interesting AWD vehicle: the 1966 ('67?) Hurst Hairy Olds. A Gutlass 442 with front and rear blown engines, TH425 transmissions (Toronado/Eldorado/GMC motorhome) and no mechanical connection between them, save throttle linkage. The trick was to keep two engines and trannies power sync'd from a dead stop. It didn't work well. If my memory serves me well, the last run the car made was in Gainesville and the driver bailed out the window at speed, with the car continuing on pilotless, blazing a new trail into the nearby swamp.

Thats cool, I have heard of the methanol powered twin engine Tiburon sponsored by Hyundai but never heard about or seen the Hurst Hairy Olds before, looks good. I guess now I know where the whole twin-engine dragster concept came from, or at least ones done by a manufacturer since there are plenty of private tuners out there that probably have done it before and after.

There are many, many multi-engined cars out there. I was just thinking of AWD variants, my feeble attempt to stay within the original gist of the thread. ;)

FYI Jensen used Chrysler big blocks in at least the Interceptor. Of course it needed detuned when the 70s rolled around. Nothing like a 400ci engine producing 120 hp.

Another interesting note is that Jensen was the first company to put anti lock brakes on a car (the interceptor). They came straight from an aircraft parts manufacturer for carrier planes.

Jensen however, is not a forgotten company. A properly restored Interceptor I commands prices well north of $50k and I know as of 5 years ago you could still buy one new from a revived Jensen co,

Jensen however, is not a forgotten company. A properly restored Interceptor I commands prices well north of $50k and I know as of 5 years ago you could still buy one new from a revived Jensen co, [/B][/QUOTE]


Two summers ago I was fortunate enough to stumble upon a weekend Jensen meet that took place In my "back yard" of Columbia, MD. There were about two dozen of said vehicles, among which was a rare Interceptor convertible & one of about 12 remaining AWD models. I believe there were only a handful of AWDs ever made.

This gathering was definately a droolfest & I paid actual money to attend the awards ceremony held in the evening.

Ron.

You mean to say you didn't try to trade a half-full box o' wine to get in?

I tried, Beav, but Jensen owners are stemware, not hardware people.

Ron (only extends pinkie to pick nose).

i've seen a number of Interceptors but never knew about the FF. rare indeed.

thinking of it and the Monteverdi reminded me of another (very nice) european coachwork / American engine designs of the same era: Iso Grifo

http://www.seriouswheels.com/1970-19...7-Liter-FA.htm

Mopar to you
 

When we lived in England from '75 to '78, our landlord's daughter owned a Jenson FF. It was Chrysler powered.

Don