Another Hyundai knocking on Subaru's door

[svxsubaru1]

Originally Posted by Weebitob

I was just thinking that decimals were involved.

Also, 365 divided by 2 equals 182.5.

It would be 365/2.5 since the U.S. Sti uses the ej257. Which would be 146hp a liter, but it was done on 91 octane which is prety impresive.

[Weebitob]

Originally Posted by svxsubaru1

It would be 365/2.5 since the U.S. Sti uses the ej257. Which would be 146hp a liter, but it was done on 91 octane which is prety impresive.

If the hp per a litre for an ej motor can be calculated by merely deviding how many litres the engine has by the overal hp, then Subaru must make pretty good engines.

[Rotorflyr]

Originally Posted by Weebitob

Over all I think it's a decent looking car, and could very well come with AWD, add to that the fact that the build quality has improved TONS and the long warranty, it has the potential to be a big seller.
However looking at it as pictured, it doesn't look like it has the "sportshift" feature

[UberRoo]

Horsepower / displacement ratios are very relevant. I should have made it clear that it does operate on a sliding scale, so the large displacement Corvette does not compare well to the half-sized S2000, but it's very meaningful when comparing similar displacement engines or if you simply factor the scale into your equations. As you increase horsepower, you run into the problem of diminishing returns. With a naturally aspirated motor in the two-liter range, 100 horses per liter is about the point that the exponential scale of diminishing returns really starts to become a huge consideration. With turbocharged motors, the exponential scale flattens out quite a bit, but at 120 horses per liter (in the two-liter range), it becomes apparent that it's still a factor as it climbs enough that manufacturers start to rein in their engineers.

Big pony motors are expensive to build, and that reason by itself is more than enough reason for manufacturers to back off.

Another thing to note is that the sliding scale of horsepower / displacement also depends on a number of other factors. The number of cylinders and the general proportions of the motor are significant. For our purposes of comparing relatively ordinary production car engines, we can pretty much ignore these things because the engines we're talking about are basically the same. If we were talking about an oversquare twelve-cylinder, versus a stroked V-twin, then we'd most definitely need to consider how those configurations factor in.

[Weebitob]

Originally Posted by Rotorflyr

Over all I think it's a decent looking car, and could very well come with AWD, add to that the fact that the build quality has improved TONS and the long warranty, it has the potential to be a big seller.
However looking at it as pictured, it doesn't look like it has the "sportshift" feature

It is blue LED outlined button looking things that are under the horizontal crossmember with the little red LED up and down icons.

And also thanks Uberoo, so from what I can understand from your post, hp per a litre becomes more relavant as you go into smaller cu engines or the amount of pistons are in that sized motor as well as how big they can be according to how the pistons are configured?

[94svxred]

I have to say that as a past car salesmen , that Hyundai has done little more then very inpressed us with the quality of thier cars since the late 80's! They have come a long long way, and put out very good products at there price points!! They will be around for a LONG time !! just a note also Kia is not to bad for the entry price market!!

[Weebitob]

Originally Posted by 94svxred

I have to say that as a past car salesmen , that Hyundai has done little more then very inpressed us with the quality of thier cars since the late 80's! They have come a long long way, and put out very good products at there price points!! They will be around for a LONG time !! just a note also Kia is not to bad for the entry price market!!

Well you know that is mostly thanks to Hyundai, they own Kia you know.

Lets just see though if Daewoo can start producing higher quality cars, as in fit and finish, since they seem to also have reliability down pat, without the need of a government subsidized company to help them. The closest they ever came was with the Bucrane concept. Lets just hope Hyundai's SR gets put into production, even though according to most press releases it should be.

[UberRoo]

Originally Posted by Weebitob

And also thanks Uberoo, so from what I can understand from your post, hp per a litre becomes more relavant as you go into smaller cu engines or the amount of pistons are in that sized motor as well as how big they can be according to how the pistons are configured?

Horsepower per liter is relevant in any size of motor or configuration, but when sizes and configurations become too disimilar, they don't compare readily. Small motors produce higher horsepower ratios primarly because they can spin really fast without coming apart. The short-stroke twelve cylinder example I gave is basically like having a bunch of small motors. Their torque figures aren't very impressive, but since the horsepower formula is [torque X RPM], if you have lots of RPM, you don't need much torque to achieve big horsepower numbers. There are other dynamics too of course, such as how a large engine breathes compared to a small one. Fluid dynamics work differently at varying scales, among a host of other variables that also change with scale.

One advantage large motors often have is a broad torque curve. When it comes to raw performance, horsepower is the only thing that matters. ...but, since most of us don't have twenty-speed, paddle-shifting transmissions that can constantly be shifted to stay in the power band, having a broad torque curve can be useful. In that respect, a big, torquey motor has more useful power per liter than a smaller motor.

I think if we had a meaningful way to measure useful horsepower, we could probably do away with the sliding scale. In general, the useful horsepower of smaller motors would be lower, and larger motors would be higher.

Ultimately, one way to sum up why horsepower / displacement figures are meaningful, they indicate how 'built' a motor is. Five-hundred horses from a fifteen-liter diesel motor isn't very impressive, whereas five-hundred horses from a three-liter racing motor is impressive. (Unless you tried to tow a 50-ton trailer with the racing motor, and then you'd have nice demonstration of why torque is useful.) For the purposes of this thread, an indication of how built the motor is means something because producing a highly-tuned motor is expensive. It requires a lot of expensive parts and fancy engineering to make a high output motor stay together. Subaru has done a fantastic job of producing a (1)reliable, (2)high-performance, and relatively (3)low cost motor. "You can have it good, fast, or cheap - any two." If Hyundai changes one of those things, something else must also change.

[Rotorflyr]

Originally Posted by Weebitob

It is blue LED outlined button looking things that are under the horizontal crossmember with the little red LED up and down icons.

Didn't pay that close attention to em', at a glance I figured them to be cruise control and radio buttons, was looking for a "slap-stick" set up.
Thanks for pointing it out