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#1
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Interesting EG33 output comparison...
It's very hard to compare the SVX to current cars as the EG33 was developed before variable valve timing was common in production vehicles (think only the '91 NSX used it back then).
Decided to compare the specific hp/liter and torque/liter outputs of the EG33 vs the naturally aspirated models offered in the MKIV Supra, Z32 300ZX and 3000GT which were in its price range and performance class. Results are shown below: 300ZX 2960cc 222hp & 198lb-ft 75 hp/l & 66.89 lb-ft/l Supra 2997cc 220hp & 210lb-ft 73.4 hp/l & 70.07 lb-ft/l 3000GT SL 2972cc 222hp & 201lb-ft 74.69 hp/l & 67.63 lb-ft/l SVX 3318cc 230hp & 228lb-ft 69.3 hp/l & 68.72 lb-ft/l While the hp/l output of the EG33 is a little below the others, the lb-ft/l output is right in the mix of things which is probably a testament to the IRIS system Subaru developed. Another observation is that the hp and tq values are almost identical on the SVX, but significantly different on the other engines. Seems like Subaru tuned the EG33 with torque in mind. I'm sure they could have tuned the engine to make ~240hp & 215lb-ft, but probably due to the car's heavy curb weight, 4EAT trans and awd drivetrain, the SVX needed all the torque the engine could muster... -Chike
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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) Last edited by Chiketkd; 11-29-2004 at 08:57 PM. |
#2
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the extra tq could also be contributed to the increase of displacement over the other 3.0 engines
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#3
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And no doubt the manual conversions run more like the other models sticks as well, #'s wise anyways.
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Sold-Black 97: They're All We'll Drive-into the side of a Pathfinder that lost it's path! 2004 Stage 3 XT Forester-Soon for sale! 2007 Jag S-type, just 17k on it! Past prides: 1992 black LsL new off the lot. 1992 pearlie for a few months. |
#4
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Quote:
If a 3L V6 engine makes 250lb-ft and a 6L V8 makes 500lb-ft, both engines have the same lb-ft/l output of 83.33. Engine size is therefore irrelevant in these calculations... -Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) |
#5
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oh right, im retarded.
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#6
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Quote:
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#7
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Quote:
-Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) |
#8
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Quote:
__________________
Sold-Black 97: They're All We'll Drive-into the side of a Pathfinder that lost it's path! 2004 Stage 3 XT Forester-Soon for sale! 2007 Jag S-type, just 17k on it! Past prides: 1992 black LsL new off the lot. 1992 pearlie for a few months. |
#9
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Chike,
It would be better to make the comparison by dividing HP by both displacement and the rpm at peak HP.
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Mychailo :: 2006 Silver Mitsubishi Evolution 9, E85, 34 psi peak, 425wtq/505whp DJ :: 1995 Laguna Blue SVX L AWD 5MT (sold) Visit my locker SVX Mods: ND iridium spark plugs, Impreza RS fpr, afr tuned to 13.2:1 using a custom MAF bypass, custom exhaust, WRX 5MT w/ STi RA 1st-4th gear & stock WRX 5th gear, Exedy 13 lb flywheel & Sport Clutch, STi Group N tranny & engine mounts, urethane spacers in rear subframe, rear diff mounts, and pitch stopper, SVX Sport Strut Springs (185f/150r), custom 19 mm rear swaybar, urethane swaybar mounts, Rota Torque 17x8", 225/45-17 Proxes 4 tires, Axxis Deluxe Plus organic brake pads. |
#10
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Quote:
It does this by a process called hydraulic coupling - liquid is not easily compressed - so when the the output shaft from the engine spins, the hydraulic fluid (i.e. ATF) doesn't compress easily and spins the input shaft that leads to the trans. This torque is multiplied by means of two fan shaped objects found in the torque converter called the impeller and turbine (think of two fans facing each other - if one is off and the other blows air onto it, the blades of the first fan will start to spin as well). To make a long story short, hydraulic coupling isn't perfect, and causes a loss in the torque being transmitted of around 5-7%. So that's why drag racers in rwd cars will say as a rule-of-thumb that a manual would typically lose 15% of crank power to the wheels, while automatics lose around 20%. -Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) Last edited by Chiketkd; 11-29-2004 at 10:07 PM. |
#11
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Quote:
The EG33 has a very low power peak of just 5400rpms, while the other engines make their peak power in the 6000-6500rpm range. Kinda makes you wonder what kinda power this engine could truly make if tuned differently... -Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) |
#12
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I understand how automatics work, of course there's more parasitic loss, You guys are assuming the gear ratios are the same between autos and manuals, they're not.
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#13
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Quote:
Let's look at an example. The WRX wagon that comes with 227hp, is offered in 5MT and 4EAT versions. The 5MT has 3.90 gears in front and 3.55 gears in the back. The 4EAT wagon has 4.11 gears both front and back. The 5MT version has gone 14.8 @ 95mph in the 1/4 mile by Road & Track. However, the same mag got a 15.2 @ 91 mph for the 4EAT version... -Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) |
#14
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Quote:
I looked up the rpms at which the other cars made their peak hp and got: 300ZX 222hp @ 6400 rpms 3000GT 222hp @ 6000rpms Supra 220hp @ 6000rpms Not sure how you wanted to plug them into the equations, so I wanted to give you the values. -Chike
__________________
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato 2013 Cosmic Blue 5spd Evo X GSR 2006 Galaxy Gray 6MT RX-8 (sold) 2006 Steel Gray WRX TR (sold) 1996 Brilliant Red SVX L (sold) |
#15
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MEP is found from:
BHP/(rpm*displ) rpm is in krpm (rpm/1000) displ is in liters MEP is a better way to compare the efficiency of different motors because it takes into account the rpms the motor is turning at peak HP. Its important to take rpm into consideration because greater rpm is an easy to create more power (assuming that some amount of torque can be produced). Here are the results car-------------disp (cc)----bhp----rpm at peak HP----MEP 300zx----------2960-------222----6400--------------11.72 Supra----------2997-------220-----6000-------------12.23 3000GT SL---2972--------222-----6000-------------12.45 SVX------------3317-------230-----5400--------------12.84 When taking into acct rpm, the SVX motor takes the win in efficiency. It would be interesting to see what the SVX motor would crank out with longer duration cams, higher lift, and appropriately tuned intake and exhaust. If the MEP of 12.84 could be maintained but peak HP moved to 6500 rpm, the motor would be cranking out 275 HP.
__________________
Mychailo :: 2006 Silver Mitsubishi Evolution 9, E85, 34 psi peak, 425wtq/505whp DJ :: 1995 Laguna Blue SVX L AWD 5MT (sold) Visit my locker SVX Mods: ND iridium spark plugs, Impreza RS fpr, afr tuned to 13.2:1 using a custom MAF bypass, custom exhaust, WRX 5MT w/ STi RA 1st-4th gear & stock WRX 5th gear, Exedy 13 lb flywheel & Sport Clutch, STi Group N tranny & engine mounts, urethane spacers in rear subframe, rear diff mounts, and pitch stopper, SVX Sport Strut Springs (185f/150r), custom 19 mm rear swaybar, urethane swaybar mounts, Rota Torque 17x8", 225/45-17 Proxes 4 tires, Axxis Deluxe Plus organic brake pads. |
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