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  #91  
Old 12-18-2004, 10:43 PM
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drivemusicnow drivemusicnow is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow248


It's a shame really. You used to be such a formidable adversary. An archenemy really. I actually enjoyed our encounters. But your quality has gone downhill alot since those days.

That's the best you can do? Seriously?
... Maybe Gm made 2 cars JUST for you that didn't have problems, but companies get reputations for a reason. i'm glad you've had a great experience with your GM cars. however there are thousands of GM owners who would say you're full of crap. I will agree that among american cars, GM hands down is the winner. but thats as far as i'll go concerning "gm quality"

but in any case, it doesn't matter... and this thread has gone WAY south.
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  #92  
Old 12-19-2004, 05:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow248


It's a shame really. You used to be such a formidable adversary. An archenemy really. I actually enjoyed our encounters. But your quality has gone downhill alot since those days.

That's the best you can do? Seriously?
wow, i have my own archenemy! i guess i'll have to build an evil island lair, now.

what makes me chuckle is that after GM kills off your beloved Trans-Am and replaces it with a half-assed slapped-together Australian car for the US market (and gives it the name GTO - an American icon for crissakes), you still keep your fanboi loyalty. and i don't mean the Holden was slapped-together - the way it was prepared for here is what i'm talking about. the GTO is a legend, do you think maybe GM could have given it a little thought and came up with something on their own, or maybe not nickel-and-dimed this one?
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  #93  
Old 12-19-2004, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Landshark


what makes me chuckle is that after GM kills off your beloved Trans-Am and replaces it with a half-assed slapped-together Australian car for the US market (and gives it the name GTO - an American icon for crissakes), you still keep your fanboi loyalty. and i don't mean the Holden was slapped-together - the way it was prepared for here is what i'm talking about. the GTO is a legend, do you think maybe GM could have given it a little thought and came up with something on their own, or maybe not nickel-and-dimed this one?

And this is called "hitting the nail on the head."

Shark, you're exactly right. The GTO is an awesome name and it has got some excellent history. There might not be a Mustang or Camaro, as we know them, had the GTO never existed. And for Pontiac to take that so lightly, is a joke. The Holden Monaro is a cool car, no doubt. Nevertheless, I wish that Pontiac could have invested some time and effort into the GTO before slapping new badges on the Monaro and calling it something else. Whether you like the Mustang or not, at least Ford goes back to the drawing boards and comes up with new designs for the Mustang. They set a goal of redoing the Mustang, and now we have it. Even GM shows that with their ideas for the 2007 Camaro.

It's a shame that Pontiac would so easily rebadge a Grand Prix-look-a-like and not wink. Unfortunately, it looks like the operations of GM and others prohibit creating a brand new product. All GM products share frames, engines, and powertrains. The only distinction is their outward appearance. A Chevy Malibu is a Pontiac Grand Am is an Oldsmobile Alero and so on. I guess, as consumers, we're willing to accept this and as the producer, GM is willing to save money by doing this. Many muslcecars of the 60s changed, somehow, ever year. Nowadays, you couldn't tell me what year my SVX is unless its a 1997.
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  #94  
Old 12-19-2004, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by drivemusicnow
... Maybe Gm made 2 cars JUST for you that didn't have problems, but companies get reputations for a reason. i'm glad you've had a great experience with your GM cars. however there are thousands of GM owners who would say you're full of crap. I will agree that among american cars, GM hands down is the winner. but thats as far as i'll go concerning "gm quality
You could say this about just about any car maker there is. Problem with judging a carmaker's quality by number of satisfied customers is that everyone has a different opinion of a high-quality car. To me, a car that doesn't drain my bank account for repairs and upkeep is a quality car. To Mandi (the g/f), there are no "high-quality" cars out there, because to her, a "high-quality" car would go for 200,000 miles and not even need an oil change. Two weeks ago a headlight bulb burned out in her Grand Am and she said "i'm never buying a Pontiac again!". She seriously said that. You should have heard what she had to say about her SVX. I won't repeat it here though, I don't think your hearts could take it.

Quote:
Originally posted by Landshark
wow, i have my own archenemy! i guess i'll have to build an evil island lair, now.
Now see there's the wit i'm talking about.

Quote:
Originally posted by Landshark
what makes me chuckle is that after GM kills off your beloved Trans-Am and replaces it with a half-assed slapped-together Australian car for the US market (and gives it the name GTO - an American icon for crissakes), you still keep your fanboi loyalty. and i don't mean the Holden was slapped-together - the way it was prepared for here is what i'm talking about. the GTO is a legend, do you think maybe GM could have given it a little thought and came up with something on their own, or maybe not nickel-and-dimed this one?
This just in: You're right!

I agree with you there. There's nothing wrong with the car they call the GTO...it's fast, handles great, and rides even better, all for a great price. It looks OK. But it definetly should not be called "GTO". They should have just came up with an all new name for it.

It's not slapped together either...it had more than it's share of the development process before it was introduced in Australia.

Quote:
Originally posted by sidewinder
Shark, you're exactly right. The GTO is an awesome name and it has got some excellent history. There might not be a Mustang or Camaro, as we know them, had the GTO never existed. And for Pontiac to take that so lightly, is a joke. The Holden Monaro is a cool car, no doubt. Nevertheless, I wish that Pontiac could have invested some time and effort into the GTO before slapping new badges on the Monaro and calling it something else. Whether you like the Mustang or not, at least Ford goes back to the drawing boards and comes up with new designs for the Mustang. They set a goal of redoing the Mustang, and now we have it. Even GM shows that with their ideas for the 2007 Camaro.
I figured i'd add in the above comment before I went on.

Historically, the Grand Prix GTP could more rightly be called the GTO, because the GTO was a performance package on an otherwise pedestrian car.

When the new platform sells in 2007, it will be called "Camaro" for Chevy and "GTO" for Pontiac. Both versions will have radical new designs, much more appropriate for the nameplates. However I still don't think GTO fits. I've never said it has. It's a great car, but it's no GTO, as they say.

Quote:
Originally posted by sidewinder
I guess, as consumers, we're willing to accept this and as the producer, GM is willing to save money by doing this. Many muslcecars of the 60s changed, somehow, ever year. Nowadays, you couldn't tell me what year my SVX is unless its a 1997.
I don't know about you, but i'm more than willing to accept this sort of process, seeing as it means that I can get a nice car for $30,000, instead of the $100,000 they'd charge if they were constantly updating and not sharing parts.

It's great to dream about a perfect carmaking world, but that sort of process is just not practical.
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  #95  
Old 12-20-2004, 07:36 AM
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Royal Tiger Royal Tiger is offline
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I grew up on Oldsmobiles. My dad had a restored 1955 Super 88 2dr hardtop that won shows all over the East coast. After we sold that he bought a 1968 98 2dr. That left and we haven't had another. Except for a few Plymouths along the way, every car we had was an Oldsmobile except the pick-up experiment, that was a Chevy. That they (GM) killed America's oldest car maker in the manner that they did, I lost some respect for them. Poor leadership started the dying in the late 80's. Except for maybe a Chevy truck someday, I don't see myself ever owning a "American" car again. I'll stick with Subaru, Nissan, Honda, or Toyota. And hopefully one day a Porsche.
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  #96  
Old 01-06-2005, 11:15 AM
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just when you thought it couldnt get any better

I found a place to d/l more ..

http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/m...T_VIDEO&bhcp=1

the Trilogy one is awesome !!
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