The Subaru SVX World Network   SVX Network Forums
Live Chat!
SVX or Subaru Links
Old Lockers
Photo Post
How-To Documents
Message Archive
SVX Shop Search
IRC users:

Go Back   The Subaru SVX World Network > SVX Main Forums > General SVX Babble

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 05-16-2007, 04:18 AM
jman050's Avatar
jman050 jman050 is offline
Its a Classic!
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: tallahassee fl
Posts: 531
i thought the stock maf was good for 250 crank? maybe im wrong
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
STi BBS wheels,legacy gt 4.44, 3" catback exhaust, Stance GR+ 7k/5k, QS Teflon adjustable endlinks, Hankook EVO 245/40/17, 95-LS escaine seats, GC8 V7 steering wheel, JDM clear corners, small car clear lenses, Alcyone badge, JDM rear taillight, 97 grille, stevesby bumper, PWR radiator, Perrin Crank pulley, Urethane Swaybar bushings, urethane diff bushings, DDM 6k 55watt lows and 4500k 35watt fog lights; $15/15min mod, Motorsport whs 22mm rear swaybar, QC shift kit, ToMyx intake, z32 aluminum calipers 13" rotors, nitrous express proton + wet kit.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-16-2007, 08:08 AM
TomsSVX's Avatar
TomsSVX TomsSVX is offline
Maniac modifier
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Branchburg, New Jersey
Posts: 15,489
Registered SVX Classic SVX
on paper, yes that is true... in real life, I know otherwise... I was maxing out my MAF with my old N/A 5mt.

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-16-2007, 01:23 PM
Budfreak's Avatar
Budfreak Budfreak is offline
Banned
Subaru Gold Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Akron,Ohio
Posts: 3,094
Send a message via AIM to Budfreak
Like I said, I don't have all my mods listed or they aren't even knowledge to my closest people in the SVX world. The MAF is dealt with and 2V7 will take care of it for good later on.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-16-2007, 01:33 PM
TomsSVX's Avatar
TomsSVX TomsSVX is offline
Maniac modifier
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Branchburg, New Jersey
Posts: 15,489
Registered SVX Classic SVX
Jason, I know I am giving you a hard time... but its for good reason. I don't believe I was making over 275 crank horse on my old 5mt and I had everything done to that car... I had intake cams and the stage 2 w/ z32 MAF adj. FPR and all the "tweaks" that could strangle every once of HP out of the car... To be honest I think you are overestimating the output of your engine over stock. Until one takes the plunge and converts to an MT, goes FI, or does a significant engine build; the engine can only be considered in stock form.

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-16-2007, 01:58 PM
Budfreak's Avatar
Budfreak Budfreak is offline
Banned
Subaru Gold Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Akron,Ohio
Posts: 3,094
Send a message via AIM to Budfreak
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomsSVX
Jason, I know I am giving you a hard time... but its for good reason. I don't believe I was making over 275 crank horse on my old 5mt and I had everything done to that car... I had intake cams and the stage 2 w/ z32 MAF adj. FPR and all the "tweaks" that could strangle every once of HP out of the car... To be honest I think you are overestimating the output of your engine over stock. Until one takes the plunge and converts to an MT, goes FI, or does a significant engine build; the engine can only be considered in stock form.

Tom
I figure I'm making about 245-260 or so at least with my 1/4 times and an auto. It's no problem Tom. What do you think I'm making?
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 05-16-2007, 02:07 PM
TomsSVX's Avatar
TomsSVX TomsSVX is offline
Maniac modifier
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Branchburg, New Jersey
Posts: 15,489
Registered SVX Classic SVX
well, considering your mods are only making up for stock restrictions... you are probobly making 230hp... Considering Chike was running the saem times and trap speeds with the stock engine and stock ECU

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-16-2007, 02:16 PM
Budfreak's Avatar
Budfreak Budfreak is offline
Banned
Subaru Gold Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Akron,Ohio
Posts: 3,094
Send a message via AIM to Budfreak
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomsSVX
well, considering your mods are only making up for stock restrictions... you are probobly making 230hp... Considering Chike was running the saem times and trap speeds with the stock engine and stock ECU

Tom
Actually, Chike ran with cams and computer tuning I believe and still only ran 15 flat and that was with RX7 light wheels and I'm running stock ones.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-16-2007, 05:24 PM
92svx95 92svx95 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: fre"ak"mont Ca
Posts: 290
So with all of Jasons listed mods, he is still only putting out 230 crank hp? If a 100% stock svx has 230hp then what would you call jasons mods? super stock? If he had a z32 MAF what should he be making? 250hp?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-16-2007, 08:44 PM
TomsSVX's Avatar
TomsSVX TomsSVX is offline
Maniac modifier
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Branchburg, New Jersey
Posts: 15,489
Registered SVX Classic SVX
to answer the questions...

No, Chike did not have any computer work... he had a 96.

Over time, engines loosen up and lose their ability to perform. To make up for this, the mods listed are exactly that... Infact, these are not mods at if you look.

-He has a light weight crank pulley. These do not add power, they mearly create the illusion of power by reducing rotational mass and allow the engine to spool up faster.

- The Stage 1 ECU does not really add any power, more or less it smooths out the power curve for a more continuous power curve which translates into a better way to put the power to the wheels more.

- The TB bypass is a cheap way shade tree racers try make take up some extra ponies. This "mod" keeps coolant from flowing through the throttle body. In the end it keeps the incomming air a tiny bit cooler and that gives a more dense charge... but the true effects of this are really so minimal a dyno wouldn't even pick it up.

- An air intake will give you absolutely ZIP. The stock intake is good to flow over 400 N/A hp with a good filter. It draws from the same ambient air in the fender as a cone intake would. this is the reason that I still have a fram filter and a stock airbox on my supercharged car.

To be honest, the only worth while mods on an N/A car are intake cams and an adjustable fuel pressure regulator. This in collaboration with a wideband and the stage 2 from ECUtune will give you the best gains if you adjust the fuel pressure regulator to reflect the best possible afr possible.

Thats my rant, ask any reputable mechanic and they will concur, unless they are trying to sell you something

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-16-2007, 11:31 PM
Budfreak's Avatar
Budfreak Budfreak is offline
Banned
Subaru Gold Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Akron,Ohio
Posts: 3,094
Send a message via AIM to Budfreak
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomsSVX
to answer the questions...

No, Chike did not have any computer work... he had a 96.

Over time, engines loosen up and lose their ability to perform. To make up for this, the mods listed are exactly that... Infact, these are not mods at if you look.

-He has a light weight crank pulley. These do not add power, they mearly create the illusion of power by reducing rotational mass and allow the engine to spool up faster.

- The Stage 1 ECU does not really add any power, more or less it smooths out the power curve for a more continuous power curve which translates into a better way to put the power to the wheels more.

- The TB bypass is a cheap way shade tree racers try make take up some extra ponies. This "mod" keeps coolant from flowing through the throttle body. In the end it keeps the incomming air a tiny bit cooler and that gives a more dense charge... but the true effects of this are really so minimal a dyno wouldn't even pick it up.

- An air intake will give you absolutely ZIP. The stock intake is good to flow over 400 N/A hp with a good filter. It draws from the same ambient air in the fender as a cone intake would. this is the reason that I still have a fram filter and a stock airbox on my supercharged car.

To be honest, the only worth while mods on an N/A car are intake cams and an adjustable fuel pressure regulator. This in collaboration with a wideband and the stage 2 from ECUtune will give you the best gains if you adjust the fuel pressure regulator to reflect the best possible afr possible.

Thats my rant, ask any reputable mechanic and they will concur, unless they are trying to sell you something

Tom
Sorry Tom, But I have to disagree on this one and my times say so. Chike did at least have cams on his last runs along with lightweight RX7 rims(and an impreza regulator I think, None of which I have) and still only got 15 flat. So why NO improvements from such a worthwhile mod? I had the original motor in my car with 151+K miles on it when I made the run and I now have a motor with 50K less miles on it. Are you telling me that now I should be hitting 14.8 or better since I have a "tighter" motor? Why is nobody else turning in these kind of times with an auto?

Last edited by Budfreak; 05-16-2007 at 11:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 05-17-2007, 01:15 AM
Crazy_pilot's Avatar
Crazy_pilot Crazy_pilot is offline
Moar shifty!
Subaru Gold Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Toronto, Canada. Eh?
Posts: 4,560
Send a message via MSN to Crazy_pilot
Registered SVX
The only way I can think to answer this is to stick Road Demon on a dyno and see what the numbers are. Run a comparison between SVX motors at different mileage points. You could take Shelfy's two cars (16 and 55K miles) and compare the power between them, along with some higher mileage cars, to determine how the power drops off with wear. I'm sure he'd lend us his cars for some tests

Jason, I'm sure your car would eat mine for breakfast. Actually, my car needs to runs some laps and get into shape, so I'd only be toast, not a full breakfast. Maybe a couple strips of bacon. mmmmmmm...bacon....

Wait, what are we talking about? Oh ya...

Having a 4.44 trans gives a big boost in acceleration. My parents' Foresters can probably give my SVX a good run off the line (I think they have 4.11's), although I can ruin them once we're moving. With the 4.44's you don't actually need more power to get a bigger kick when you step on it.

I'm sure Road Demon makes more power than the average SVX, but how much more, and if there's more than stock peak HP, would take a dyno to sort out.

My .02. Well, that was a bit long. Maybe .03.

And it's 3AM and I have a date for lunch tomorrow. Off to bed!
__________________
Chris

92 Ebony Mica LS-L "A Rolling Restoration": 223,250 KM - Sleeping
2007 STi 6MT, Stance GR+ coilovers, PWR Rad, JDM hood badge, svxfiles 6000K HIDs, JDM Clear Corners, $15/15 min mod, $20/20 min mod, Energy Swaybar Bushings, Hella Supertones horns, Gold STi BBS rims, Group A lightweight crank pulley, A/C system removed, Custom header-back exhaust, Hybrid carbon/metal rear sway bar, restored headlights with CCFL halos
2008 Subaru Legacy Spec B - Diamond Grey Metallic - Sold
2020 Ram 1500 Longhorn - Red Pearl

Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 05-17-2007, 01:50 AM
92svx95 92svx95 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: fre"ak"mont Ca
Posts: 290
Tom, you never answered my question? Your tellin me LAN's software does'nt increase "crank" HP? rather it's not a mod but a way to loosen up a 15 year old motor? does that include regular maintenance and tune ups? Budfreak ran a 14.94 and you ran a 14.5! i am sure after your recent purchase it should blow them numbers away.... but if a "230" hp modified svx can run 14.9's, then what does a 100% totally stock/NA svx run? i am
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 05-17-2007, 04:02 AM
jman050's Avatar
jman050 jman050 is offline
Its a Classic!
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: tallahassee fl
Posts: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by 92svx95
Tom, you never answered my question? Your tellin me LAN's software does'nt increase "crank" HP? rather it's not a mod but a way to loosen up a 15 year old motor? does that include regular maintenance and tune ups? Budfreak ran a 14.94 and you ran a 14.5! i am sure after your recent purchase it should blow them numbers away.... but if a "230" hp modified svx can run 14.9's, then what does a 100% totally stock/NA svx run? i am
ill help tom out a little here...No it doesnt raise peak it simply smooths out the power curve which does improve times theorectically but unnoticebly in the real world. But it does make the car feel better to drive. and budfreak has 4.44 which should gain about .3 or so and the svx has proven to run 15.2 100% stock so the transmission is obviously the reason more than anything.
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
STi BBS wheels,legacy gt 4.44, 3" catback exhaust, Stance GR+ 7k/5k, QS Teflon adjustable endlinks, Hankook EVO 245/40/17, 95-LS escaine seats, GC8 V7 steering wheel, JDM clear corners, small car clear lenses, Alcyone badge, JDM rear taillight, 97 grille, stevesby bumper, PWR radiator, Perrin Crank pulley, Urethane Swaybar bushings, urethane diff bushings, DDM 6k 55watt lows and 4500k 35watt fog lights; $15/15min mod, Motorsport whs 22mm rear swaybar, QC shift kit, ToMyx intake, z32 aluminum calipers 13" rotors, nitrous express proton + wet kit.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 05-17-2007, 05:25 AM
JaySVX's Avatar
JaySVX JaySVX is offline
Bad decisions effect everybody
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Collegeville, PA
Posts: 1,902
Send a message via AIM to JaySVX Send a message via Yahoo to JaySVX
From what i can tell here, it seems RD is interprating his acceleration time as increased hp, when in fact that really couldn't be further from the truth. Having a 4.44 will give you more bang for your buck at lower speeds, but looses in high end compared to the 4EAT. HP off the crank will not change that much from the mods that i've read about so far, probably just about restore it to stock, maybe a hair more.

Light-weight wheels != more hp. light-weight pulleys != more hp. 4.44 ratio != more hp.

If you take out your seats, glass, roof, trunk, and hood, your car will loose a few hundred pounds. It'll see improved track times as well. Did you increase your hp? No. Light weight pulleys spin faster because they need less force to get it going, it weighs less. Same with your wheels. The tranny is geared differently than the stock tranny, so that will give the illusion of power as well. These don't add power though. They will show you differences in track time, sure, but not add power.

Quite simply, the biggest effect on your timesheet is likely to be your tranny. You didn't add much horse power, but rather patched up places the engine would lose horsepower. You increased efficiency, that was lost over the past 15 years and how ever many miles the engine has run.
__________________
*No SVX at the moment...*
1987 Winnebago Elandan 35'
2001 Yamaha Roadstar 1600
2004 Ford Excursion Eddie Bauer, 6.0litre Power Stroke Diesel - Daily Driver.


Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, scotch in one hand, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming HOOOOYA !!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 05-17-2007, 10:48 AM
svxxx26's Avatar
svxxx26 svxxx26 is offline
Headed to Texas...
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Sissonville, WV
Posts: 1,218
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaySVX
From what i can tell here, it seems RD is interprating his acceleration time as increased hp, when in fact that really couldn't be further from the truth. Having a 4.44 will give you more bang for your buck at lower speeds, but looses in high end compared to the 4EAT. HP off the crank will not change that much from the mods that i've read about so far, probably just about restore it to stock, maybe a hair more.

Light-weight wheels != more hp. light-weight pulleys != more hp. 4.44 ratio != more hp.

If you take out your seats, glass, roof, trunk, and hood, your car will loose a few hundred pounds. It'll see improved track times as well. Did you increase your hp? No. Light weight pulleys spin faster because they need less force to get it going, it weighs less. Same with your wheels. The tranny is geared differently than the stock tranny, so that will give the illusion of power as well. These don't add power though. They will show you differences in track time, sure, but not add power.

Quite simply, the biggest effect on your timesheet is likely to be your tranny. You didn't add much horse power, but rather patched up places the engine would lose horsepower. You increased efficiency, that was lost over the past 15 years and how ever many miles the engine has run.

Just an observation from a non-motorhead

I can concur with the difference the 4.44 makes in acceleration, having just undergone the swap. My observation is it's a kick in the pants! I have no idea what my car runs 1/4-mile, but it's bone stock except for that.
__________________
Jerry
2005 Baja Turbo
2008 Ford Crown Victoria Police Interceptor

jnj7707@yahoo.com
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2015 SVX World Network
(208)-906-1122