Cryogenic Steel Treatment

LarryIII · #1 06-04-2001, 05:40 AM

Hi Gang,

I finally read a "scientific" article on cryo-treatment of tool steels in the ASME magazine. Normal stress relieving of steel by heat treatment is followed by quenching (cooling) which changes the grain size of the steel (makes the grains smaller with less voids). The steel goes from the Austenetic to the Martensitic phase. Cryo-treatment after quenching further decreases voids and increases the amount and size of carbide nodes in the steel (The carbides give the steel its hardness). The article had microphotographs of the steel samples taken with a scanning electron microscope. Now I finally saw what's going on. The article focused on the work of the owner of a steel treatment operation in Ontario, Canada and the research work done at Louisianna State University. The university professor stated that both the rate of lowering the temperature and the soak time at cryo temp. are different for different composition steels and critical to the end results. He also stated that a mild stess relief (heat treatment) after cryo-treatment is very important and improves the hardness greaty. Finally, both men stated that no amount of cryo-treatment can compensate for a poor stress relief and quench up front. I finally understand why and how this cryo-treatment works.

Larry III

LarryIII · #2 06-04-2001, 10:01 AM

Does anyone here have direct experience with the subject brake rotors having approx. one year service? Also, can you post your experience and how the ART rotors have performed in both normal and hard braking conditions ? If you do post, please list the disk pads that you're using. Please be specific, citing milage, quietness, pad life, etc.

Thanks

Larry III[U]

SVXphile · #3 06-04-2001, 07:59 PM

Hey Larry, did you get that Jeff Gordon poster? When he won at Dover this weekend, he mentioned his visit to DuPont...
Don

LarryIII · #4 06-05-2001, 07:07 AM

Don,

Sorry I did not get it since I am but a lowly "Contractor". A DuPonter got it after it was promised to me. Someday American companies will realize the value of a classless corporate society.
I won't live to see it. I'm surprised that they allow us to use the same bathrooms. I guess the extra plumbing would cost too much.

Larry III

PS: Sorry for venting.

#5 06-05-2001, 08:41 AM

Does anyone tuning in know the alloy used by Subaru for their rotors? I have a potential source for the "deep freeze" process but if the chemistry of the metal is "critical" I'd need to know what it is.

1994SubaruSVX · #6 06-05-2001, 12:04 PM

the zinc plated cross-drilled rotors that dayle at motorsport is offering along with some carbon fiber brake pads and they are awesome. i dont have abs on my svx and the car stops on a dime. when i raced at the memphis motorsports park we had to do some threshold braking and i experienced no fade. in fact i probably raced 6-8 laps a session doing in excess of 120 on the straightaway. at the start of the event my pads were virtually brand new. by the end of the event they were still almost new. i am always getting compliments on how nice the brakes look. just something to think about.

SVXphile · #7 06-05-2001, 08:17 PM

Thanks for trying Larry. < I'm surprised that they allow us to use the same bathrooms> The faculty restroom here at school just got in some fresh toliet paper; sure beats the corn cobs! (this lack of education funding is pathetic...)

Don

Aredubjay · #8 06-05-2001, 10:17 PM

<<sure beats the corn cobs! >>

Yeah, sure is a bummer since they started charging money for the Sears catalogue.

By the way, this cryo treatment stuff really is interesting. How does it stack up "costwise" versus viagra?

LarryIII · #9 06-06-2001, 05:42 AM

Randy,

<<<By the way, this cryo treatment stuff really is interesting. How does it stack up "costwise" versus viagra? >>>

With the cryo-treated rotors I can go from 100mph to 0mph at least 5 times per hour.
With Viagra I can go from 100mph to 0 mph at least once per day.
It all depends on the kind of anti-squeek gel used on the back of the pads.
And, I don't even want to know what kind of gel & pads that you're using !!

Larry III

PS: I may not be as good as I once was, but I'm as good once, as I ever was.

eddycat2000 · #10 06-06-2001, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by LarryIII
Larry III
PS: I may not be as good as I once was, but I'm as good once, as I ever was.

Are you saying; Once a King, always a King, but once a knight is enough?

So anyhow, this old bull and this young bull are walking along...

#11 06-06-2001, 07:54 AM

He offered his honor, she honored his offer and all night long it was honor and offer.

Aredubjay · #12 06-06-2001, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by eddycat2000

Are you saying; Once a King, always a King, but once a knight is enough?

So anyhow, this old bull and this young bull are walking along...

". . . let's just walk down there . . ."

SVXphile · #13 06-07-2001, 03:17 PM

Honum and offum is an alternative labor of love....especially for those who can't put their backs into it...

Don

vkykam · #14 07-31-2001, 09:47 PM

LarryIII,

Do you still have that article? I'd be interested in where that steel treatment operation is located in Ontario, Canada.

I'm going to be picking up a pair of front rotors from AutoZone ($60.99 ea), and I wanted to cryo treat them before I mount them on the car.

So far, I've only been able to find one place nearby that will do it, and they quoted $2.93CDN/pound for the deep freeze. I'd wanted to find out whether that was a fair price or not, if I had someone else local I can compare it to.

VK

Quote:

Originally posted by LarryIII
Hi Gang,

I finally read a "scientific" article on cryo-treatment of tool steels in the ASME magazine. Normal stress relieving of steel by heat treatment is followed by quenching (cooling) which changes the grain size of the steel (makes the grains smaller with less voids). The steel goes from the Austenetic to the Martensitic phase. Cryo-treatment after quenching further decreases voids and increases the amount and size of carbide nodes in the steel (The carbides give the steel its hardness). The article had microphotographs of the steel samples taken with a scanning electron microscope. Now I finally saw what's going on. The article focused on the work of the owner of a steel treatment operation in Ontario, Canada and the research work done at Louisianna State University. The university professor stated that both the rate of lowering the temperature and the soak time at cryo temp. are different for different composition steels and critical to the end results. He also stated that a mild stess relief (heat treatment) after cryo-treatment is very important and improves the hardness greaty. Finally, both men stated that no amount of cryo-treatment can compensate for a poor stress relief and quench up front. I finally understand why and how this cryo-treatment works.

Larry III