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  #16  
Old 08-26-2004, 06:23 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by simonton
do you think this is something i could do myself?

I've got the factory service manuals, a torque wrench, and a bunch of socket wrenches. I think i could get under the car... But thats about it. I wouldnt really be able to remove the trans myself... but if this is something i can do without removing the trans please let me know
Yes. you could do it yourself. If you look in book 3 around page 113 (may be different page for US book) it details how to do it.

Loosen the lock nut off, and tighten the screw to about 6.5 ft/lbs. about as tight as you can get it with a short 3" spanner. Then back the screw off, 3 full turns.

The adjustment is on the left/top side of the box, do a search to find how others have done it.

Harvey.
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  #17  
Old 08-26-2004, 06:45 PM
lee lee is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by oab_au
Hi Simonton,
I am thinking that when they had the trans out, they may have adjusted the band adjusting screw too tight. May be they did not know what the adjuster did, and just tightened it up.

...snip...

Harvey.
I think it good to heed Harvey's advice. I have seen a source or two that states to only back the band adjustment screw off by two full turns instead of the three that it should be. Your guy might well have gotten his info from such a bad info source and did what he thought was the right thing, but wasn't. Might give a call and see as an easy path to find out.
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  #18  
Old 08-27-2004, 05:00 PM
simonton
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thanks for ur help...
i tried the other night to get my end wrenches on the damn nut but it seems to be too close to the fire-wall. There's not enough clearance to get a wrench or ratchet around it.
I could go get smaller wrenches, but before i do that im just a bit worried about this solution...

If this was indeed the problem; wouldn't it constantly happen?
About half the time the car shifts okay. It's only after I've gotten up to speed, slowed down, and then accelerated.

If i come to a complete stop before accelerating there is no problem in shifting. The grinding shudder only happens after i have slowed to a near stop and then go. It happens on the go - slowing is okay, but only when i try to get back up to speed is there a problem.

Could this mean that the nut is too wide??
Maybe the problem isnt directly related to upshifting, but rather a result of a prolonged downshift - something that would happen if the bolt is too loose. What i mean is this:
say i accelerate - no problem.
as i approach an intersection, i slow down.
The car begins the downshift from 3rd to 2nd.
This downshift is delayed due to the loose bolt, and does not immediately happen.
Then i hit the gas and begin to accelerate, but i'm still in the high gear and the car begins to struggle and shudder.
THEN the car finally finishes the downshift to 2nd and begins to accelerate without problem.

This might also explain why only sometimes after the shudder starts, the car drops into 2nd; while the rest of the time it will continue to struggle in 3rd gear until the car gets up to speed without going back to 2nd.

This would also explain why the problem doesnt seem to be constant. If the downshifting is delayed - I wouldnt notice it if im not even moving.... I usually blast my music when im driving, so if im sitting at a stop and the gears are taking too long to downshift i wouldnt hear it. And without moving i wouldnt feel it... So maybe it does indeed ALWAYS happen...

Please let me know your opinions on this. I really dont know what im talking about. I'm basing this analysis on what you all have told me and on the chart in the service manual. I dont really want to tighten the nut if its really just too tight already... especially since doing this with the trans still in the car is such a pain.

Earthworm, how did you get any tool to fit around the screw and lock nut? Is there anything i can temporarily remove to make this easier?

Last edited by simonton; 08-27-2004 at 05:08 PM.
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  #19  
Old 08-27-2004, 05:05 PM
simonton
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one more thing...

If I use manual mode, and the problem is caused by this screw, would the problem continue? Or would the manual mode bybass the band brake?
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  #20  
Old 08-27-2004, 05:20 PM
lee lee is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by simonton
one more thing...

If I use manual mode, and the problem is caused by this screw, would the problem continue? Or would the manual mode bybass the band brake?
The manual mode does not bypass the band as the band is in use for 2nd and 4th gear (although 4th is never engaged in manual mode).

Somebody may well correct me, but if the problem is intermitant, then I think it unlikely to be a band issue.
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  #21  
Old 08-27-2004, 05:26 PM
simonton
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Quote:
Originally posted by simonton
Please let me know your opinions on this. I really dont know what im talking about. I'm basing this analysis on what you all have told me and on the chart in the service manual. I dont really want to tighten the nut if its really just too tight already... especially since doing this with the trans still in the car is such a pain.

Earthworm, how did you get any tool to fit around the screw and lock nut? Is there anything i can temporarily remove to make this easier?
sorry; i just did a search on this and found a lot of answers...
But im still nervous to go mess with this without knowing if i have to tighten or loosen it. So what do you all think i should do? tighter or looser?
- could having it too tight cause engine damage if the car skips gears? ( i know too loose means i gotta take everyting apart to get the screw back in place )

I know the screw is 10mm, but what size is the lock nut?
Im gonna go get smaller wrenches but i dont know what size to get around the lock nut

Last edited by simonton; 08-27-2004 at 05:36 PM.
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  #22  
Old 08-27-2004, 07:28 PM
lee lee is offline
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if you're unsure of tight or loose, then I recommend the correct, if tedious, method. Tighten until it's snug/stops turning (turn clockwise looking down on it), then back off (counter-clockwise) three full turns.

the large nut is fitted by a 17mm box end wrench. the adjuster is fitted by a 7mm open end wrench (it has a square top - which will come in handy to count the turns to add up to 3 full ones).

The big nut only has to be loosened, about an eighth turn. It then stays over the nut, resting on the differential cover, to keep it from turning anymore. Then, I can only manage about a quarter turn with the 7mm wrench, and it's all done by feel - can't see the little bugger - it helps to take off the vent hose near the dogbone (mount behind engine) - also I recommend removing the negative battery post to prevent sparks if you touch the starter post with a wrench.
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  #23  
Old 08-27-2004, 08:12 PM
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Earthworm Earthworm is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by simonton
Earthworm, how did you get any tool to fit around the screw and lock nut? Is there anything i can temporarily remove to make this easier?
Quote:
it helps to take off the vent hose near the dogbone (mount behind engine) - also I recommend removing the negative battery post to prevent sparks if you touch the starter post with a wrench.
This was what I was going to suggest. Removing the vent hose allows you to get more turn on the wrench.
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  #24  
Old 08-29-2004, 10:36 AM
simonton
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now its the brakes...

okay... my car is falling apart...

I still havent even got the wrenches to try to fix the band brake when last night something terrible happend

I was driving around, and then as i approached a stop the brake pedal started to fight me. It's almost like the abs is kicking in unnecessarily. And now it happens every single time i hit the brakes. It starts with a weird electronic noise and the pedal starts to fight me, then it releases and pulses a few times as the car comes to a stop. It always happens right at 19 mph. always...

Now i almost lost it when something new was happening to my car. But then i thought that maybe this could all be related?

Is there any connection between the abs computer and the transmission?

I got the car back with a computer in the backseat, the mechanic told me it was an extra trans module but it turns out it was my abs computer... I put it back in myself...
Is there anyway the computer is malfunctioning causing the trans and the brakes to act this way??

I'm starting to think that the problem isnt the band brake - because there's a lot of grinding and vibrating noises even in other gears now... I think im just going to have to bring it down to countryside again
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  #25  
Old 08-29-2004, 12:36 PM
simonton
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okay...

tell me what you think of this.

my abs light came on in the dash just now. I checked the computer LED and its blinking 8 times in a row. The FSM says this is a rear left wheel speed sensor.

I mentioned before that i had to put this computer in myself. So maybe i screwed up and didnt put it in right? I also read in the FSM that the transmission adjusts its shift points in accordance with signals sent from the ABS...

SO:
could the problem be all within the ABS computer??
or does the speed sensor for the rear-left wheel control the rear differential, too? and could that be the problem

I heard several times that uneven tire size could cause this; so what if the car "thinks" the wheels are moving at different speeds because the sensor is busted?
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  #26  
Old 08-29-2004, 03:27 PM
simonton
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i went out and lifted the rear of my car and checked the sensors...
I got excited when i saw that the rear left was just sitting in its place with the bolt looses enough to unscrew with my fingers.

I took it out, and it's magnet had attracted hundreds of little rusty particles. So i cleaned it and re-bolted it back into place..


I then put the abs computer back again, and started the car.
The abs light has gone away, and i started to drive

Well, the abs is back to normal - so im happy. But unfortunately fixing the sensor only fixed the abs; the trans is still stuttering and grinding.

Im afraid this whole thing with the abs is unrelated to the trans. Is there still a possibility it could be connected?
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  #27  
Old 08-29-2004, 04:14 PM
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SVXRide SVXRide is offline
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Suggestion -
Take the care back to the Subie dealership that did the trans and have them do the following:
1. Adjust the brake band
2. Check the line pressure to the transfer case
3. Run the TCU diagonostics routine to see if it is holding any error codes (you can do this yourself - do a search of this site on "TCU")

Given your discription of the sound(s) your car is making, I'm afraid the longer you drive it the more damage you may be inflicting on it

-Bill
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  #28  
Old 08-30-2004, 12:54 AM
gl1674 gl1674 is offline
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Quote:
Take the care back to the Subie dealership that did the trans and have them do the following:
Nah. Telling them what exactly what to do will only work if you know exactly what is wrong and what needs to be done. Unfortunately you problem is not very typical.

Tell them exactly the symptoms (shudder and grinding noise), tell them when it happens (slowing down from X mph to Y mph and accelerating to Z mph all this while going in a straight line). Tell them it is abnormal shudder and noise and they have to fix it.
Get a mechanic from the shop to drive with you (you drive) until you manage to reproduce the shudder. If you don't like the mechanic who did the work, ask the service manager to ride with you.
If they deny hearing noise/feeling shudder you may have to mention SOA or take it to another dealership, but more likely it will click in their head "ahh, this shudder" and they take it from there.

Try to be cooperative with them - they have to witness the problem before they can fix it. They can't ship the tranny back to Subaru and get another one until they really see for themselves that the tranny does not work right. From what you are describing the problem is more likely to be internal to the tranny, not a shop's fault.

And what does it take to fix the problem - adjust the band brake or replace the whole thing, that should not be your worry.
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  #29  
Old 08-30-2004, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by gl1674


Nah. Telling them what exactly what to do will only work if you know exactly what is wrong and what needs to be done. Unfortunately you problem is not very typical.

Tell them exactly the symptoms (shudder and grinding noise), tell them when it happens (slowing down from X mph to Y mph and accelerating to Z mph all this while going in a straight line). Tell them it is abnormal shudder and noise and they have to fix it.
Get a mechanic from the shop to drive with you (you drive) until you manage to reproduce the shudder. If you don't like the mechanic who did the work, ask the service manager to ride with you.
If they deny hearing noise/feeling shudder you may have to mention SOA or take it to another dealership, but more likely it will click in their head "ahh, this shudder" and they take it from there.

Try to be cooperative with them - they have to witness the problem before they can fix it. They can't ship the tranny back to Subaru and get another one until they really see for themselves that the tranny does not work right. From what you are describing the problem is more likely to be internal to the tranny, not a shop's fault.

And what does it take to fix the problem - adjust the band brake or replace the whole thing, that should not be your worry.
You're absolutely right....I should have said "take it back and "suggest" that the following be done..."
-Bill
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  #30  
Old 08-30-2004, 11:37 AM
simonton
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thanks for all ur help with this..

i'll just take it in. Unfortunately the "mechanic" that worked on the car before who turned out to be a bit of a dooshbag is the service manager. He later mentioned that he isnt even a mechanic. How that worked out i really dont know. The last few times i talked to him it seems that maybe i just caught him on a bad day. At least i can only hope.
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