Steering slop

[SVX10]

There are various symptoms...maybe related, maybe not. The first one is the one that concerns me most. Any ideas as to what is wrong and how to best remedy it (even if it means replacing major parts) are appreciated.

1. Vehicle is jacked up so that only 1 of the front wheels is off the ground. I grab the wheel/tire and gently turn it about the steering axis and there is a "notchy" feel to it with a quiet thunk. This means that the wheel, knuckle, ball joint, and tie rod all move about 2mm in sync (no play between these components), but the opposite side wheel does not move (of course not...it's still on the ground), and the steering wheel does not move. It's free play on that individual wheel. Doesn't matter which front wheel is off the ground..they both do it.
2. Steering shake at various speeds
3. A Mid frequency vibration during braking (not brake related...weight transfer related) with a sort of grinding sound that can be heard and also felt in the floor/pedals/steering wheel.
4. Semi squirly over rutted or uneven asphalt. It's like one wheel suddenly pulls the car its direction. Steering wheel turns in this situation, too. Not hard to control...just a bit annoying.

So, my thought is a crack in the rack allowing for 1-2mm of separation between the 2 halves of the rack. However, I don't know if this would cause the other road noise/vibrations issues or not. All help is, as always, greatly appreciated!!

Mat

[alia176]

I'll take a stab at this..

I had a little wandering on my steering, even with a newly rebuilt rack and pinion unit. After doing the front sway bar bushings yesterday, my steering has noticeably improved. The slop in the steering reduced as well.

As far as the mid freq vibrations, aside from your steering slop contributing to this, check your rim for trueness. I have hops in all of my wheels and I have vibes at speeds above 45mph.

Have you checked the tie rod ends to see if they're sloppy?

Good luck.

Ali

[Budfreak]

Try checking the little cv like joints on your steering shaft between your firewall and your rack. Mine are shot and i have like an inch or more of freeplay in my steering wheel and the steering is kinda weird when going down the road. Just a shot. Good luck.

[SVX10]

Thanks guys. I'll check into it. I already have the aftermarket front sway bar bushings. The vibs could very well be rim trueness. Just get that checked at a tire shop?

Mat

[drivemusicnow]

Hey Mat

I have a slightly similar condition that I've diagnosed to be my tie rods.

The "non stable" feeling over rough pavement was what really seems to indicate them, at least in my case as the tie rod "toe" adjustment nut is stuck (probably bent)

I would think you should get an alignment done, or at the very least have it checked. I think at least some of that condition comes from too much toe in.

Thats all I've got. (I don't think wheel irregularities would cause all of that)

[SVXRide]

how many miles are on your tires? even if your rims are true, you might have a belt separation issue with the tires. I agree with the suggestion to get a good alignment done. The "clunk" when rotating the tire isn't unusual.
-Bill

[msvx95]

I used to have the steering wheel shudder at all speeds and the wheel would wobble ever so slightly left to right at slow speeds......After getting new tires and a 4 wheel alignment, all is just perfect now. Also I had a bent rim according to my local wheel installer which probably caused most of the shudder.

[SVX10]

Originally Posted by SVXRide

how many miles are on your tires? even if your rims are true, you might have a belt separation issue with the tires. I agree with the suggestion to get a good alignment done. The "clunk" when rotating the tire isn't unusual.
-Bill

Bringing this thread back from the dead after a waste of time trip to the shop today. Guy told me everything was "tight" and "in spec", eventually admitting that he hadn't actually measured anything objectively *rolleyes* Then he gave me attitude about the specific questions I was asking.

So, my main concern is the free play in the steering. My preconceived notion is that when a front wheel turns, the steering wheel and opposite side wheel should turn the same amount. I should not have this few mm of free play where one wheel can turn without affecting the steering wheel or opposite side wheel. Is that not accurate? My concern is that while I'm driving, I'm holding the steering wheel straight, but the front wheels are able to freely vibrate back and forth through that few mm of slop. Basically, that means my toe alignment is constatly changing, and, therefore, probably not in spec. Furthermore, this is causing my tires to wear poorly...I've had tire wear problems for a long time now despite 3+ alignments.

If I turn a wheel and the opposite side wheel turns, but not the steering wheel, probably something in the steering column?

If I turn a wheel and the steering wheel turns, but not the opposite side wheel, probably something in the tie rod ends or rack?

Are these conclusions at all accurate? Am I worrying about nothing?

Please help me out

Mat

[oab_au]

Yes there is something wrong with the steering.
Useing some logic, if the right wheel is in the air and the left is on the ground, and you wobble the right wheel, and the steering wheel does not move, the play has to be in either, the tie rod end or the ball joint on the end of the rack, on the right hand side.
If you do this and the steering wheel moves, it is the tie rod end or the rack ball joint on the left hand side, has to be one of them.

The tie rod ends are an easy replace, the rack ball joints can be adjusted to remove the play, they are under the rubber bellows. Yes you need to fix it, to prevent tyre wear or an accident , as soon as possible.

Harvey.

[Hocrest]

I had a similiar problem... it turned out to be the brackets that hold the steering rack to the crossmember, 3 of the 4 bolts were loose, the 4th was missing :-O

There are bushings between the brackets and rack also, the brackets may be tight, but the bushings are worn??? Get the car on some ramps and take a look.

[SVX10]

Fantastic info guys! Thanks a ton. I'll check these out ASAP.

Harvey,
How are the ball joints adjusted? Should I take it to a shop and have them check those out, or can I do it on my own? How do I check the tie rod ends?

Hocrest,
Thanks. I'll check the bushings.

Thanks again. This forum is more reliable than going to a mechanic!!

Mat

[blue thunder]

I'll just jump into this thread since my current problems are probably related. I just had a brand new rack installed and the problem with steering still exists. With the car in the air and having someone turn the wheel there is a strong squeaking, scraping noise coming from the linkage between the firewall and the rack itself. There is like a gasket around the biggest diameter linkage area where the arms come together in a joint that the noise is coming from. Has anyone replaced this and what is the part called. Also could this cause binding and stiffness in the steering masking a rack problem. One more thing. Since Subaru apparently misdiagnosed my problem and swapped out a probably good rack could I get compensation for this error. Has anyone pursued this. Thanks for the help.


Mike

[SVX10]

I would guess that Subaru will be a pain to deal with. I doubt they'll re-compensate at all. Did they offer you the opportunity to keep your old parts? They always do that for me and I would guess that's how they cover their back in case they mis-diagnose and replace a perfectly good part. Let us know how that turns out if you pursue it.

[blue thunder]

I'm going to call Subaru of America monday and see what they have to say before haggling with my local dealer. I still have to take it in Mon.(scheduled) so they can try and correctly diagnose the real problem and they haven't offered anything to fix it for free or anything. I should have confronted them directly today but in the short time I had couldn't figure how to handle it. I won't take it in until we reach some sort of compromise. Small claims is another option. This whole thing has cost me close to $900.00 dollars and the steering is worse than before.

Mike

[SVX10]

Well, I finally found a competent shop that actually looked at my steering system (instead of just driving and "feeling" for play). Turns out it's my inner tie rod ends are worn.

So, how hard are these to replace? Anybody ever done it?

Mat