Turbo options?

[Jade Dragon]

the reason i went with such small turbos is that i would be doing 10 lbs Max. For starting i will probably be around 5. That and i wanted something that would be spining at idle, not necissarily making boost becuae of gate & valve controll. Im gonna be doing some testing with the turbos as well, seeing how much they restrict to set up my exhaust plan.

[XT6Wagon]

but see the problem is they are too small. you CAN'T just toss any old turbo on and have it work even if its small.

As I said the FXT is a clear example of a slightly too small turbo. Subaru had to do extensive tuning just to keep the turbo from blowing the engine up. The LARGER VF39 is much safer and has much less exotic tuning to make it work with the same engine.

I'm telling you the turbos you are using are boarderline too small for the engine they were on, and the SVX will run two of them harder than the EA82T did for one.

Just one of your issues will be extreme contamination of the air/fuel mixture by exhaust gasses. Misfires, phantom knock, etc will plague your experience as will low power output and high stress on the engine.

[Jade Dragon]

Well, what turbos would you recomend. I want them to spool fast, i dont need big boost.

[XT6Wagon]

Twin twinscroll turbos don't really work or I'd be advising two turbos off the 2005+ Legacy 2.0GT automatic. Smaller but good.

I'm not to up on the older turbos, but I think the VF28 or something was the smallest of the BB stock JDM ballbearing turbos.

Twin VF39's would work, but getting a bit large.

Twin stock WRX turbos won't spool that early but are nearly free if you look in the right places. Better VF series turbos will bolt in easy.

An interesting choice but going to be hard to find is the IHI turbo off a Probe/mazdaMX6 turbo from the late 80's, but again I don't like small turbos off old cars for alot of reasons.

Vary Rare, but possibly good is 87-88 Tbird turbos. Its a IHI on a T3 flange. Its smaller than the garrets on the other 2.3L SOHC fords, but makes more stock HP. Going to be a bit large, but you have huge range of upgrade options from here. Also dunno where you plan to put two turbos, but might be too large in physical size too.

On the new front, There is some newer turbos in the size range you want from Garrett that are good. Problem is that even if you manage to get them at wholesale they tend to be $500+ each new.

And as someone said there is the DSM turbos. I dunno what those are like so...

[longassname]

HA! Where? Maybe a chinese redux with some old garrett housings.

[QUOTE=XT6Wagon]
On the new front, There is some newer turbos in the size range you want from Garrett that are good. Problem is that even if you manage to get them at wholesale they tend to be $500+ each new.
QUOTE]

[longassname]

for twins:
GT2560R - 466541- 4

Don't even bother with the turbos till you build your engine though.

Originally Posted by Jade Dragon

Well, what turbos would you recomend. I want them to spool fast, i dont need big boost.

[longassname]

if you want more than 12ish lbs then the gt2560r 707160-10
but garrett isn't currently listing it so it may not be easily getable

[XT6Wagon]

yah a couple of the Garretts in GT25 class were insane for thier compressor maps. Course I use paper worth more than garretts published compressor maps every time I spend some "quality time" with a magazine in the bathroom. Been so long since I messed with those turbos and looked in garretts cat. that I wasn't sure enough to say more.

When I got them, the GT25's were very inexpensive if you got them wholesale. My biggest problem is I'd really like a T3 flange on whatever turbo is used for twins on a motor of this size. T25 flanges make me cry.

I also laugh at the people with GT30R and GT35R... garrett itself makes better turbos, spool quicker, make more power, and have lower stress on the engine. The 30 and 35R are usualy coupled with a way too small hot side and need to be pushed super hard to get the dyno numbers the kiddies want.

Meanwhile shopping in the twinscroll diesel section you get excelent compressors, correct sized hotsides (usualy), and tough turbos. Just ah, don't run 1600F EGT's into the turbine inlet unless you like replacing turbos.

All that said, Turbo "kits" when done right is HUGE money, and might as well build the motor as its only a few hundred $$ between a correct 300whp kit and a correct 600WHP kit when starting from scratch.

[Phast SVX]

Originally Posted by XT6Wagon

yah a couple of the Garretts in GT25 class were insane for thier compressor maps. Course I use paper worth more than garretts published compressor maps every time I spend some "quality time" with a magazine in the bathroom. Been so long since I messed with those turbos and looked in garretts cat. that I wasn't sure enough to say more.

When I got them, the GT25's were very inexpensive if you got them wholesale. My biggest problem is I'd really like a T3 flange on whatever turbo is used for twins on a motor of this size. T25 flanges make me cry.

I also laugh at the people with GT30R and GT35R... garrett itself makes better turbos, spool quicker, make more power, and have lower stress on the engine. The 30 and 35R are usualy coupled with a way too small hot side and need to be pushed super hard to get the dyno numbers the kiddies want.

Meanwhile shopping in the twinscroll diesel section you get excelent compressors, correct sized hotsides (usualy), and tough turbos. Just ah, don't run 1600F EGT's into the turbine inlet unless you like replacing turbos.

All that said, Turbo "kits" when done right is HUGE money, and might as well build the motor as its only a few hundred $$ between a correct 300whp kit and a correct 600WHP kit when starting from scratch.

I will agree with you in some areas, and disagree in others...


the 35R is a versatile product, and it does get used quite often incorrectly But you have to be kidding me, turbos are one of the biggset misunderstood items in the import world and I would lay blame accross 99% of turbocharged aftermarket kits/one off's out there. Equally as important to spool, and more commonly ignored when designing a kit, is the header design to how the system spools.

I would consider the 35r82 -1.06 to probably be the best single unit to fit on a street performance SVX on mid boost. Lan has come to the same conclusion. your only tiff could be weather the .82 or 1.06 hotside is proper. Trial and error must be done to determine that, unless your are einstein or a rocket scienetist and then no doubt you would not be trying to size a turbo on an svx.

I do not understand what you mean by garret making "better" turbos... 360 deg bb cartridges will give you the best spool possible, unless you are talking about VAT's or something rediculous like that. Its all up to the requirements of the system, more importantly the budget, as to weather it fits into your relm. I did not build my motor, and the car runs well even with my small .63 hotside hybrid. My header is properly sized, even if on the large side, and more importantly i have a good quality 38mm Tial wastgate at a proper angle in the convergence of my headers 2-1. Infact, the same design of my header is used on the Rigoli 7s drage car(yes, they use a 3-2-1 design with the stock headers off the engine as i do, only in the front feeding a Gt55)

Eitherway, saying that a proper kit costs x amount of money is rediculous. I have a complete Stainless 304, tig welded kit (including intercooler piping) made to handle the wisconsin winter and i spent less then $3M on everything. I cut costs in areas where you can, and I spent the money on the controls of the system, that will dictate wether my engine starts tomorrow. It just means you are going to have to learn how to do some things yourself, as well as seek out the help of other enthusiasts.

[XT6Wagon]

Originally Posted by Phast SVX

I will agree with you in some areas, and disagree in others...


the 35R is a versatile product, and it does get used quite often incorrectly But you have to be kidding me, turbos are one of the biggset misunderstood items in the import world and I would lay blame accross 99% of turbocharged aftermarket kits/one off's out there. Equally as important to spool, and more commonly ignored when designing a kit, is the header design to how the system spools.

I would consider the 35r82 -1.06 to probably be the best single unit to fit on a street performance SVX on mid boost. Lan has come to the same conclusion. your only tiff could be weather the .82 or 1.06 hotside is proper. Trial and error must be done to determine that, unless your are einstein or a rocket scienetist and then no doubt you would not be trying to size a turbo on an svx.

I do not understand what you mean by garret making "better" turbos... 360 deg bb cartridges will give you the best spool possible, unless you are talking about VAT's or something rediculous like that. Its all up to the requirements of the system, more importantly the budget, as to weather it fits into your relm. I did not build my motor, and the car runs well even with my small .63 hotside hybrid. My header is properly sized, even if on the large side, and more importantly i have a good quality 38mm Tial wastgate at a proper angle in the convergence of my headers 2-1. Infact, the same design of my header is used on the Rigoli 7s drage car(yes, they use a 3-2-1 design with the stock headers off the engine as i do, only in the front feeding a Gt55)

Eitherway, saying that a proper kit costs x amount of money is rediculous. I have a complete Stainless 304, tig welded kit (including intercooler piping) made to handle the wisconsin winter and i spent less then $3M on everything. I cut costs in areas where you can, and I spent the money on the controls of the system, that will dictate wether my engine starts tomorrow. It just means you are going to have to learn how to do some things yourself, as well as seek out the help of other enthusiasts.

Many GT35R I've seen use the GT30R hotside... with low AR. I'll agree that the 1.06 hotside on a proprer GT35R is a very good combo.. A certain company in Austrailia has done things as silly as put a GT35R into a stock IHI turbine housing. Needless to say while the dynonumbers are not bad, the drivablity is. Spools super late, powerband is very narrow, and ultra sensitive to tuning/knock issues. Put on a true GT35R and it spools far quicker and has a lovely powerband. Even the 1.06 housing spools quicker.

And I don't see how you disagree with me on a good kit costs a certan ammount of money. There is simply the parts you must have to do it right, and if you start from scratch the parts to build a proper turbo kit with a GT35R is going to be no different than a GT30R. Or nearly any other turbo you can name. Sure there is going to be some varience, but by and large a set of 6 720cc.min injectors costs the same as a set of 550. A large tial wastegate costs just a hair more than thier smaller ones. etc. Engine management is enginemanagement, you will need it for both. All I am saying is that for a given set of sources, a good kit is going to cost nearly the same regardless of power (to a point, excluding building the motor). So a junkyard 300HP kit when done right isn't going to be much different in cost than a 400 or 500HP kit. Now its true you can cut alot of corners at lower HP, but I think most know the more corners you cut to start with, the more you spend fixing stuff later.

Now I take your point that you spent a bit more than many people would to get materials that resist your climate. Which to me is only a proper thing to do. I would advise someone in AZ to spend more on intercooling and or waterinjection than someone in Seattle.

[longassname]

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I get the difference in perceptions now...
the talk about the wrong hot sides and saying gt35r instead of gt3582r makes it all clear

when xt6 says gt35r or $500 gt2560r he means those turbos people try to sell with names like the garretts.

When phil says gt3582r he means the real deal straight from garrett which obviously comes with the correct hot side for the turbo. Correct hot side for your application? Well the turbine is what it is but choosing the right ar, that's up to you. For the eg33 I'd go straight for the 1.06 but you'd probably do fine with the 0.82 too if you want earlier spool and less top end.

[XT6Wagon]

LAN, no, I meant people who would order real garretts in really bad configurations.

Its been getting alot better than the old days of AVO500's and APS POS turbos which had real garrett cores stuffed in worthless small housings.

Other cars had turbo kits made with off the shelf GT35R's compressors mated to GT30R hotsides. I think one went so far as to merge a 35R compressor with a 28RS hotside.

Might try giving the GT40R a look. I don't know that garret has formalized the designation to a single turbo instead of the 3 or 4 different ones that people would order from garrett and call a GT40R. Most I saw was a compressor slightly bigger than the GT35R and a twinscroll hotside.

I've never bought nor used a turbo from china at this time.

[XT6Wagon]

BTW, ATPTurbo.com is where I got a good many turbos back when I was sourcing parts for turbokits.

[Phast SVX]

I am confused. A GT35R is a Duel ball bearing series T3/T04S turbocharger offered by garret, with a standard T04 S Trim housing with any of the offered turbine housings, T3 flanged. Its a series of turbochargers yes, but i do not know how a dismembered Ball bearing turbocharger with differnt housings mated to it is a GT35R by anyones gauge, its just a hybrid duel BB unit.

[Nomad]

I was reading and wondered : Is 12psi super charge same power of 12psi turbo ? But , only turbo offers intercooled option ?