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  #46  
Old 03-28-2009, 09:28 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

John,
I don't think the question was "is an underdrive pulley necessary", but "will this alternator help out since I have an underdrive pulley?" I believe the answer is "yes"
-Bill
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  #47  
Old 03-28-2009, 09:30 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

yaaa , sorry for my bad english ! Bill is right and my questions are fully answered !! Thanx !
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  #48  
Old 03-28-2009, 10:04 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
Tom,

Yes have a look, the set up is b--- awful. Voltage sensing is combined with other circuits and the only protection for same is the fuse link. Surely a separate sensing conductor should be provided, protected by a properly rated fuse and supplied from the battery side of the positive bus bar. This could well form part of any upgrade.

Trevor.
You are correct sir. I just had the manual opened. Would you think adding a properly rated fuse from the batt. to the vehicle-side circuits would make due? Thats my thought at least

Tom
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  #49  
Old 03-28-2009, 10:16 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Trevor,

I would be interested in this also.

The car has been performing flawlessly all week, but if you have any suggestions of what wires, fuses to add and where, That would be very helpful.

Anything that would protect this new configuration I would definitely consider...


The other thing that could be done is to take the two white wires that are now connected at the battery and splice them into one 8 gauge wire. Run this wire back, under the manifold, to its original connection at the alternator. Connect it from the opposite side of the alternator post. It would still be protected with sleeving as the others.


Now the circuit is exactly as it was originally, with all safety fusing intact.



.
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File Type: jpg Alternator post 2.jpg (145.1 KB, 588 views)
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JFICX8659TH100216.....Date of Manufacture: November 16, 1995.....
Fuji Heavy Industries..Ōta North Plant....Ōta City,. Gunma Prefecture, Japan

In-Service Date: January 2, 1997



"The Pristine Green Polo Machine”
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First Clear front turn signals, JDM Alcyone hood emblem, rear panel, and BOXER engine cover on the Network (US) (2000)
First 5000K HID factory fog lights (2007)
First SVX JDM BBS wheels on a USDM SVX (2013)

HID lighting (5000K) for headlight and H3 fog lights, PIAA SuperExtreme 120W high beams, rebuilt EG33 longblock, Cometic head gaskets, Phase II flexplate, AMR aluminum radiator with custom silicone hoses, 160A high-output alternator in aluminum-ceramic coated case, new design alternator wiring upgrade v.4, rare factory headlight protectors, refinished JDM BBS mesh aluminum wheels and custom, polished billet aluminum new hex center caps, LED grille mod, R1 Concepts high-carbon cryo slotted rotors, Akebono ceramic pads, Goodridge S/S braided brake lines, Smallcar Stage 1 shift kit, ThermalTech aluminum/ceramic-coated valve covers, Energy Suspension urethane front & rear swaybar bushings, Bontrager22 rear swaybar with QS Components Chromoly Teflon/Kevlar endlinks, "$15.00/5 minute" suspension mod. Hella Supertone horns, Custom stainless steel exhaust system with 2" headpipes, Magnaflow cats, AeroTurbine AR25 resonator /AWD "Bullet" muffler.


R.I.P. 2010 Subaru Outback Limited 2.5 CVT...338,000 miles. Totaled by a 1,300 lb. COW March 4, 2016

2014 Hyundai Avante Limited ...178,000 miles. Actually quieter and smoother than the Outback

2007 Mazda Miata MX-5 PRHT...102,000 miles.
Plenty of parts, service and windshields.


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Last edited by svxcess; 03-31-2009 at 09:41 PM.
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  #50  
Old 03-28-2009, 10:30 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

John, as long as the regulator is working as it should you will not see any issues. Trevor's point is that in the event that it fails your electrical system is at risk more so than with the stock wiring

Tom
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  #51  
Old 03-28-2009, 11:26 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Dunno if it's needed at this point, but it should clear up any confusion on what got bypassed:

Red shows the stock path from the alternator to the battery. The link "FL 1.5" got dropped in this procedure.

On a normal day, yeh, it'll be fine. As stated though, if your regulator craps out, it'll be bad times for one clean machine.
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  #52  
Old 03-28-2009, 11:35 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Okay, so here's the quiz for the day....."why are there two while wires coming from the alternator?" Clock is running, answer quickly!
-Bill
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  #53  
Old 03-28-2009, 02:14 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by SVXRide View Post
Okay, so here's the quiz for the day....."why are there two while wires coming from the alternator?" Clock is running, answer quickly!
-Bill
Because unlike some systems Subaru didn't feel the need for 3!

When are you gonna come fix my K-jetronic fuel injection. I'm guessing you use a similar system on your space flights right?
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  #54  
Old 03-28-2009, 03:30 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by SVXRide View Post
Okay, so here's the quiz for the day....."why are there two while wires coming from the alternator?" Clock is running, answer quickly!
-Bill
Bill,

Judging by the apparent differences between the wiring diagram and the actual wiring, it would appear that there was a mix up between Subaru and the makers of the electrical harness. Whatever, the outcome is not the best.

However automobile electrics are renowned for illogical arrangements and the positioning of components. It would appear that the electrical engineers are last in the pecking order, when a new design is being prepared.

I will set out what I consider the best arrangement shortly.

P.S. A birthday party for a great grandchild intervenes.

Trevor.
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Last edited by Trevor; 03-28-2009 at 03:51 PM. Reason: P.S.
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  #55  
Old 03-28-2009, 04:43 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by LetItSnow View Post
Dunno if it's needed at this point, but it should clear up any confusion on what got bypassed:

Red shows the stock path from the alternator to the battery. The link "FL 1.5" got dropped in this procedure.

On a normal day, yeh, it'll be fine. As stated though, if your regulator craps out, it'll be bad times for one clean machine.
How many amps is FL 1.5 rated for ?
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  #56  
Old 03-29-2009, 04:43 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by processengr View Post
How many amps is FL 1.5 rated for ?
Refer wiring diagram marked in red.

N.B. The discussion covers a connection direct to the battery from all three alternator terminals, All the wiring labelled “white” except the main wire to terminal 2, is bypassed. As a result the fuse link is bypassed and is completely ineffective. The main heavy lead as has been proposed, is connected directly to the battery via an inline fuse.

A circuit will exist between all terminals on the alternator, four distribution fuse links and the battery. A parallel circuit has been established across the fuse link, making it useless. This is a classic example of creating a sneak circuit.

Originally the alternator, as well as fused circuits SBF - 3, 4 , 5 and SBF - 6, were protected by the fusible link.

From what has been reported the wiring diagram does not correctly indicate the actual position of connections as they in fact exist. It all smells of a cock up between Subaru Engineers and loom suppliers with the draughtsman having to guess.

The rating of the fusible link was sorted out some time ago, but I can’t recall the exact figure. If I remember right, the figure !.5 indicates a wire gauge/thickness. Alternative sources of supply were being sort at the time. Do a search, it’s all there somewhere.
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  #57  
Old 03-29-2009, 08:08 AM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Trevor,

First of all, let me thank you for all of your input and guidance on my alternator configuration; it is very much appreciated. I must admit that have received much more concerns and caveats that I had expected.

I had found evidence of arcing at the alternator from a loose connection. When I removed the two original white wires from the plastic channel, I found that the casings had cracked and split in many places, allowing moisture to get in and corrosion to develop; the copper strands had oxidized a bright blue-green. It was then that I deceided to replace them the way I did.

The car is running perfectly with no odd electrical symptoms. The sneak circuit I inadvertantly created seems to be doing nothing strange so far.

However in the interests of true safety and piece of mind, I may make a small reconfiguration.

I would take the two white alternator wires (which were shortened and attached directly to the battery) and splice them into one larger 8 gauge wire. I would them run them back to the alternator under the manifold and reconnect them to their original connection point on the alternator from the opposite side.

The electrical circuit would be exactly the same as the original circuit, with the alternator wiring upgrade and inline fuse.


If you have another alternative for this, I would welcome your suggestion. Would adding a fuse into the circuit between the two white wires and the battery be sufficient?

Thanks again. I am so glad that you are back at times like these.

John

.
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1996 Polo Green LSi #216..138,100 miles...SOLD

JFICX8659TH100216.....Date of Manufacture: November 16, 1995.....
Fuji Heavy Industries..Ōta North Plant....Ōta City,. Gunma Prefecture, Japan

In-Service Date: January 2, 1997



"The Pristine Green Polo Machine”
First Polo Green on the Network
First Clear front turn signals, JDM Alcyone hood emblem, rear panel, and BOXER engine cover on the Network (US) (2000)
First 5000K HID factory fog lights (2007)
First SVX JDM BBS wheels on a USDM SVX (2013)

HID lighting (5000K) for headlight and H3 fog lights, PIAA SuperExtreme 120W high beams, rebuilt EG33 longblock, Cometic head gaskets, Phase II flexplate, AMR aluminum radiator with custom silicone hoses, 160A high-output alternator in aluminum-ceramic coated case, new design alternator wiring upgrade v.4, rare factory headlight protectors, refinished JDM BBS mesh aluminum wheels and custom, polished billet aluminum new hex center caps, LED grille mod, R1 Concepts high-carbon cryo slotted rotors, Akebono ceramic pads, Goodridge S/S braided brake lines, Smallcar Stage 1 shift kit, ThermalTech aluminum/ceramic-coated valve covers, Energy Suspension urethane front & rear swaybar bushings, Bontrager22 rear swaybar with QS Components Chromoly Teflon/Kevlar endlinks, "$15.00/5 minute" suspension mod. Hella Supertone horns, Custom stainless steel exhaust system with 2" headpipes, Magnaflow cats, AeroTurbine AR25 resonator /AWD "Bullet" muffler.


R.I.P. 2010 Subaru Outback Limited 2.5 CVT...338,000 miles. Totaled by a 1,300 lb. COW March 4, 2016

2014 Hyundai Avante Limited ...178,000 miles. Actually quieter and smoother than the Outback

2007 Mazda Miata MX-5 PRHT...102,000 miles.
Plenty of parts, service and windshields.


4th Registered Network member —2/21/2001

My NEW locker..I...My Email..I..Wikipedia/SVX .

.
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  #58  
Old 03-29-2009, 05:40 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

Quote:
Originally Posted by svxcess View Post
Trevor,

First of all, let me thank you for all of your input and guidance on my alternator configuration; it is very much appreciated. I must admit that have received much more concerns and caveats that I had expected.

I had found evidence of arcing at the alternator from a loose connection. When I removed the two original white wires from the plastic channel, I found that the casings had cracked and split in many places, allowing moisture to get in and corrosion to develop; the copper strands had oxidized a bright blue-green. It was then that I deceided to replace them the way I did.

The car is running perfectly with no odd electrical symptoms. The sneak circuit I inadvertantly created seems to be doing nothing strange so far.



However in the interests of true safety and piece of mind, I may make a small reconfiguration.

I would take the two white alternator wires (which were shortened and attached directly to the battery) and splice them into one larger 8 gauge wire. I would them run them back to the alternator under the manifold and reconnect them to their original connection point on the alternator from the opposite side.

The electrical circuit would be exactly the same as the original circuit, with the alternator wiring upgrade and inline fuse.


If you have another alternative for this, I would welcome your suggestion. Would adding a fuse into the circuit between the two white wires and the battery be sufficient?

Thanks again. I am so glad that you are back at times like these.

John

.

Good one John.

Our problem is that the wiring diagram, as has now been kindly published within the thread, does not appear to coincide with the actual car wiring, particularly in regard to junction points.

Your first post contained the following statement which is difficult to understand:-

Looking inside the original black plastic wiring channel that runs along the rear of the A/C compressor and alternator you will find two white wires that attach to the alternator charging post. One of these goes back to the battery through a fusible link (Via fuse box terminal No. 1.) and the other goes to one side of the ignition switch. (Via fuse box terminal No. 2, and a separate fused circuit.) Using a multi meter, I found that the two white wires have approximately the same voltage at the alternator connection as is measured at the battery.

I removed the two white wires and cut them back about two feet. One of these wires was factory-spliced into three (???) wires close to the battery.

One wire from the alternator spliced into two makes more sense. You could be referring to the resulting three wires in total, joining at the connection.

On this basis I would analyse that one wire is spliced into two close to the battery, and in fact one of these two (The battery through a fusible link.) is routed to fuse box terminal No. 1 and SBF holder terminal No. 2. The second wire (Ultimately, one side of the ignition switch.) is routed to fuse box terminal No. 2. Refer also my inserts within your text.

It can only be assumed that the diagram is in error and what I have described is the actual original set up. My car is a JDM so that I can not use it as a reliable match with yours, therefore I must ask you to confirm all is as I say.

At that point I can advise regarding your very best arrangement. Meantime all circuits are connected and the problem is confined to fusing and is purely a safety issue.

It would seem that you have endeavoured to identify the wiring by means of voltage testing, which can provide confusing results due to parallel circuits and will certainly have made things difficult for you.

After becoming involved in this lengthy and confusing topic, I have second thoughts regarding returning to the site!
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  #59  
Old 03-29-2009, 08:31 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

John, given the nature of the FSM's wiring diagram, could you post up pictures of what we're working with on your car (yeah, I'm too lazy to go out and pop the hood on one of my SVXes )
-Bill
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  #60  
Old 03-29-2009, 09:48 PM
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Re: New Alternator Wiring Upgrade Configuration

If I decide to go back to the original configuration as I described here:

I would take the two white alternator wires (which were disconnected from the alternator, shortened and attached directly to the battery) and splice them into one larger 8 gauge wire. I would them run them back to the alternator under the manifold and reconnect them to their original connection point on the alternator from the opposite side.

The electrical circuit would be exactly the same as the original circuit as designed, but with the alternator wiring upgrade and inline fuse.


I am fairly certain that when I pulled the rubber sheathing/insulation off of the two white wires, one was intact and just needed to be cut and a ring terminal attached.

I am sure the other white wire had a factory splice of three wires into one, but I could have been mistaken. maybe svxfiles can shed some further light on this. WE decided not to mess with it since it was factory and seemed fairly secure.

If I take it apart again to do the above configuration I will make sure how many and take photos.

.
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Subaru Ambassador

1996 Polo Green LSi #216..138,100 miles...SOLD

JFICX8659TH100216.....Date of Manufacture: November 16, 1995.....
Fuji Heavy Industries..Ōta North Plant....Ōta City,. Gunma Prefecture, Japan

In-Service Date: January 2, 1997



"The Pristine Green Polo Machine”
First Polo Green on the Network
First Clear front turn signals, JDM Alcyone hood emblem, rear panel, and BOXER engine cover on the Network (US) (2000)
First 5000K HID factory fog lights (2007)
First SVX JDM BBS wheels on a USDM SVX (2013)

HID lighting (5000K) for headlight and H3 fog lights, PIAA SuperExtreme 120W high beams, rebuilt EG33 longblock, Cometic head gaskets, Phase II flexplate, AMR aluminum radiator with custom silicone hoses, 160A high-output alternator in aluminum-ceramic coated case, new design alternator wiring upgrade v.4, rare factory headlight protectors, refinished JDM BBS mesh aluminum wheels and custom, polished billet aluminum new hex center caps, LED grille mod, R1 Concepts high-carbon cryo slotted rotors, Akebono ceramic pads, Goodridge S/S braided brake lines, Smallcar Stage 1 shift kit, ThermalTech aluminum/ceramic-coated valve covers, Energy Suspension urethane front & rear swaybar bushings, Bontrager22 rear swaybar with QS Components Chromoly Teflon/Kevlar endlinks, "$15.00/5 minute" suspension mod. Hella Supertone horns, Custom stainless steel exhaust system with 2" headpipes, Magnaflow cats, AeroTurbine AR25 resonator /AWD "Bullet" muffler.


R.I.P. 2010 Subaru Outback Limited 2.5 CVT...338,000 miles. Totaled by a 1,300 lb. COW March 4, 2016

2014 Hyundai Avante Limited ...178,000 miles. Actually quieter and smoother than the Outback

2007 Mazda Miata MX-5 PRHT...102,000 miles.
Plenty of parts, service and windshields.


4th Registered Network member —2/21/2001

My NEW locker..I...My Email..I..Wikipedia/SVX .

.
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