What's "Liberal" and "Liberalism"?

Originally Posted by TheRightWingSVX

Liberalism is a world view and not just a political leaning. It is a mental disorder as Michael Savage has brilliantly pointed out in his book "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder". You see this disorder causes a person to be negative about anything positive and positive about anything negative. So you are right Republican and Democrat does not enter into the discussion because it is a persons entire world view that is the real issue.

originally post #87 in thread: BioPerformance Fuel Pills....and powder..


Oh, my.... someone is trying to re-write the dictionary!

I tutor English as a second language, and often get asked to define words. It is very frustrating when people completely change the meaning of words so this is just to set the record straight.
(taken from http://dictionary.reference.com/ )

liberal (adj.) [Middle English, generous, from Old French, from Latin lberlis, from lber, free. See leudh- in Indo-European Roots.]

1.
a) Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
b) Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
c) Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
d) Liberal Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.
2.
a) Tending to give freely; generous: a liberal benefactor.
b) Generous in amount; ample: a liberal serving of potatoes.
3. Not strict or literal; loose or approximate: a liberal translation.
4. Of, relating to, or based on the traditional arts and sciences of a college or university curriculum: a liberal education.

synonym: progressive
antonym: conservative

liberalism (noun)

1. The state or quality of being liberal.
2.
a) A political theory founded on the natural goodness of humans and the autonomy of the individual and favoring civil and political liberties, government by law with the consent of the governed, and protection from arbitrary authority.
b) often Liberalism The tenets or policies of a Liberal party.
3. An economic theory in favor of laissez-faire, the free market, and the gold standard.
4. Liberalism
a) A 19th-century Protestant movement that favored free intellectual inquiry, stressed the ethical and humanitarian content of Christianity, and de-emphasized dogmatic theology.
b) A 19th-century Roman Catholic movement that favored political democracy and ecclesiastical reform but was theologically orthodox.


Regarding Michael Alan Weiner a.k.a. Michael Savage, he is a brilliant opportunist who has finally after many years and several attempts figured out a path to fame and fortune. Perhaps you'd like to read some of his other books, too? He's published 20 that I know of, including:
Man's Useful Plants, New York: Macmillan. 1976.
Secrets of Fijian Medicine, Quantum Books, 1983.
The Complete Book of Homeopathy, Garden City Park, N.Y. : Avery Pub., 1989.
The Antioxidant Cookbook, Mill Valley, CA : Quantum Books, 1995.


I'm told the cookbook has a few interesting recipes.

[Electrophil]

Bipa, I really don't think therightwingsvx will venture down here. His only purpose on this forum is to sell moth ball pills. He has no other purpose, and only the opinions others have given him. That's why I haven't really been paying any attention to him.

I "do" feel he's going after the right market by calling himself rightwing. In the last few years they've shown themselves to be a little more gullible than the rest of us.

[Phast SVX]

Originally Posted by Electrophil

Bipa, I really don't think therightwingsvx will venture down here. His only purpose on this forum is to sell moth ball pills. He has no other purpose, and only the opinions others have given him. That's why I haven't really been paying any attention to him.

I "do" feel he's going after the right market by calling himself rightwing. In the last few years they've shown themselves to be a little more gullible than the rest of us.

and that would make you???

[Electrophil]

Originally Posted by Phast SVX

and that would make you???

Less gullible.

Originally Posted by Electrophil

Bipa, I really don't think therightwingsvx will venture down here. His only purpose on this forum is to sell moth ball pills. He has no other purpose, and only the opinions others have given him. That's why I haven't really been paying any attention to him.

I "do" feel he's going after the right market by calling himself rightwing. In the last few years they've shown themselves to be a little more gullible than the rest of us.

Well, I started writing my response "over there", and then realised that it was completely off topic. So I decided that instead of hijacking the thread, I'd just create a new thread in an appropriate area where I would not only be back on topic, but actually creating it as a new one.

If he chooses not to respond then it doesn't really matter. There's nothing new in the conservatives here being unable or unwilling to support broad sweeping statements they've made in the past. You're right, many of them are simply repeating what they've heard without really thinking about it. Easier to talk to a trained parrot sometimes. But I could say the same thing about people on the left side, too. It is us folks sitting on or near the middle that have the toughest situation, getting fired upon from both sides while having to defend positions that don't easily fit any simple definitions or labels.

Speaking of definitions, my Roget's New Millennium Thesaurus has the following listed as synonyms for "conservative": bourgeois, cautious, constant, controlled, conventional, die-hard, fearful, firm, fogyish, fuddy-duddy, guarded, hard hat, hidebound, holding to, illiberal, inflexible, middle-of-the-road, not extreme, obstinate, old guard, old-line, orthodox, quiet, red-neck, right, right-wing, sober, stable, steady, timid, traditional, traditionalistic, unchangeable, unchanging, uncreative, undaring, unimaginative, unprogressive, white bread.

I'm not sure I'd ever feel comfortable in labelling myself a conservative, even though I do hold quite a few traditional views. My left-leaning friends call me "bourgeois", my right-wingers feel I'm too avant-garde and pinkish. I usually end up just wanting to cry out "A plague o' both your houses!" -Mercutio from "Romeo and Juliet" (III, i, 94)


So I feel better just having posted the correct definitions. Of course, I could have gone on at great length about Mr. Weiner a.k.a. Michael Savage, and his various "natural cure" remedies and energy drinks that he's tried to sell over the years. I think my "favourite" of these is Rockstar. If you've never heard of it, you should definitely check it out!

It is marketed by Michael Weiner's son, Russell Goldencloud Weiner. Yup... I'm not kidding about that middle name.

If you don't feel like clicking on the Goldencloud link, then let me paste here some of what he has to say about his parents.

"From my earliest walking days, I remember exploring the jungles of the South Pacific on expeditions with my parents, who were on the search for native folk remedies. Over a fifteen year period, they explored the islands of Fiji, Tonga, Samoa, The Cook Islands, Tahiti, and the Marquesas Islands, in search of healing plant remedies used by local plant doctors. My parents spent years in these jungles finding secret remedies and elixirs used by these native plant doctors. At the end of their work, their published book, "Secrets of Fijian Medicine" was given as a gift to the people of Fiji, as a record of their verbal plant healing compendium, for the benefit of the Fijian peoples. "

That research in Fiji became the foundation for Michael Weiner's dissertation at Berkeley in 1978. I find it quite hilarious that his latest books and newest web site state that he has a degree in epidemiology while in fact it was in nutritional ethnomedicine. Call me old fashioned, but looks to me like he's lying. Perhaps the folks have re-defined that word, too.

[Phast SVX]

Originally Posted by Electrophil

Less gullible.

whatever helps you sleep at night buddy.

[Landshark]

i agree with Dr. Savage.

[Electrophil]

Originally Posted by Bipa

Well, I started writing my response "over there", and then realised that it was completely off topic. So I decided that instead of hijacking the thread, I'd just create a new thread in an appropriate area where I would not only be back on topic, but actually creating it as a new one.

If he chooses not to respond then it doesn't really matter. There's nothing new in the conservatives here being unable or unwilling to support broad sweeping statements they've made in the past. You're right, many of them are simply repeating what they've heard without really thinking about it. Easier to talk to a trained parrot sometimes. But I could say the same thing about people on the left side, too. It is us folks sitting on or near the middle that have the toughest situation, getting fired upon from both sides while having to defend positions that don't easily fit any simple definitions or labels.

Speaking of definitions, my Roget's New Millennium Thesaurus has the following listed as synonyms for "conservative": bourgeois, cautious, constant, controlled, conventional, die-hard, fearful, firm, fogyish, fuddy-duddy, guarded, hard hat, hidebound, holding to, illiberal, inflexible, middle-of-the-road, not extreme, obstinate, old guard, old-line, orthodox, quiet, red-neck, right, right-wing, sober, stable, steady, timid, traditional, traditionalistic, unchangeable, unchanging, uncreative, undaring, unimaginative, unprogressive, white bread.

I'm not sure I'd ever feel comfortable in labelling myself a conservative, even though I do hold quite a few traditional views. My left-leaning friends call me "bourgeois", my right-wingers feel I'm too avant-garde and pinkish. I usually end up just wanting to cry out "A plague o' both your houses!" -Mercutio from "Romeo and Juliet" (III, i, 94)


So I feel better just having posted the correct definitions. Of course, I could have gone on at great length about Mr. Weiner a.k.a. Michael Savage, and his various "natural cure" remedies and energy drinks that he's tried to sell over the years. I think my "favourite" of these is Rockstar. If you've never heard of it, you should definitely check it out!

It is marketed by Michael Weiner's son, Russell Goldencloud Weiner. Yup... I'm not kidding about that middle name.

If you don't feel like clicking on the Goldencloud link, then let me paste here some of what he has to say about his parents.

"From my earliest walking days, I remember exploring the jungles of the South Pacific on expeditions with my parents, who were on the search for native folk remedies. Over a fifteen year period, they explored the islands of Fiji, Tonga, Samoa, The Cook Islands, Tahiti, and the Marquesas Islands, in search of healing plant remedies used by local plant doctors. My parents spent years in these jungles finding secret remedies and elixirs used by these native plant doctors. At the end of their work, their published book, "Secrets of Fijian Medicine" was given as a gift to the people of Fiji, as a record of their verbal plant healing compendium, for the benefit of the Fijian peoples. "

That research in Fiji became the foundation for Michael Weiner's dissertation at Berkeley in 1978. I find it quite hilarious that his latest books and newest web site state that he has a degree in epidemiology while in fact it was in nutritional ethnomedicine. Call me old fashioned, but looks to me like he's lying. Perhaps the folks have re-defined that word, too.

I can't really identify myself with the stereotype of a liberal. I don't like trees, and I really don't care if they drill holes every 2 feet in alaska. I just don't like being lied to when I know it's a lie, and they know I know...but they still do it. Just because there was enough alarmists running around to support them. That's my beef right now. Bush should go to jail, and be the but-bunny for that deferment queen Cheney.

Actually, I'm moderate, but will accept the term liberal to get as far away from the neo-conservatism that has gotten us in this mess we are in.

[Nemesis Destiny]

Originally Posted by Landshark

i agree with Dr. Savage.

Ah, violence. The first, and often only resort of the conservatives to solve their problems.

[Electrophil]

Originally Posted by Nemesis Destiny

Ah, violence. The first, and often only resort of the conservatives to solve their problems.

It's a shame, but unfortunately true.

[Landshark]

Originally Posted by Nemesis Destiny

Ah, violence. The first, and often only resort of the conservatives to solve their problems.

you're right - let's just give the terrorists a hug and ask them to stop being mean.

"Forgetfulness occurs when those who have been long accustomed to civilized order can no longer remember a time in which they had to wonder whether their crops would grow to maturity without being stolen or their children sold into slavery by a victorious foe . . . They forget that in time of danger, in the face of the enemy, they must trust and confide in each other, or perish . . . They forget, in short, that there has ever been a category of human experience called the enemy."

grow complacent with your enemies, and your civilization falls. i recommend reading about something called history.

[Royal Tiger]

It was humor. The one trait no liberal has. Lighten up. Since Democrats in this country are fond of throwing around exagerated hyperbole, Hitler was seen as "liberal and progressive" in his reform of Germany during the intial rise in power, circa 1934, as stated by the uber-liberal himself, Neville Chamberlin. History is an intresting phenomenon.

[Electrophil]

And the cardinal all inclusive rule:

History is written by the victors.

My attitude is truly due to "not" forgetting, and my biggest gripe is Iraq.
The inspectors were allowed everywhere in Iraq but Saddam's private home. When he finally caved in and allowed that also, Bush was in between Iraq and a hard spot and said "Leave Iraq within 72 hours or we attack." It was all he had left. Saddam gave in to everything. We all remember that.

Those were Bush's last words, "72 hours" and as of 01 April, that was 2,331 comrades dead and 17,269 severely wounded ago.

Honestly, it's not that we can't remember. We just won't forget until someone is held accountable. It's not a liberal thing. It's justice. And it is coming.... accountability will happen as soon as his majority disappears in the congress. They haven't forgotten either, and are up there scrambling to save their jobs.

Afghanistan - Good thing! Well justified. Outstanding!

Energy costs - Highly suspicious with the companies making record profits since Bush came to office.

Tax cuts - Horrible mistake we now have to pay back with huge interest at twice the rate.

War in Iraq - Unjustifiable war crime that someone must be held as accountable for as if someone going next door and killing a neighbor cause he owns a gun.....which turns out... he didn't.

Honestly, I haven't forgotten a thing.

[Electrophil]

Afterthough: Isn't it funny we never mention the dead in Iraq? You'd think it was politically incorrect to bring it up. The official Civilian death count is 33,996 in Iraq as of 31 March 2006. How is that significant?

Saddam is on trial with execution predetermined for killing less than 300.

Total lost in WTC was 2,996, and we completely wipe out two world governments. Justifiably or not, we wiped them out.

What if we lost 33,996 over the course of 3 years?

As a 10 year old boy who has lost his whole family to american attacks, what will you be thinking 6 or 7 years from now?

Lets hope like all get out that "they" forget, or terrorism is going to be rampant like we've never imagined.

Thanks Bush! You drunkard!

[NapaBavarian]

Sounds like extremest liberalism that is being refered to, extremest anything is a disorder, don't bother to test your theorys, just come up with an idea and call it a fact!!! If you are unable to do this then steal someone elses idea and fight those who disagree with a stick till the death...science is over rated anyway!

OOps, reading too many biodiesel forums where some of the liberals think biodiesel is polution free

All things natraul are good...wait, dino oil is natraully occouring