The Smokies - literally.

Ron Mummert · #1 07-30-2002, 09:49 PM

As some of you know, I took the scenic route back from Indy, north through Michigan, through Ontario (eh?) & south through Vermont, back to Merry-land; about 2800 miles total. I threw gobs of money at the car prior to this trip to insure my safe return, which seemed to have worked, since I'm at home keyboarding, & not in some remote Ontario slammer for exceeding 62 MPH. I did encounter ONE problem that I'd like an educated guess or two upon.

Whilst motoring south along a fantastic Vermont scenic two-laner called 7A, just past the town of Manchester, I spotted the challange for the day. "Drive to the summit of MOUNT EQUINOX, the highest peak in the Taconic Range" Not that I'd ever heard of this range, but no matter, it was billed as 3800 feet, or so & I felt that I MUST go to the top of this thing, & spit downward. I paid the 6 buck fee, & started the climb. And what a climb it was! Jeez - this "hill" must have featured a 15% grade. I kept her in 2nd most of the way. The brochure said "Turn off A/C, use pull-offs to give brakes a break, water tanks at pull-offs are to be used to top off radiators, abandon hope all ye who dare to try this, etc." I got about a third of the way up, & pulled off at a parking area, got out & noticed the unmistakable scent of oil smoke. Then I noticed the unmistakable SIGHT of smoke wafting from under the car. Popped the hood - more smoke. I muttered an unkind comment. I sat there for 10 minutes with the engine off. Smoke cleared. Checked all hoses & dip sticks. Nothing amiss. Hey, I paid 6 bucks to do this & I ain't gonna wimp out now! I start the car & proceed upward again. I reach the 3320 foot mark, & pull over again, Smoke again! I look up. There's the summit quite a ways away. I look down. Beautiful view of a monastery & lake. I push button on camera. I say "high enough". Now let's weld the brakes to the rotors.

Oh - the question. From the time I gave up on the "hill", to the time I arrived home, some 400 miles later, I've had no oil leak problem. Part of the money application went to new cam seals. Is it possible to force oil out "somewhere" under extreme pressure, & then be "OK" under normal conditions? I'm using Mobile 1 10W-30. I noticed zero oil usage when I checked it back home. Tranny fluid looks & smells OK.
Coolent is normal & has never overheated.

Should I go back to the dealer who did the cam seals & whine?
Should I just wear a gas mask & try Pikes Peak?
Should I crack open the Chablis & forget the whole thing?

Thanks for bearing with me. Ron

Earthworm · #2 07-30-2002, 10:11 PM

I think you need to get a larger tranny cooler and temp gauge if you don't have one already and give it another shot

If the tranny fails you can always use the momentum going down to get you home

I don't think I'd want to even tackle the small hill in Duluth, MN again before installing a tranny cooler. My first step is to get a digital tranny temp gauge from dakotadigital.com to see the temps I'm running before I install the cooler.

vkykam · #3 07-30-2002, 10:51 PM

Ron,

I'd check the smell of your tranny fluid just in case. All that hill climbing can be an exercise for our trannies.

On the other hand, driving the Blue Ridge Parkway, me SVX went as high as 6500ft climbing them mountains, and no smoke. So there.

VK

Ron Mummert · #4 07-30-2002, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vkykam
Ron,

I'd check the smell of your tranny fluid just in case. All that hill climbing can be an exercise for our trannies.

On the other hand, driving the Blue Ridge Parkway, me SVX went as high as 6500ft climbing them mountains, and no smoke. So there.

VK

To get smoke I assume there must have oil/fluid oozing from somewhere and getting burned, probably on the exhaust system. I have a B & M cooler & have no slippage or other weird tranny stuff goin' on. Passed the sniff test. I suspect engine oil, but just wondered from where it could be oozing, since the cam seals were just replaced. VK - It isn't the height of the mountain, it's the grade percentage climbed to get there.

Ron.

huck369 · #5 07-31-2002, 05:32 AM

You said the tranny fluid looked and smelled OK, but did you check and smell the front diff grease? That could have gotten hot under the heavy continued load, or possibly you've got a bad axle boot that could have slung axle grease on the exhaust system.
Just some things to check.

#6 07-31-2002, 09:13 PM

Ron:
While there, did you see any info on the annual Vintage Car
hill climb, they have the first w/e in June? It's put on by the
VSCA (Veteran Sports Car Assn), and some incredible cars
(Blower Bentleys, Bugattis, C-Jags, Allards, MGs, etc.) from
the '20s - '60s storm up that hill on timed runs. You wouldn't
believe how fast some of those old critters do the course.

FWIW - on the smoke...I'd crack the Chablis. At the Vermont meet
a couple of years ago, one feature was a bit of a hill climb
and several cars evidenced similar smoke/smell at the top.
(Mine included, but my tranny's still fine 2 yrs later.)

Dan

Ron Mummert · #7 07-31-2002, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DWayne2910
Ron:
While there, did you see any info on the annual Vintage Car
hill climb, they have the first w/e in June? It's put on by the
VSCA (Veteran Sports Car Assn), and some incredible cars
(Blower Bentleys, Bugattis, C-Jags, Allards, MGs, etc.) from
the '20s - '60s storm up that hill on timed runs. You wouldn't
believe how fast some of those old critters do the course.

FWIW - on the smoke...I'd crack the Chablis. At the Vermont meet
a couple of years ago, one feature was a bit of a hill climb
and several cars evidenced similar smoke/smell at the top.
(Mine included, but my tranny's still fine 2 yrs later.)

Dan

Allards? MGs? Edsels? Thanks for boosting my ego, Dan. I saw no info on this event, but the toll house was being remodeled & there was nothing there but a cash register & an open palm.

So you think the smoke was tranny, or drivetrain related, rather than engine oil? Any more guesses from anyone?

Ron.

#8 08-01-2002, 12:02 AM

At the Mt. Philo hill climb the smoke was tranny oil by my nose. I don't think there were any lasting ill effects to the smokers.

Ron Mummert · #9 08-01-2002, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Boone
At the Mt. Philo hill climb the smoke was tranny oil by my nose. I don't think there were any lasting ill effects to the smokers.

So you're saying fluid or oil pressured enough will be forced through a seal, & it's perfectly OK?

Still scratching balding head, Ron.

#10 08-01-2002, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron Mummert
So you're saying fluid or oil pressured enough will be forced through a seal, & it's perfectly OK?

Still scratching balding head, Ron.

Well, I'm just relating what I saw at the Vermont meet. I don't think there is anything for you to fix. Whether heating up the drivetrain like that caused any lasting damage is a toss up. I'd probably do a drain and fill of the tranny and diffs (I do that often) and certainly get a tranny cooler and gauge. B.

immortal_suby · #11 08-01-2002, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron Mummert

So you think the smoke was tranny, or drivetrain related, rather than engine oil? Any more guesses from anyone?

Ron.

Ron - when you first pulled up in lafayette and I walked over to see the new paintjob I distinctly remember smelling burning engine oil when I got to the front passenger side of the car. I know this smell pretty well since I drove about 10k with a bad front main seal and smelled it pretty much every day. I would say it was engine oil.

#12 08-01-2002, 05:21 PM

I've gotten to know the different odors of the oils we use. They are all different. The mineral engine oils are all pretty much the same. But my Castrol Syntec has a distinct tang (slow leaking oil pump) and probably Mobil 1. Tranny oil and certainly diff gear oil are different again. The noze knowz. Hmm... Chablis or Zin. Ahh.. Exxon.

svxistentialist · #13 08-01-2002, 05:29 PM

It has also been a good year for the Roses.

svxistentialist · #14 08-01-2002, 05:39 PM

Ron, in a more serious vein, mine smokes a lot at times too.

I frown on this, as I am a lot older and do not smoke myself, and it is hardly a teenager yet, but life is different now than when we were 50K or 60K.

I think for me the culprit is the main crank seal. I note you have done the cam seals, you did not mention this one, maybe you did not replace it.

Also, remember when you are travelling for a while up a steep hill, any loose fluids on your engine or sump are going to flow backwards. At least if the gravity over there is as bad as it is here.

This means any leak will make it's way back to the very hot exhaust or cat. Very little oil makes a lot of smoke.

I wouldn't be over worried about it in your case, but you might like to drop the shield under the rads, and see if you have a small leak from the crank pulley area.

Joe

Ron Mummert · #15 08-01-2002, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by immortal_suby

Ron - when you first pulled up in lafayette and I walked over to see the new paintjob I distinctly remember smelling burning engine oil when I got to the front passenger side of the car. I know this smell pretty well since I drove about 10k with a bad front main seal and smelled it pretty much every day. I would say it was engine oil.

Hmmmm.... I didn't really notice, Matt, since after replacing the cam cover seals, there's no drips on the ground, & the REALLY strong scent that hovered in my garage seemed to have mostly waned. As to the crank shaft seal, is that something that would be "easy" to replace if the car had the other seals done, along with the waterpump & timing belt?
My point being, should I complain to the dealer that he shoulda' done all at once? I can live with a slow leak of most fluids, in fact most of my cars always leaked something; a family tradition. I was just worried that this smoking could be a precursor to a major meltdown.

Thanks to all of you for your help. Maybe I should just stay away from them thar hills!

Ron.