SVX Network Forums Live Chat! SVX or Subaru Links Old Lockers Photo Post How-To Documents Message Archive SVX Shop Search |
IRC users: |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Engine Cranks, Won't Fire Up...
Good Afternoon Guys.
Last Wednesday night my SVX left me stranded for the first time. I had left work at 1am, fired her up and left campus. After a couple of blocks it just died on me and I had to pull over. The battery had charge, when I cranked the engine the starter would turn it at the regular speed it does with a good battery, but the engine simply wouldn't turn on. Sometimes the engine would vibrate so it's trying to fire up, but somehow it can't. Today I finally got to do some basic troubleshooting on it: - Poured 2,5 gallons of gas in the tank (I was low on gas anyways) and pushed the car left and right to move liquid in the tank, just in case the fuel pump might have been clogged. - Unplugged the fuel line to the filter and asked my friend to turn the key on. Fuel everywhere, therefore fuel pump works. - Unplugged the fuel line to the fuel rail (from the filter) and asked my friend to do the same. Fuel everywhere, again, therefore filter is not too clogged. - I just pulled my Optima Yellow Top from my Eclipse, and I am gonna put it in the SVX just in case she needs a little more cranking power. Next thing to check are the Spark Plugs I guess. I got the car with 120K miles, she now has 135K miles and I must admit I neglected that part since I heard it's quite a pain in the arse, but now I have to. I already searched the Forum and read that you guys are doing great with the NGK-PFR6B-11. NGK's website also lists the Standard plugs BKR6ES-11 for my SVX, so I was wondering if anybody has tried those since I have a feeling they may be quite cheaper and right now I am really broke. Also, is there a special tool I should use to pull the plugs? Or a 2-feet long wobble extension (thanks Mike) with the proper socket will do it? Any further troubleshooting advice will be immensely appreciated! Regards, Walter
__________________
1995 SVX Green - now 5spd! ..::|SOLD|::.. 1991 Talon TSi AWD (~400 whp pump gas) 1993 Civic CX Hatch (daily driver) 1999 Ducati 748S (built 996 engine) |
#2
|
||||
|
||||
Save your money, six spark plugs won't all fail at the same time.
No-starts require you to begin with the basics: Air, fuel, spark. Changing the battery won't help anything if the engine cranks at normal speed. Remove one coil and place a spare spark plug in it. Lay the metal portion of the plug on something metal (grounded) and have someone crank the engine while watching for a spark. Next, remove a connector from one of the fuel injectors and place a test light ground lead on one terminal and the positive on the other. Again, have someone crank the engine while you watch the light - it will be faint and brief so you need to shield the lamp from ambient light to see if it flashes. Next, connect the test light ground to a ground and while the key is 'on' probe both terminals to see if the light comes on bright and steady on one terminal. Results: no spark and no injector pulse = probable crank sensor - if no bright light at injector harness also may be bad ignition switch. Spark & no pulse, but bright light when checking for 12v power = bad ECU or wiring. Injector pulse but no spark = probable bad igniton module or ECU. No bright light when checking for power = blown injection fuse. Check the three items and let me know the results. I can give you additional help.
__________________
ASE Certified Master Automotive Technician w/L1. ASE Certified Master Medium/Heavy Truck Technician. Certified EVT (Emergency Vehicle Technician) |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
I would bet on the timing belt. Pull one of the plastic covers off and see if it is ok.
__________________
Matt Locker Link 2015 BRZ Limited 6MT 92 Ebony LS-L ECUtune Stage2av1, Z32 MAF, 370cc injectors, TomsSVX intake, BontragerWorks 22mm RSB #003, HID Hi and Lo beams, OT endlink and bushing mods, PWR Aluminum radiator, Harvey's QC shift kit, 2.5" flowmaster 80 exhaust, 17" Michelin Pilot Sport A/S, Poly sway bar bushings, Slotted Bradi rotors, AFBeefcake powdercoated calipers, 97 grill, and a huge set of air horns. 300,000 miles and counting 92 Ebony LS-L. ecutune stage1v4, motorsport 1pc pulley. Garage Queen - sold to Dad in upstate NY 155,000 miles 19 Subaru Ascent Premium - -Hers !. 89 DL 4x4 little red wagon - a.k.a. The immortal suby. 275k R.I.P. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Beav and Matt, thanks for the tips.
Also, I have forgotten to mention that I have changed the Power Steering pump about two months ago, and although the pump install was fairly easy, I was never able to figure out the belt portion and I have been driving the car with a slightly loose Power Steering belt. It has been screeching (the belt) especially with the engine cold, and I have never managed to pull the belt out and re-do the tensioning since then because school is killing me (some days are 8am-1am - yes, 17 hours straight including work). Is there a way to properly tension the PS belt? I was unable to understand the tensioning mechanism and I hope that this issue is not due to my neglecting of the PS belt, because I'd slap myself. Beav: I will most definitely try your suggestions tomorrow morning, when I go back to school (it is currently parked in the garage). Matt: I surely hope you are wrong, I do know we have non-interference engines so the valves should be ok, but still a timing job is something I can't really afford right now. Thanks again! Walter
__________________
1995 SVX Green - now 5spd! ..::|SOLD|::.. 1991 Talon TSi AWD (~400 whp pump gas) 1993 Civic CX Hatch (daily driver) 1999 Ducati 748S (built 996 engine) |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Check the ignitor too. Crank angle sensor and ignitor.
__________________
Robert Is Bush in jail yet? (Looks frantically at watch, then back up) How about now? Now? Come onnnnnn...... Someone freeze me until January, this wait is killing me. Update: 09 January, and still not in jail! Wassup?? 1992 Teal LS-L - 160k (Now new and improved with perfect paint!) |
#6
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
First things first. Besides, how do you propose he check it? Let's just see if he has spark and pulse first. Matt: You could very well be right, if the belt has never been changed.
__________________
ASE Certified Master Automotive Technician w/L1. ASE Certified Master Medium/Heavy Truck Technician. Certified EVT (Emergency Vehicle Technician) Last edited by Beav; 04-15-2005 at 04:15 PM. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Timing belt would be my guess.
Mike |
#8
|
||||
|
||||
Ooops
Actually the injectors are ground switched, my bad. When checking for pulse the light will glow and briefly dim each time it is supposed to 'fire'. Sometimes it is easier to attach the test light's ground lead to the battery + and probe the ground terminal of the injector connector. This way you will have a light that is normally off and flashes on.
Timing belts (and chains/gears too) usually break during starting. The sudden shock of the starter against the 'at rest' valve train is a tremendous load. The next normal failure occurs when someone is goosing the throttle in neutral, again the shock/strain is greatest then. This is why I think the other checks are a better place to begin.
__________________
ASE Certified Master Automotive Technician w/L1. ASE Certified Master Medium/Heavy Truck Technician. Certified EVT (Emergency Vehicle Technician) |
#9
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
Yes, we used to run the bejeezuz out of timing belts. We've had them last between 40k-80k. One time the car was ticking/knocking and I thought I had finally killed the engine. I was so sad. A new timing belt fixed it. /threadjack (sorry)
__________________
Matt Locker Link 2015 BRZ Limited 6MT 92 Ebony LS-L ECUtune Stage2av1, Z32 MAF, 370cc injectors, TomsSVX intake, BontragerWorks 22mm RSB #003, HID Hi and Lo beams, OT endlink and bushing mods, PWR Aluminum radiator, Harvey's QC shift kit, 2.5" flowmaster 80 exhaust, 17" Michelin Pilot Sport A/S, Poly sway bar bushings, Slotted Bradi rotors, AFBeefcake powdercoated calipers, 97 grill, and a huge set of air horns. 300,000 miles and counting 92 Ebony LS-L. ecutune stage1v4, motorsport 1pc pulley. Garage Queen - sold to Dad in upstate NY 155,000 miles 19 Subaru Ascent Premium - -Hers !. 89 DL 4x4 little red wagon - a.k.a. The immortal suby. 275k R.I.P. |
#10
|
||||
|
||||
Power steering belt tension will not affect your problem.
To tension it, first loosen the nut in the center of the idler pulley, then look for the head of the long bolt that leads up and to the right from the pulley. Rotating that bolt will move the pulley assembly (assuming no one has altered the setup on your car) Once you have tightened the belt sufficiently using the long bolt, tighten the nut in the center of the pulley and you are done. If the timing belt is your problem we have enough how-to's here that I'm sure we can walk you through it. If you can change the spark plugs you are more than capable of changing the timing belt. A new belt is around $90.
__________________
Matt Locker Link 2015 BRZ Limited 6MT 92 Ebony LS-L ECUtune Stage2av1, Z32 MAF, 370cc injectors, TomsSVX intake, BontragerWorks 22mm RSB #003, HID Hi and Lo beams, OT endlink and bushing mods, PWR Aluminum radiator, Harvey's QC shift kit, 2.5" flowmaster 80 exhaust, 17" Michelin Pilot Sport A/S, Poly sway bar bushings, Slotted Bradi rotors, AFBeefcake powdercoated calipers, 97 grill, and a huge set of air horns. 300,000 miles and counting 92 Ebony LS-L. ecutune stage1v4, motorsport 1pc pulley. Garage Queen - sold to Dad in upstate NY 155,000 miles 19 Subaru Ascent Premium - -Hers !. 89 DL 4x4 little red wagon - a.k.a. The immortal suby. 275k R.I.P. |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
[QUOTE=immortal_suby]Power steering belt tension will not affect your problem.
QUOTE] But the power steering belt also runs the alternator, which could affect his problem. Since his battery seems ok though, I lean towards the timing belt. Dave |
#12
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
This is really bad news because I am really broke right now, and it's strange too because the previous owner of this car gave me all the maintenance paperwork (performed at a Subaru dealership), very complete and reassuring. I should go back and see when was the timing belt changed last. Anyways, I am gonna order the stuff from the good guys over at Subaruparts.com on Monday morning I guess. Besides the TB, what else should I order? I am not looking forward to change more expensive parts like water pump and the like, but if a new bolt, seal or plug is recommended I will surely go for it. Here's the link I am looking at. Also, if you can point me to your favorite timing-belt replacement how-to that would be great. How many hours am I looking to put into this? As usual, thanks for all the help. Walter
__________________
1995 SVX Green - now 5spd! ..::|SOLD|::.. 1991 Talon TSi AWD (~400 whp pump gas) 1993 Civic CX Hatch (daily driver) 1999 Ducati 748S (built 996 engine) Last edited by Treppiede; 04-16-2005 at 11:00 AM. |
#13
|
||||
|
||||
This is probably the best how-to
http://www.ryanmacdonald.com/car/howto/belt/belt.html We'll really need to know what caused the breakage to determine what else needs changing. Some have had the water pump or idler pulleys lock up causing the timing belt snap. Hopefully yours was just old. You don't need to change anything else if it isn't broken, but I really recommend changing the front main seal (crank seal) while you are in there. First time and barring something goes wrong like the crank pulley or main sprocket is stuck on, I'd bet around 2-3 hours to do it.
__________________
Matt Locker Link 2015 BRZ Limited 6MT 92 Ebony LS-L ECUtune Stage2av1, Z32 MAF, 370cc injectors, TomsSVX intake, BontragerWorks 22mm RSB #003, HID Hi and Lo beams, OT endlink and bushing mods, PWR Aluminum radiator, Harvey's QC shift kit, 2.5" flowmaster 80 exhaust, 17" Michelin Pilot Sport A/S, Poly sway bar bushings, Slotted Bradi rotors, AFBeefcake powdercoated calipers, 97 grill, and a huge set of air horns. 300,000 miles and counting 92 Ebony LS-L. ecutune stage1v4, motorsport 1pc pulley. Garage Queen - sold to Dad in upstate NY 155,000 miles 19 Subaru Ascent Premium - -Hers !. 89 DL 4x4 little red wagon - a.k.a. The immortal suby. 275k R.I.P. Last edited by immortal_suby; 04-16-2005 at 10:53 AM. |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Thanks, Walter
__________________
1995 SVX Green - now 5spd! ..::|SOLD|::.. 1991 Talon TSi AWD (~400 whp pump gas) 1993 Civic CX Hatch (daily driver) 1999 Ducati 748S (built 996 engine) |
#15
|
||||
|
||||
I have a slightly used water pump and a brand new gasket if you want to knock that out of the way while you are in there. it is yours if you cover shipping.
Tom |
|
|