OT - Thank you, Marcus Gronholm

[Aredubjay]

Originally posted by mohrds


Wow, that's deep. You should add that to your signature

Doug

It's only deep to shallow minds.

Here's one to ponder: when I was in high school, I decided to become a non-conformist. Then, I realized that to be a non-conformist was merely to conform to non-conformity.

I think nascar is lame too. If you do too good, they ban you. Plus they aren't 'stock cars' anymore. Where's my 400hp rwd ford taurus?!?! >:|

Any of you guys into boat racing? I've been to a ton of tunnel hull races, my dad helps a few different crews. The best one to be on is the hooters team.

- Ca$h

[blackbolt94red]

Its been an age since I could even get to the site to reply to something, since the LaFayette party I've had two heart attacks, three trips to the Heart Hospital of South Dakota and two thrilling helicopter rides, with lots of pain killing drugs.
Ah, its good to be back to work.

It's the NASCAR comment I was wanting to hit on, I always thought of it as the WWF (Wide Waistband Wrestling) of car racing, a lot of show, and often fun to watch, but the roundy/roundy thing gets tiring. Now, road racing at Watkins Glen, or Sears Point, thats fun to watch.

Thanks to whoever started this thread with the Rally of GB recap, I have to tape those and watch the next day, its on too late for this old dude. I think thats the most thrilling racing on TV today, its something I bet most of us can relate too.

Bruce

[SVXphile]

<I work in Indiana, where they think that all Kentuckians are toothless, redneck rubes>

....then I can't imagine what they think of West Virginians...

Wait a minute....my sister is a Hoosier. She LOVES our state. She just thinks it's a bit LUMPY, that's all.... By the way, she tapes every F1 race....and has a WALL dedicated to Rusty Wallace.

As for NASCAR, I was raised within earshot of Bristol Motor Speedway and Thunder Valley Dragway. As for the oval, there is not a bad seat in the house, there is more action than a cat in a dog pound, and yes it is not too high tech. But neither are USAC midgets and sprint cars. It may be very different from rally and F!, but the drivers are no less talented. The list of drivers that have mastered the ovals and gone on to handle road courses is too long to mention as you all well know. Foyt, Gurney, and Mario Andretti come to mind...We'll see how Christian Fittipaldi does next year in Winston Cup.

However.....I would give my last wisdom tooth, to see Michael Schumacher in....say....Tony Stewart's Pontiac...at Bristol under the lights. (how do you say...."Good 'ole boys" in German?) Don

[Mr. Pockets]

You're very welcome, Bruce. It was a thrilling rally to watch, and I couldn't help but share it with a bunch of Subaru fans. The battle between Petter Solberg and Markko Martin (and the difference their levels of experience made) was awesome. The rally itself is being replayed in three parts this week, or you can catch the 'Rally Xtra' this weekend. The really good parts, which happened on day 3, will be on Speed at 6PM on Thursday.

I couldn't agree more with your WWF/NASCAR comparison. They've forgotten what motor racing is about. But the fans don't seem to care because they get to see massive, contrived wrecks.

I'm sorry to hear of your trips to the hospital, and I hope you're doing better.

Originally posted by blackbolt94red
Its been an age since I could even get to the site to reply to something, since the LaFayette party I've had two heart attacks, three trips to the Heart Hospital of South Dakota and two thrilling helicopter rides, with lots of pain killing drugs.
Ah, its good to be back to work.

It's the NASCAR comment I was wanting to hit on, I always thought of it as the WWF (Wide Waistband Wrestling) of car racing, a lot of show, and often fun to watch, but the roundy/roundy thing gets tiring. Now, road racing at Watkins Glen, or Sears Point, thats fun to watch.

Thanks to whoever started this thread with the Rally of GB recap, I have to tape those and watch the next day, its on too late for this old dude. I think thats the most thrilling racing on TV today, its something I bet most of us can relate too.

Bruce

[SVXphile]

<fans don't seem to care because they get to see massive, contrived wrecks.>

With all due respect ....contrived? With the COST of those machines....and today's speeds creating higher risks at even the smaller tracks? I really doubt that Dale's wreck at Daytona, or Adam Petty's was part of a stage show. Johnny Benson didn't break his ribs....twice....to impress his sponsor. Sterling Marlin didn't give up his one big chance for a championship because of a script. Are the "rules' occasionally tampered with? No doubt. But please spare me that other forms of racing are squeaky clean. "Cheating in Formula One" would make a nice coffee table book....except most tables couldn't handle the weight! Nascar may not be many people's cup of tea....(sorry....can of BUD....), and except for a few tracks, it's not mine either....but lets not take this WWF thing too far. Put on a good show for the fans....sure. Play with the rules? Of course.
But contrived wrecks? No way Jose. Not in F1, not in CART, not in IRL, not in NASCAR. Too much money involved, too many big-buck sponsers who want to see their 200 mph billboard on T.V., too many high dollar drivers at risk to play that game. Fender banging is not directed by Mike Helton from his motor home, it's driver-to-driver in the heat of the battle. And NO ONE tries to get even at Daytona or Talladega. We are talking DEATH here....

In short, there is very little to compare between the top rope of the WWF....and the concrete wall at New Hampshire. Just my 2 cents.... Don

PS 1....
(Gee, what has been happening with F! since the end of the season? How do you spell "contrived"...oh, I know! Michael and his "good friend" at the finish line!!!)
http://espn.go.com/rpm/f1/2002/1117/1462129.html

PS 2....I have taped almost every WRC event this year. I still have a bottle of wine waiting when Hyundai wins their first stage!

[Ron Mummert]

PS 2....I have taped almost every WRC event this year. I still have a bottle of wine waiting when Hyundai wins their first stage! [/B][/QUOTE]


Ooooh! Then I guess I'm pullin' for a Sonata sweep!
What's a bottle?

Me.

[Aredubjay]

Originally posted by SVXphile
<I work in Indiana, where they think that all Kentuckians are toothless, redneck rubes>

....then I can't imagine what they think of West Virginians...

Wait a minute....my sister is a Hoosier. She LOVES our state. She just thinks it's a bit LUMPY, that's all.... By the way, she tapes every F1 race....and has a WALL dedicated to Rusty Wallace.

As for NASCAR, I was raised within earshot of Bristol Motor Speedway and Thunder Valley Dragway. As for the oval, there is not a bad seat in the house, there is more action than a cat in a dog pound, and yes it is not too high tech. But neither are USAC midgets and sprint cars. It may be very different from rally and F!, but the drivers are no less talented. The list of drivers that have mastered the ovals and gone on to handle road courses is too long to mention as you all well know. Foyt, Gurney, and Mario Andretti come to mind...We'll see how Christian Fittipaldi does next year in Winston Cup.

However.....I would give my last wisdom tooth, to see Michael Schumacher in....say....Tony Stewart's Pontiac...at Bristol under the lights. (how do you say...."Good 'ole boys" in German?) Don

Gimme a good ol' "figger 8" race any day of the week. Now THAT'S entertainment!

[huck369]

I enjoy Rally, Motorcross, Drag Racing, Indy, Nascar, GP,........heck pretty much anything that has a motor and wheels. anything fast and dangerous is exciting to watch.

As for being fixed.......if you've ever raced anything, you should know that EVERYONE on the track is trying their hardest to win.........nobody likes second place

My 2 cents on the matter

[benebob]

Originally posted by SVXphile
[B
As for NASCAR, I was raised within earshot of Bristol Motor Speedway and Thunder Valley Dragway. As for the oval, there is not a bad seat in the house, there is more action than a cat in a dog pound, and yes it is not too high tech. But neither are USAC midgets and sprint cars. It may be very different from rally and F!, but the drivers are no less talented. The list of drivers that have mastered the ovals and gone on to handle road courses is too long to mention as you all well know. Foyt, Gurney, and Mario Andretti come to mind...We'll see how Christian Fittipaldi does next year in Winston Cup.

Don [/B]

Not so sure about Christian Fittipaldi but I remember seeing that Colin McCray (not sure on the spelling) entered the equiviliant of Euro NASCAR on an off week and placed (I think he won but know that he at least place) having never driven in that type of race before. Virtually every non-rally racer who enters usually ends up out by the end of day one. Granted Colin is an exceptional driver who takes A LOT of chances but to enter a race with a car that's probably not really well prepared and tested and to do that well with no experience in that type of race shows me that these guys are the bomb. Who would you rather co-ride with through 50 miles of real curvy snowy backroads when your late for work? Petter Solberg or Jeff Gordon?

[Mr. Pockets]

Originally posted by SVXphile
<fans don't seem to care because they get to see massive, contrived wrecks.>

With all due respect ....contrived? With the COST of those machines....and today's speeds creating higher risks at even the smaller tracks? I really doubt that Dale's wreck at Daytona, or Adam Petty's was part of a stage show. Johnny Benson didn't break his ribs....twice....to impress his sponser.

Yes, it's my opinion that part of the allure of NASCAR, for many (if not most) of the fans is the huge pile-ups. It's also my opinion that the organizers know that, and the series has been specifically refined over the past few years to create those wrecks. Again, that's just my opinion.

That's what I mean by contrived. I don't mean that Dale Earnhart or Adam Petty are crashing their cars on purpose - I know how competitive these guys are and that they wouldn't think of throwing a race like that. But, in my opinion, the series has been rigged from above to provide the gigantic crashes that the audience wants to see.

And it's a real shame, too, because they haven't increased safety accordingly. Dale Earnhart shouldn't have died in that crash - it wasn't that bad.

Lacking Speedvision, a friend of mine in madison captures all the rally's for me and posts them to the net (hows that for hardcore!) ... so I just got to watch RallyGB last night.

Man, I really want to be a rally driver.

I figure my first step in operation Be Like Gronholm(tm) is to learn to NEVER BLINK. That guy is crazy. Even his crashes are prettier than other people.

I still pull for Petter and Tommy of course... I liked Petter saying "I was driving really hard today - Half crazy almost"

It'll be pretty cool to see how the new Impreza WRC shapes up next year. Hopefully something will be able to touch the 206's.

Ah well, just wanted to add my two cents.

[blackbolt94red]

also, did you notice Petter had to keep knocking his sunvisor up and out of the way? Had to laugh.
So glad he won the GB rally, he is such an enthusiastic (sp?) guy, always with a smile and at the end of the race he thanked his entire crew for doing such a great job.

[Mr. Pockets]

Originally posted by blackbolt94red
also, did you notice Petter had to keep knocking his sunvisor up and out of the way? Had to laugh.
So glad he won the GB rally, he is such an enthusiastic (sp?) guy, always with a smile and at the end of the race he thanked his entire crew for doing such a great job.

You spelled it correctly.

And, yeah, I had forgotten about the sunvisor - thanks. Funny that it didn't get fixed at a service stop. :P I thought that the drivers were at least equipped with the tools necessary to do a job like that themselves in between stages...

[SVXphile]

<Yes, it's my opinion that part of the allure of NASCAR, for many (if not most) of the fans is the huge pile-ups. It's also my opinion that the organizers know that, and the series has been specifically refined over the past few years to create those wrecks. Again, that's just my opinion>

<And it's a real shame, too, because they haven't increased safety accordingly. Dale Earnhart shouldn't have died in that crash - it wasn't that bad.>

I respect your opinion. I think though, that it is the inherent NATURE of round-track racing, not a plan from the organization, that gives the high possibility of wrecks. Depending on the track, it doesn't take long for the faster leaders to make contact with the slower backmarkers. Throw in yellow flags and pit stops, and you have faster/slower/lapped cars all involved in a mix that by its very NATURE is going to lead to trouble. Keep the tires within the sheet metal, like the "stock" cars, and you have the possibility of some bumping and banging without killing anyone, and the drivers will naturally use their cars to "muscle" someone around. Mix it all together, and you have lots of action. The thing is that THAT has been going on since the days of the Vanderbilt Cup run on boardwalks! It is simply built into the nature of roundy-racing!

<the series has been rigged from above to provide the gigantic crashes that the audience wants to see> The BIGGEST wrecks are at Daytona and especially Talladega. A few years back, after Bobby Allison's car almost cleared the catchfence and went into the crowd (man that was SCARY!) the idea of restrictor plates came along to slow the cars down. Well it worked, but it also put everyone into incredible PACKS where just one tire blowing out could set off a chain reation that took out half the field. During the off-season the drivers let it be known that something had to be done before the next BIG ONE ended up killing someone. They made a few changes, and its a LITTLE better, but the problems still hasn't been solved. Perhaps everyone loves the BIG ONE....except the drivers, car owners, sponsors, and fans who don't want their favorite driver hurt. As for the few others,
there are those who unfortunately are attracted to the "wreck" nature of this kind of racing. Not that anyone is wanting anyone killed, but to some this is a form of legal cockfighting. "Wait till next lap....Kurt Bush is gonna put it to 'ol Jimmy Spenser!" No doubt... I would submit that if someone REALLY wants to see lots of wrecks, that they watch sprint cars. It is no wonder that half of those cars are rollcages...

I think it has been shown that number 3 did not have his seatbelts installed correctly. The shame is that Bill Simpson got a LOT of bad press about it....something he did not deserve. Simpson's equipment has saved thousands of lives in racing all over the world. The one positive outcome seems to be that the Hans device is becoming standard equipment....even in Formula One. Speaking of F1, if the Ferraris keep getting faster....and the Arrows team can keep from going bankrupt...Shuey will end up passing as many cars in a race as Stewart does at Richmond!
Don