Accusation and Explanation of the QC, for all to see.

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by oab_au

First or all, I did not start this thread, it was started prematurely to undermine whatever I am doing as usual. The “Quick Change” would have been announced when it was fitted, tested, and ready for release. The uninformed debate that has ensured was not my intention, or desire.

Harvey, once again you slander me.

What you have stated is not the truth. I will not uselessly demand of you that which is beyond your character, i.e. an apology, but do point out for others, the true facts which can be verified.

My/this thread was started 05-10-2008.

04-29-2008 You Harvey, let the cat out of the bag yourself, by posting on your now preferred site, SVX World Forums, in post No. 4.

“It gives the impression of firming the changes. but all it does is to raise the line pressure in relation to how far the throttle is pushed. The line pressure is still lowered during the change.
I have developed a unit that does it the right way.”

Refer --- http://svxworldforums.com/forum4/530.html

Immediately, well before I posted several members started an avalanche of questions, which totalled over 15 posts regarding your product. The thread culminated in “budfreak” offering the product for sale, talking price and announcing, 15-23-2008 in post No. 71, a new exclusive thread.

Refer --- http://svxworldforums.com/forum1/575.html

By 05-10-2008 you were well into posting and discussing your gizmo within SVX World Forums.

You had ample opportunity to explain that development was not complete if indeed that was the situation, first in the SVX World Forums and later here. Furthermore a mercenary attitude will by now be obvious to all.

The Line pressure lowering is preformed by the TCU sending a signal to the ‘A’ solenoid. The “Quick Change” intercepts this signal to keep the Line pressure high, so that the Brake band and the Clutches engage under full pressure, to prevent any slippage. The overall Line pressure is still controlled by the Throttle pressure through the dropping resistor circuit that has to be as normal.

Harvey.

Overall line pressure is not normally controlled via the dropping resistor circuit, which has an independent function and this most certainly does not involve throttle position. N.B. Throttle pressure is not sensed.
It is likely that line pressure will be running at final pump pressure.

[Trevor]

When I design something I subscribe to the "KISS" principal, so it is pretty simple.
It uses a LM741 Op-Amp configured as a comparator, comparing a regulated set voltage to the Throttle Position Sensors voltage. When the TP voltage reaches 1.8 V the Op-Amp sets to turn on a transistor to operate a DP/DT relay.

Why not a simple transistor driven voltage sensitive DPDT relay? I gather there is a direct connection to the TPS. This means that whenever the throttle position provides 1.8 V. or more, torque reduction can not occur and line pressure runs free, regardless.

One half turns the TCUs Torque Control line off the ECU and on to a regulated 4.5V, that it can pull up and down happily.

This indicates that the torque control signal is applied to the output from a 4.5 volt regulated supply. Phil has advised that the torque control is a binary switch not a voltage. It is either On or Off. Therefore the described arrangement will ask the torque control to short circuit a voltage regulated supply, backed up by 14 volts. Interesting stuff.

The other side of the relay inserts a resistor in the A solenoids control line to limit its signal to 5%. This action keeps both the ECU/TCU from posting trouble codes.

The circuit looks like this, the Throttle pressure signal is a 12V duty cycle that is run through the dropping resistor to reduce the signal to a 5V. signal to mix with the 5V shift signal. It is therefore claimed that the shift signal to the solenoid is at 5v. The inclusion of the resistor to allow the two signals to drive the solenoid even though they may be opposite. Opposite? At negative potential? This happens when the throttle is wide open its duty cycle signal is 5%, when the shift is to operate the shift voltage is increased to about 80% to soften the engagement, if the resistor was not used one line would short out the other line, Why? They are of the same polarity. so it acts as an isolator, or voltage divider. In order to operate as a voltage divider the so called ‘throttle signal’ must be at negative potential.

Everything indicates that the resistor circuit must be at negative potential, which it is not.

When the Small Cars Shift Kit is used, the reduced resistance in the Throttle line causes a higher line pressure that (?than) would normally be used, but even with this in place, a full throttle change still has the line pressure reduced through the shift line, Exactly how? so it really does nothing but fool the driver into thinking it is producing a solid change. (Not according to those who have it. The secondary resistor included in the kit is of high resistance and is included only to prevent a fault signal. The effect equates with fully opening the circuit, which has been found to have a definite effect, confirmed by many who have tried it.)

The "Q C" may work, but not in the way intended or described and only as result of luck.

After reading Harvey’s post #153 and posting a reply as above, it was clear to me that the writer was using words and terms with which he is not familiar, therefore one of two situations applied.

Someone else had designed the “QC” circuitry and or, the writer was being intentionally confusing so as to hide detail. I therefore posted #158 as above by way of obtaining clarification, and received #161 in reply. This excuse confirmed that the writer was out of his depth, regarding the terminology he was using and someone else was involved.

It was not long before I twigged to the fact that a hobby kit was being used, as the required knowledge to design the described circuitry was beyond that of the alleged designer. A check through catalogues has disclosed that this is indeed correct and plagiarism is rife.

The “QC” comprises Jaycar Electronics Australia's universal voltage switch, catalogue number KC-5377 and their enclosure/box UB3, HB-6013. These two items are available here in N.Z. for a total price of less than NZ$40-00, with a discount for lots of five or more. In Australia, where the “QC ” vendor is based, one would expect an even better price. Units or ten have been mentioned by the distributor, which is significant.

Complete assembly data covering the kit is published in “Performance Electronics for Cars”, an Australian publication first published 2004. Their description titled, “How it Works” as below, is enlightening and discloses from where the wording, so poorly put together in post #153, was derived.

----"The simple voltage switch relies on comparator ICa (Operational amplifier), which compares the input to a reference level. The input voltage is divided by two 1meg ohm resistors which apply one half of the voltage to the inverting pin of IC1. Zener diode ZD2 and a 100nf capacitor protect against transient voltage on the input signal. etc. etc. ----"

It is easy to see from where strange reference to a voltage divider in post #153 was obtained. This next piece of text is also interesting, in view of the conflicting wording referring to hysteresis in post #153.

----]“Hysteresis has been added to prevent the output from oscillating at the trigger voltage. Basically the hysteresis is the difference between the between the switch on and switch off voltages and this is set using potentiometer VR2.” ----

Two resistors across the relay output, will turn the assembled voltage switch kit into a “QC”. However an interesting anomaly is the text in Harvey’s description i.e.,
"One half turns the TCUs Torque Control line off the ECU and on to a regulated 4.5V, that it can pull up and down happily.”
This surely is not the method in fact applied. Refer my post #158 above.

In view of the fact that the now plagiarised design has been published commercially, intellectual property rights will apply. This means that Harvey could be covertly operating beyond the law. Jason/ SVX Parts Central, could also become drawn into any possible litigation. Granted, due to the limited sales, the publishers would probably decide that court proceedings would not be cost effective.

I am not at all concerned that Harvey has used a kit set for his project, a logical idea, good on him if he is willing to accept the risk. What is not on, is the blarney of writing himself up as the designer of intricate circuitry. There surely is no shame in being honest.

[oab_au]

Originally Posted by Trevor

Why is it that people do not read that which is written and put a slant on the situation to suite what they preconceive?
(N.B. The final statement within my post:-

"I am not at all concerned that Harvey has used a kit set for his project, a logical idea, good on him if he is willing to accept the risk. What is not on, is the blarney of writing himself up as the designer of intricate circuitry."

If off the shelf components had been used to assemble an original design the situation would be vastly different. Using the exact design, as well as a circuit board produced by another and inferring that this constitutes a personal achievement, is another matter entirely. There are no sour grapes, but there is a desire for truth.

In view of Trevor's quest for the truth, and my insistence to “tell it like it is”, I must put his slanderous accusations to test.

Firstly he accuses me of not being capable of designing an intricate electronic circuitry. Second he accuses me of stealing somebody else’s circuit board, for my own use.

To deal with the first, I am quite comfortable in designing any electronic circuitry. I have all ways had electronics as a hobby since I built my first crystal radio, moving through the various stages to achieve my Amateur radio operator's licence.

In the early 70s I did a 12 months full-time Diploma course on Computer Technology with Control Data, on the main-frame computers of the time. This included digital and analogue electronics. I constructed my first Vector Graphics computer in 73, using the original Z80 processor. I then designed a digital controller for an automatic, automotive, spring winding machine that I also designed.
I continued through various stages to teach Automotive Engineering at Sydney Technical collage, where I wrote and taught an ‘Electronics for Automotive Mechanics’ course, and was instrumental in changing the way electrical was taught to move it into the modern era.

Configuring Linier ICs in the way that I have, may be new to Trevor, but it is a basic building block for all electronic designers. Phil uses it in his digital discriminator to clean the signal between the ECU and the lap top.

I am absolutely confident in designing and offering this circuitry, in my Quick Change

Second. I designed my own circuit board, using a CAD program to suit the circuit that I wanted to use. I also designed it to allow me to build the board easily, as not having a right arm increases the degree of difficaulty in anything that I do, hence the low production of 10 a week. As can be seen in the picture it bares the Slick Shift logo both on the silk screen, and copper sides.

I now demand an apology of the same prominence as the slanderous accusations.

Harvey.

[RSVX]

We, the Admin/Mod staff, thought it best to bring these posts back to light so that those that care, can come to their own conclusion.

And so that those that are misinformed, can be informed.

It was suggested that this be locked, however I will leave it open for discussion.

That means, obey the rules, as we will be watching this thread like a hawk.

[SVXRide]

Chris,
My vote is to lock this thread, as I see nothing good coming from leaving it open. I would hope, by this time, that everyone understands the dynamic that exists between Harvey and Trevor.
-Bill

[kwren]

The only person we really need to prove anything to is ourself.
Why can't we all just get on with life?
What is the purpose in trying to keep this war going?
Keith

[b3lha]

I can't help thinking that if Harvey and Trevor could meet up over a few beers, then they could put all this to rest and end up as best mates.

[92svx95]

Originally Posted by b3lha

I can't help thinking that if Harvey and Trevor could meet up over a few beers, then they could put all this to rest and end up as best mates.

I agree to that.

[TomsSVX]

As suggested earlier, but stirring the pot consistently by Harvey, Trevor, and the admin/mod squad is not helping any of this Wtf is going on here and why do I see "the great divide" growing larger??

Tom

[RSVX]

This was reposted, partially by request of Trevor.

He claims that we want nothing but to censor him, this is not true. By leaving this out there, it lets you all make up your own mind. There is no need for it to be locked, lest it get out of hand.

Believe me, we want this to be over more than you, as I enjoy reading the forums and not having to police them.

[Sov13t]

+1... was trying to ignore this as much as possible... but....

this is really getting to be lame.

take this to harveyvstrevor.com or something... for crying out loud.

-Sov13t.

[tiv0]

i hate that i cant go through a freakin thread without something related to this coming up, typically resulting in furious posts between trevor and harvey
i mean honestly, this is an SVX forum, keep it at that

trevor

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by tiv0

i hate that i cant go through a freakin thread without something related to this coming up, typically resulting in furious posts between trevor and harvey
i mean honestly, this is an SVX forum, keep it at that

trevor

Trevor [II], (Watch it and use II, or you may cop some unwanted flack.)

My intent here, is to ensure that honest and correct information is provided to SVX forum members. The fact that many do not understand the technical issues involved, and as a result the thread has become a convoluted mess, should not be my problem.

Cheers, Trevor.

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by b3lha

I can't help thinking that if Harvey and Trevor could meet up over a few beers, then they could put all this to rest and end up as best mates.

Unfortunately Phil, I can not see that happening, unless I receive two back dated apologies.

My ability to assess character is reasonable and I do not choose to drink with those having an exaggerated ego and are incapable of a logical conversation. Disagreement can be a stimulating factor and on several occasion I have been engaged in quite furious debate here, when the outcome has been to agree to disagree and a beer has been on the agenda. What is more on those occasions the spectators understood and became amused. Sadly that was long ago.

Cheers, Trevor.

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by RSVX

We, the Admin/Mod staff, thought it best to bring these posts back to light so that those that care, can come to their own conclusion.

And so that those that are misinformed, can be informed.

It was suggested that this be locked, however I will leave it open for discussion.

That means, obey the rules, as we will be watching this thread like a hawk.

My thread, "Trevor's Posts" as I recall was the title, has been deleted without explanation. As I recall this thread also included evidence, as it contained a statement by me which was deliberately misconstrued, so as to label me a liar. Not to mention controversial posts by you.

Again I note, that I am instructed to take head, by way of a threat. Happy place this.