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  #16  
Old 07-10-2010, 06:39 AM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kwren View Post
Don't be so smug Trevor...
You don't know.

I get a 02 sensor code everyday on one of my SVX's and there is nothing wrong with the 02's or their circuits. I get no other codes. I would tell you why, but you are too good that everything that is discovered, you claim to have discovered it. No one else on this form does that. The rest of us just try to help out.

A person that is so smug and so smart that they can no longer learn anything is far from intelligent. Because it hasn't happened to you, you pretend you really understand everything about the subject, and it can't be right.
Times when I think there could possibly be hope for you, you end up making an burro out of yourself... Think about it.

Keith
Keith,

You continue to direct towards me, senseless nasty sarcasm.

However you should be pleased that in particular, "I do think about it", i.e. your situation, and therefore remain tolerant. As usual you are again simply misguided due to the subject being beyond your intellectual capacity. What is more, again you understandably are unable to properly convey a logical issue.

My object in posting was to --- "just try to help out" --- by endeavouring to prevent, "laserx" from embarking on a wild goose chase.

On the basis of what you advise regarding your own problem, you have an intermittent fault applicable to the code being registered. I note that you believe that there is nothing wrong with this situation.

Trevor
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  #17  
Old 07-10-2010, 06:54 AM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

[QUOTE=sowise;652205]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
In conjunction with others I do know, having gleAned what was originally posted. -----

What was originally posted was incomplete without the codes. So only code listed that I could find was P1151 which could be alot of different things, however I would personally like to know the code that is coming up.
What was originally posted by laserx, refer again #!. ---

A month ago I got CE light on, had it checked and it came up knock sensor and 02 sensor 3 I believe (it's the 02 sensor on the exhaust pipe after the engine), both were replaced at the Subaru Dealer.

It is reasonable to assume that the mechanic correctly read and understood the code or codes recorded, and that in fact there was indication of an actual sensor fault, rather sensor readings correctly transmitted but outside of normal tolerances.

The fault code facility is designed to record faults within components, and a sensor recording a sensed faulty condition is performing as intended and in itself is not faulty.
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  #18  
Old 07-10-2010, 07:13 AM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by TomsSVX View Post

This was on the 96?? You stated that the tech changed 2 02 sensors. Problem is, there are 3 in the OBDII system. The third is above the rear end of the catalytic converter. Ask the tech for the exact code which is reoccurring. I vaguely remember the rear 02 sensor description made me want to believe it was the left front.

Tom
Thanks Tom,

By way of trying to be of help (N.B. Keith.) in view of the page change, I am hereby making sure that your important advice does not become buried among the preceding superfluous stuff.
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  #19  
Old 07-10-2010, 12:03 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

Trevor, here is how I see the original statement and why I must still disagree with you.

A month ago I got CE light on, had it checked and it came up knock sensor and 02 sensor 3 I believe (it's the 02 sensor on the exhaust pipe after the engine), both were replaced at the Subaru Dealer.

The "I believe" is a him adding in a bit of uncertainty because he is referencing either something he was told, or what he believes based on perhaps limited knowledge. His description of the location of the sensor kind of helps support that. While it wasn't something worth correcting because it isn't entirely wrong but not entirely correct either.

then i posted all of the OBDII codes for a 96 and newer subaru, that were O2 related. There isn't anything that says "sensor is bad". For all we know both codes could have been caused by his knock sensor. He could have been running lean causing a knock and not have had to replace either sensor, because his catalytic efficiency readings wouldn't be accurate. If he had his exhaust recently done then it could have a leak, he could have a vacuum leak because they may have pulled his intake to do the knock sensor. I still disagree with taking a car to a shop with a CE lit they reset it and send you on your way. I think that is wrong. You can get that done free at most autoparts shops. Hopefully they didn't charge him for that. I think everyone intends to help but with an intermittent problem it is a wild goose chase in some respects. If you look at all the potential causes for the P1151 which I was using as an example because it was the a rear sensor fault code. But I think so far everyone who suggested something could be found in the list of possibles.
I am not disagreeing with you to pick on you or because I want to be an ass. I don't, however you give the impression that your way is the only way. A description given of what another tech is doing with their car is usually going to have some kind of details missing.
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  #20  
Old 07-10-2010, 06:25 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

sowise

You hold the advantage of addressing me in person, from a position of obscurity.

You acknowledge, --- “I think everyone intends to help but with an intermittent problem it is a wild goose chase in some respects.”

It is my opinion that the goose described is far too wild and chasing it ahead of a more logical approach is not good advice for laserx to follow, particularly as he is paying for the work involved. N.B. e.g. the now concealed post #15, inserted by Tom.

It is unfortunate that in your view, putting forward an opinion backed with evidence, gives the impression that my intent is indicate that my way is the only way, when the real object is to emphasise what is best in the interests of the person requiring assistance.
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  #21  
Old 07-10-2010, 07:59 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by Trevor View Post

It is unfortunate that in your view, putting forward an opinion backed with evidence, gives the impression that my intent is indicate that my way is the only way.
I think that statement should read... "in everyone's view". Pushing as gospel your "limited expertise" as the "only thing" does indicate exactly what you think it indicates... "your way is the only way".

Keep in mind that you are not unique, Trevor. Nobody on earth knows everything and it is futile to try to convince people that you do.

Keith
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  #22  
Old 07-10-2010, 09:47 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by kwren View Post
I think that statement should read... "in everyone's view". Pushing as gospel your "limited expertise" as the "only thing" does indicate exactly what you think it indicates... "your way is the only way".

Keep in mind that you are not unique, Trevor. Nobody on earth knows everything and it is futile to try to convince people that you do.

Keith
Keith, what you think in order to throw mud, is irrelevant within this thread. Please confine yourself towards helping laserx.

Straight honest thinking, would have disclosed that I have not promoted my view, but have stated what is a matter of fact. You will also become aware regarding gospel and fact.

It is a fact that a registered fault code specifically covering an individual sensor, is confined to a fault within that component or associated circuitry. The code does not indicate that the sensor is signalling a fault condition which it is correctly detecting. This is a matter which requires no specific expertise, no unique understanding, involves only common sense and does not amount to a personal opinion.
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  #23  
Old 07-10-2010, 10:02 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by Trevor View Post

It is a fact that a registered fault code specifically covering an individual sensor, is confined to a fault within that component or associated circuitry.
In my case the 02 sensor fault code is not is confined to a fault within that 02 sensor component or associated circuitry.

Why keep pushing as fact something you don't understand.

Keith
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  #24  
Old 07-10-2010, 10:40 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
sowise

You hold the advantage of addressing me in person, from a position of obscurity.
What is that even supposed to mean or refer to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
You acknowledge, --- “I think everyone intends to help but with an intermittent problem it is a wild goose chase in some respects.”

It is my opinion that the goose described is far too wild and chasing it ahead of a more logical approach is not good advice for laserx to follow, particularly as he is paying for the work involved. N.B. e.g. the now concealed post #15, inserted by Tom.
I think I gave a good example of why it is a wild goose chase, one code for the rear sensor could be cause by numerous systems operating incorrectly. My suggestions were simple easy to do and didn't really require tools or anything beyond basic knowledge. I will rarely recommend to people without knowledge of their skill level to get a multimeter and do continuity checks or check for voltage. Most people don't even have a multimeter and some don't know how to use it. Visual inspections are to look for the obvious, when nothing obvious can be found then you go deeper. How is that not logical? My approach would not have cost him money. It was a check this check that and btw how about some more info.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
It is unfortunate that in your view, putting forward an opinion backed with evidence, gives the impression that my intent is indicate that my way is the only way, when the real object is to emphasise what is best in the interests of the person requiring assistance.
My opinion backed with evidence? I gave suggestions backed by facts to support. Your suggestion is backed in what I provided as well, you should be happy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
It is a fact that a registered fault code specifically covering an individual sensor, is confined to a fault within that component or associated circuitry. The code does not indicate that the sensor is signalling a fault condition which it is correctly detecting. This is a matter which requires no specific expertise, no unique understanding, involves only common sense and does not amount to a personal opinion.
Yes, it registered a fault code causing the CE, you don't know the code so how can you even say what it is or isn't doing? Let alone what sensor it actually was. All fault troubleshooting involves common sense, none of the suggestions I saw were personal opinion they were based on personal experiences with peoples own vehicles and similar code situations. Unless you see suggestions as opinions. It's the only way I can make sense of your responses.

I apologize to Laserx for turning this thread into a back and forth verbal spat. Hopefully we will hear something about how it is fixed and running great with no CE, for little to no new cost.
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  #25  
Old 07-10-2010, 11:37 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by sowise View Post

I think I gave a good example of why it is a wild goose chase, one code for the rear sensor could be cause by numerous systems operating incorrectly.
A code for the rear sensor can indicate only that the sensor or associated circuit is faulty. No other systems operating incorrectly can cause the code. The code is specifically confined to registering a component fault and not an abnormal condition which is sensed by the component.
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  #26  
Old 07-10-2010, 11:45 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
A code for the rear sensor can indicate only that the sensor or associated circuit is faulty. No other systems operating incorrectly can cause the code. The code is specifically confined to registering a component fault and not an abnormal condition which is sensed by the component.
Ok I will bite... What code is that? (OBDII) Please post the code and the diagnostic process that says it is the sensor or circuit only for the rear O2 sensor.
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  #27  
Old 07-11-2010, 03:44 AM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Ok I will bite... What code is that? (OBDII) Please post the code and the diagnostic process that says it is the sensor or circuit only for the rear O2 sensor.
Your side step is pointless. You unwisely posted --- “I think I gave a good example of why it is a wild goose chase, one code for the rear sensor could be cause by numerous systems operating incorrectly.”

It is you who is claiming that there is, or could be a code for the rear sensor. In any event, this has no relevance. What I have stated regarding the diagnostic system applies regardless. Bite off something able to be chewed sowise, otherwise, rattle your dags.
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  #28  
Old 07-11-2010, 05:06 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Bite off something able to be chewed sowise, otherwise, rattle your dags.
Trevor, you are beyond belief... Not just your continual ramblings to save face and confuse the issues with your erroneous statements, but you are beyond belief as a person.
You just never can "Zip it"

Keith
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  #29  
Old 07-11-2010, 05:19 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Originally Posted by TomsSVX View Post
This was on the 96?? You stated that the tech changed 2 02 sensors. Problem is, there are 3 in the OBDII system. The third is above the rear end of the catalytic converter. Ask the tech for the exact code which is reoccurring. I vaguely remember the rear 02 sensor description made me want to believe it was the left front.


Tom
+1. Also, my son ordered a Stebro high flow cat for his 97. When it came, it had the O2 sensor bung in the front end of the cat--wrong place for the 96 or 97. I had to have that bung filled and another installed at the back end of the cat. If you have the Stebro hi-flow cat, you might check.

Lee
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  #30  
Old 07-11-2010, 07:44 PM
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Re: Is my mechanic telling me the truth?

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Trevor, you are beyond belief... Not just your continual ramblings to save face and confuse the issues with your erroneous statements, but you are beyond belief as a person.
You just never can "Zip it"

Keith
Keith, abide by your signature and cool it.

I have had a gut full of your abuse and sarcasm.

In order to confirm your current nastiness, you must prove where I have made an "erroneous" statement. Otherwise, as is your habit, you excrete only hot and foul air.

Trevor.
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