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  #1  
Old 11-03-2009, 12:17 PM
davew833 davew833 is offline
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'92 tranny in a '95?

OK- the first question you're all going to ask is 'why would you WANT to...' but hypothetically, could I put a '92 AWD tranny into a '95 AWD, and what else would I have to change out. TCU? Rear diff? Hollander says they DO NOT interchange, but anyone with real-world experience?
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  #2  
Old 11-03-2009, 02:38 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

If it is a 92 SVX trans Dave, I don't see why it would not be OK. Diff ratio, TCU are the same.
May be not the best model as the latter ones had a lot of problems fixed.

Harvey.
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  #3  
Old 11-05-2009, 11:53 PM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
If it is a 92 SVX trans Dave, I don't see why it would not be OK. Diff ratio, TCU are the same.
May be not the best model as the latter ones had a lot of problems fixed.

Harvey.


The above is wrong, or the statement below, which has never been confirmed, is wrong. ----

Gearshift Maps, #189

http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/show...=46581&page=13

The early ones 92 to 94, used a Normally open C solenoid. Later was 95 to 97. Used a Normally closed solenoid.

Harvey.


Wrong one way or the another. Which way, what way?
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Last edited by Trevor; 11-06-2009 at 12:00 AM. Reason: [I]
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  #4  
Old 11-06-2009, 04:02 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
The above is wrong, or the statement below, which has never been confirmed, is wrong. ----

Gearshift Maps, #189

http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/show...=46581&page=13

The early ones 92 to 94, used a Normally open C solenoid. Later was 95 to 97. Used a Normally closed solenoid.

Harvey.


Wrong one way or the another. Which way, what way?
No the post is correct, you are wrong.

Dave is using all US transmissions. All the US models are interchangeable, they always used the NC solenoid.
The boxes that we were talking about on the Gearshift maps were all VTD boxes, that did have the solenoid change.

Harvey.
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  #5  
Old 11-07-2009, 03:18 AM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
No the post is correct, you are wrong.

Dave is using all US transmissions. All the US models are interchangeable, they always used the NC solenoid.
The boxes that we were talking about on the Gearshift maps were all VTD boxes, that did have the solenoid change.

Harvey.
Understood and you have my apologies.

However, # 189 remains waiting answers, having as of old been side stepped.
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  #6  
Old 11-07-2009, 08:37 AM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
No the post is correct, you are wrong.

Dave is using all US transmissions. All the US models are interchangeable, they always used the NC solenoid.
The boxes that we were talking about on the Gearshift maps were all VTD boxes, that did have the solenoid change.

Harvey.
I agree with you but I find it strange that when you go to 1stSubaruParts.com and check out trannies there are very different prices for different years.

Lee
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  #7  
Old 11-07-2009, 04:45 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
Understood and you have my apologies.

However, # 189 remains waiting answers, having as of old been side stepped.
OK no worries.
Post #189 of the Gearshift Maps, is my post. What was the question that I side stepped?

Quote:
Lee: I agree with you but I find it strange that when you go to 1stSubaruParts.com and check out trannies there are very different prices for different years.
Lee.

I have have no idea why Lee, us foreigners are not allowed to access those US part look-ups, so I can't tell if they changed the C solenoid for a later variation of the same solenoid.
Does make it hard to sort these things out.

Harvey.
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  #8  
Old 11-07-2009, 06:26 PM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
OK no worries.
Post #189 of the Gearshift Maps, is my post. What was the question that I side stepped? Harvey.
#194 If the car “can sit still on the grass spinning both back wheels.” the clutch is surely not closed. Everything indicates, that in fact there has been no change in the C solenoid. What evidence is available supporting the statement, which claims a change has taken place?

#204 Are you stating that you now have the fuse switch, permanently installed ?

#206. Explanation.
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  #9  
Old 11-07-2009, 07:53 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
#194 If the car “can sit still on the grass spinning both back wheels.” the clutch is surely not closed. Everything indicates, that in fact there has been no change in the C solenoid. What evidence is available supporting the statement, which claims a change has taken place?

#204 Are you stating that you now have the fuse switch, permanently installed ?

#206. Explanation.
I did really explain most of that in my post #201.
http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/show...&postcount=201
The Aust and Japanese spare parts both say that the part changed, from the early Normally open to the Normally closed part.

Yes I have the fuse in to release the clutch. as the program that Phil copied was for an early car.
Phil has since done another EPROM using my 95 program, that I will fit, to fix the problem, and I can then pull the fuse and have the clutch work properly.

Harvey.
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  #10  
Old 11-08-2009, 03:25 AM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
I did really explain most of that in my post #201.
http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/show...&postcount=201
The Aust and Japanese spare parts both say that the part changed, from the early Normally open to the Normally closed part.

Yes I have the fuse in to release the clutch. as the program that Phil copied was for an early car.
Phil has since done another EPROM using my 95 program, that I will fit, to fix the problem, and I can then pull the fuse and have the clutch work properly. Harvey.
This must mean that you have constant 36 --64 front rear bias. This will provide you with an interesting insight into the real value of the normal TCU control and brings up the question, as to whether there is any real difference in handling under normal driving conditions. Can you shed some light on this, as it will be of general interest?

It is not clear as to whether you actually have a normally close, or a normally open C solenoid fitted at present, i.e. when you are running with the fuse switch in place. Please advise in this regard as NiftySVX also requires this information.
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  #11  
Old 11-08-2009, 11:08 AM
NiftySVX NiftySVX is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

A 92 trans will run just fine in a 95. I have a 92 trans in my 94. As long as you're not switching between FWD and AWD, or between ACT-4 and VTD, the trans is the same (except of course all the updates). The TCU between a 92 and 95 is slightly different but it is inconsequential to the operation of the trans. It is some minor and seemingly pointless logic tweaks if i recall.
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  #12  
Old 11-08-2009, 03:32 PM
davew833 davew833 is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Thanks for all the relevant answers!
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  #13  
Old 11-08-2009, 03:56 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
This must mean that you have constant 36 --64 front rear bias. This will provide you with an interesting insight into the real value of the normal TCU control and brings up the question, as to whether there is any real difference in handling under normal driving conditions. Can you shed some light on this, as it will be of general interest?

It is not clear as to whether you actually have a normally close, or a normally open C solenoid fitted at present, i.e. when you are running with the fuse switch in place. Please advise in this regard as NiftySVX also requires this information.
The original NC solenoid is still fitted. When I changed the EPROM and had binding, I thought that the C solenoid was the trouble, it was when I went to buy a new one, that I found that there was a difference in the latter models.
I decided to try fitting the fuse to see which way it would work, and found that is was giving the opposite results. Instead of locking the clutch, it turned it off, so I have been running it like that, till we could charge the EPROM program for the latter one.

I can't detect any difference in the way the car drives, other than it's willingness to spin the back wheels in any slippery conditions.
Although it is 36F/64R on the straight road, it still has the VTD function to change torque in corners by shifting torque to the front wheels. The tighter the corner, the more torque is applied to the front, so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners, as it did with the clutch working.

I believe the real function of the clutch, is the same as the clutch in the US transfer model, and that is to;
1. Stop wheel spin when it starts.
2. Apply the clutch in accordance with road speed, gear position and amount of throttle applied to prevent wheel spin.

Harvey.
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  #14  
Old 11-08-2009, 05:53 PM
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oab_au View Post
The original NC solenoid is still fitted. When I changed the EPROM and had binding, I thought that the C solenoid was the trouble, it was when I went to buy a new one, that I found that there was a difference in the latter models.
I decided to try fitting the fuse to see which way it would work, and found that is was giving the opposite results. Instead of locking the clutch, it turned it off, so I have been running it like that, till we could charge the EPROM program for the latter one.

I can't detect any difference in the way the car drives, other than it's willingness to spin the back wheels in any slippery conditions.
Although it is 36F/64R on the straight road, it still has the VTD function to change torque in corners by shifting torque to the front wheels. The tighter the corner, the more torque is applied to the front, so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners, as it did with the clutch working.

I believe the real function of the clutch, is the same as the clutch in the US transfer model, and that is to;
1. Stop wheel spin when it starts.
2. Apply the clutch in accordance with road speed, gear position and amount of throttle applied to prevent wheel spin.

Harvey.
You advise that, “the original NC solenoid is still fitted.” Have you ever physically confirmed by examination, that the solenoid still fitted to your SVX is in fact a normally closed device?

You state that --- “it still has the VTD function to change torque in corners by shifting torque to the front wheels. The tighter the corner, the more torque is applied to the front, so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners, as it did with the clutch working."

Just how do you contend that there can be a variation/change, increasing torque bias towards the front during cornering, when the clutch operation has been overridden by means of the fuse switch?

My considerable experience, gained during successfully racing several front wheel drive cars, does not confirm the idea such that, “so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners.” This I believe is simply advertising blurb to which you were no doubt exposed, created by Citroen during and post the mid thirties.

In practice the front wheels lose traction in tight corners, the inside one or both, even in spite of an after market optional LSD, and well before there can be any useful advantage as you describe. Absolute understeer is the crucial inhibiting factor, which calls for a special driving technique. During sedate cornering no advantage can be detected, and even then attendant disadvantages are apparent.

The real front drive advantage is the better use of available load space, rather than handling, which is in fact compromised, as is well proven via motor racing. However there is no denial that coping with the built in negative characteristics can be great fun, if you are skilled and appreciate what is involved. Hand brake turns are another issue.
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  #15  
Old 11-08-2009, 09:37 PM
oab_au oab_au is offline
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Re: '92 tranny in a '95?

[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor View Post
You advise that, “the original NC solenoid is still fitted.” Have you ever physically confirmed by examination, that the solenoid still fitted to your SVX is in fact a normally closed device?
The replacement solenoid that I purchased for the VIN No. of my model is a NC solenoid, and the action of it when the fuse is in, confirms it to me.

Quote:
You state that --- “it still has the VTD function to change torque in corners by shifting torque to the front wheels. The tighter the corner, the more torque is applied to the front, so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners, as it did with the clutch working."

Just how do you contend that there can be a variation/change, increasing torque bias towards the front during cornering, when the clutch operation has been overridden by means of the fuse switch?
Due to the way the epicyclic center is constructed with different leverage through the different size gears to the front/rear. When the front wheels rotate faster than the rear, the gears start to rotate at a different speed to each other, as the front are turning faster, they have a lower reduction. This results in a higher torque delivered to them.

Quote:
My considerable experience, gained during successfully racing several front wheel drive cars, does not confirm the idea such that, “so it still has the same ability to accelerate hard around tight corners.” This I believe is simply advertising blurb to which you were no doubt exposed, created by Citroen during and post the mid thirties.
I was never a fan of front wheel drive cars. Did not need advice from advertising blurb, to form an opinion of them. The action of the VTD can not be compared to them.

Harvey.
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