Dodge brings back Charger, Could SVX comeback?

And the Holden Monaro is a two door Commodore.

[NapaBavarian]

I, personally, wouldn't want to see a new SVX, the SVX is just too perfect despite its flaws, so why try to improve it? Give it a big brother instead, a new Alcyone with a different moniker that is to the SVX what the SVX is to the XT6. Whenever an almost perfect car is copied the charm is almost always lost, even if the new generation is better in many ways.

Oh yeah, why is the new twisted wedge called a Hemi?

Chike has the right idea. It's possible Subaru would sell another 2 door luxury coupe. But it won't look anything like the SVX, and Subaru would never bring the SVX name out of the garbage bin. The "newer version" of the SVX would be very different in appearance and have a new name. Think of the Baja. It's a re-done BRAT, right? But obviously Subaru wasn't going to make an exact clone of the BRAT, and they certainly weren't going to use the BRAT name. So we got the Baja which is similar to the BRAT but also very different.

Only if the SVX had been very successful would Subaru even consider re-using its name. But it wasn't. Not even close. It failed and it cost Subaru a lot of time and money. Why would they want to be reminded of this failure?

Dave


P.S. for those who like the Baja....get 'em while they last. Subaru will end production in the near future. Another oddity in the Subaru Hall of Shame.

[MaxImUmZ]

Nissan brought back the z and look what that did in final the years of sales here

Originally Posted by MaxImUmZ

Nissan brought back the z and look what that did in final the years of sales here

The Z was very popular back in the day. It might have fizzed out, but it was popular enough at one time to justify a second chance.



Dave

[EddieSVX]

I think it all boils down to 2 things: Timing and Marketing.

When the SVX was first introduced, Subaru hadn't really built up enough reputation to easily justify a car in its price range. Also, they were pretty green, and perhaps not agressive enough in their marketing tactics.

The timing of the WRX (for US market) was such that it occured right after more people in their target audience had become highly interested in high-performance turbocharged AWD vehicles.. Before then, Civics were a dime a dozen (well, figure of speech regarding popularity, not price)... Now, I pass at least 8 different WRX's on my way to work every morning.

The car virtually sells itself, as it stands. Subaru has come a long ways in terms of their marketing abilities.

Even at the price premium, the STi has proven just as popular. It goes to show that Subaru has entered a phase where they can afford to build up on a platform and expect consumers to pay a price premium... They've developed a reputation founded on trust.

If they decided to bring a successor to the XT and SVX as a flagship car, on a limited (relatively speaking) production basis, I don't see why, today, it wouldn't be a success within their target expectations.

I personally think they've grown up enough to make it happen.

[MaxImUmZ]

Originally Posted by red95svx

The Z was very popular back in the day. It might have fizzed out, but it was popular enough at one time to justify a second chance.



Dave

yea I know, I was just kinda thinking maybe no one would notice the 30 some years of history behind it. It was early, leave me alone

Originally Posted by MaxImUmZ

yea I know, I was just kinda thinking maybe no one would notice the 30 some years of history behind it. It was early, leave me alone

Dave

Originally Posted by EddieSVX

When the SVX was first introduced, Subaru hadn't really built up enough reputation to easily justify a car in its price range. Also, they were pretty green, and perhaps not agressive enough in their marketing tactics.

I personally think they've grown up enough to make it happen.

Very true. I remember reading something that said the SVX was $10,000 more than any other Subaru for sale in 1992. I don't know if that's true, but the SVX was too expensive for a Subaru at that time. They should have sold it under a different brand name.....like how Toyota sells Lexus or Honda sells Acura. I do also think they could sell a luxury coupe now if they tried.


Dave

I think it was just the price of the car was way too high. If inflation is 2.5% a year then the car would cost $33,125 today. Maybe a little bit would be the name brand Subaru but I don't think anyone under 30 back in 1992 would say no! to an SVX.

[EddieSVX]

Originally Posted by legacy852

I think it was just the price of the car was way too high. If inflation is 2.5% a year then the car would cost $33,125 today. Maybe a little bit would be the name brand Subaru but I don't think anyone under 30 back in 1992 would say no! to an SVX.

28,000 ~ 32,000 (price of an LS-L model in '92/93) translates to about 42 ~ $44,000 of today's money at a 2.5% inflation rate. It was a pretty expensive car.

[dcarrb]

Originally Posted by red95svx

Very true. I remember reading something that said the SVX was $10,000 more than any other Subaru for sale in 1992. I don't know if that's true, but the SVX was too expensive for a Subaru at that time.

My first exposure to the SVX was a magazine article I read in a doctor's office concerning the car's introduction. I went home and told my then-wife about this amazing-looking new Subaru that was going to cost from $26,000 to $28,000. Man, we wanted one. But we'd recently bought a Legacy (for something like sixteen grand, as I recall), and already had a GL wagon and Mustang sitting in the yard, neither of which I wanted to part with, and we figured we'd take a beating on trade-in and decided that 26-large was just too much to pay for ANY car.

dcb

[TomsSVX]

In my humble opinion if subaru were t bring back the SVX it would quite a show. With it's sleek styling and known reputation for awd power and compfort it would probobly sell at great lengths with the right marketing. I wish I was a talented enough sketch pad artist to draw out my ideas because I have an excellent plot out for the new SVX. This would include a 3.? H6 twin turbocharged engine backed by 5eat or an optional 6mt. The interior would be very luxurious much like the new tribecca with swooping curves and functionality to boot. the exterior styling would be much like the SVX we have all come to love with it's wide yet low stance and a sweet ass. The front end I would personally redo to go with the times with a little more edga and more of a wide body look to the front fenders. The headlights would look much like the lights you see on the current C6 with a non-optional HID display. I wold love to say shoot for about 500hp at the crank with a well tuned engine but this would never go in such a car so 400 would be a better bet. The cooling system would included an all aluminum radiator to keep those plastic tanks from cracking and less of an offset on the wheels to keep the wheel bearings a little longer. the diffs would need to be beefed up along with the axles. It would roll off the line with 18" wheels strapped with 255/45 r18 Pirelli Pzero nero's. THe dual exhaust would be like the current configuration only dual all the way back with a balance pipe before the rear into two monza mufflers. Not to mention for people who would like to tune this supercar more, there should be a jack in the interior to plug in a laptop with SUbaru software and be able to tune the car with the mods done as to keep from rewriting ecus. This would also void any type of warranty to try at your own risk. I dunno why i just threw that out there but I thought it would be cool to share. Oh and don't forget the Brembo brakes on all 4 corners and a stock koni suspension with thick arse swap bars to ride on rails. This car would be in coupe form that would maintain the half windows for sleek styling and great functionality. My new SVX would prob come with a pirce tag just over 60k. the car wuld not lose it's GT heritage as it would still be able to be driven nicely with the koni's turned down. HEHEHE I gotta build my own car

Tom

[EddieSVX]

Originally Posted by tomssvx

In my humble opinion if subaru were t bring back the SVX it would quite a show. With it's sleek styling and known reputation for awd power and compfort it would probobly sell at great lengths with the right marketing. I wish I was a talented enough sketch pad artist to draw out my ideas because I have an excellent plot out for the new SVX. This would include a 3.? H6 twin turbocharged engine backed by 5eat or an optional 6mt. The interior would be very luxurious much like the new tribecca with swooping curves and functionality to boot. the exterior styling would be much like the SVX we have all come to love with it's wide yet low stance and a sweet ass. The front end I would personally redo to go with the times with a little more edga and more of a wide body look to the front fenders. The headlights would look much like the lights you see on the current C6 with a non-optional HID display. I wold love to say shoot for about 500hp at the crank with a well tuned engine but this would never go in such a car so 400 would be a better bet. The cooling system would included an all aluminum radiator to keep those plastic tanks from cracking and less of an offset on the wheels to keep the wheel bearings a little longer. the diffs would need to be beefed up along with the axles. It would roll off the line with 18" wheels strapped with 255/45 r18 Pirelli Pzero nero's. THe dual exhaust would be like the current configuration only dual all the way back with a balance pipe before the rear into two monza mufflers. Not to mention for people who would like to tune this supercar more, there should be a jack in the interior to plug in a laptop with SUbaru software and be able to tune the car with the mods done as to keep from rewriting ecus. This would also void any type of warranty to try at your own risk. I dunno why i just threw that out there but I thought it would be cool to share. Oh and don't forget the Brembo brakes on all 4 corners and a stock koni suspension with thick arse swap bars to ride on rails. This car would be in coupe form that would maintain the half windows for sleek styling and great functionality. My new SVX would prob come with a pirce tag just over 60k. the car wuld not lose it's GT heritage as it would still be able to be driven nicely with the koni's turned down. HEHEHE I gotta build my own car

Tom

Sounds like a dream SVX... I like it.

Well, all but the price tag. At 60 large, I would probably consider a used 911 Carrera 4S instead...

In order for Subaru to successfully market a new flagship luxury coupe, it would need to keep its price tag wll under the $45k mark. Basically, it would scale out to the same pricing range as back in '92, but banking on the idea that it is now the right time for Subaru to do this.

Re: Timing, marketing, and foisting our own hopes and dreams onto the shoulders of reality.

The WRX/STi were not particularly marketed by Subaru at all. If anything, Subaru, Mitsubishi, and to a lesser extent, Nissan, should be cutting checks to Polyphony Digital. Although the internationally savvy car enthusiast was aware of the old GC8 turbo Imprezas and Evo II and III Lancers, the Gran Turismo series did most of the work in exposing these cars to the general consciousness of the North American automotive world. Go find a mainstream car magazine article about an Impreza WRX or Lancer Evolution that predates the release of the first Gran Turismo game. Now compare it to the ramped up frenzy of articles that date from GT2 to when the first US-legal copies of the WRX and Evo hit US shores. GT had everything to do with making these cars an aspirational object, and in the world of car marketing beyond the $25000 family sedan plateau, that is king. All Subaru and Mitsubishi had to do when the WRX and Evo were ready, was to just make people aware that they were for sale now. Everyone who was going to buy one already knew the salient points: the quickness, traction, power, heritage, and pedigree were never needed to make people want one. They already knew about it and already wanted one before the first ad ever appeared in print, or on the airwaves.

So the WRX/STi gets a pass as not being truly representative of Subaru's marketing prowress, or their place in the pantheon of the American consumer's list of desireable automobiles. They don't really count, since Subaru didn't have to exert much effort at all to get people to want one.

It's a tricky business, the idea of becoming an aspirational nameplate. Toyota has neatly pulled it off with Lexus, while Nissan and Honda have been much less successful doing it with Infiniti and Acura, respectively, and Mazda never got the chance after it canned the Amati project at the beginning of the '90s. While you never hear anyone really pine to own an RL or a Q45, Lexus has managed to position itself among the big three German brands in terms of being something that people want - in addition to being objectively very good - simply for the cachet that buying it represents. A Legacy GT is probably 99% of the car a BMW 530 is, and probably a better car then a 3-Series, but most people will disagree. And not for any better reason then they are responding to a shared societal view that because people want BMWs, then they must be better then other cars, so they want one too.

As it is, Subaru is not a particularly aspirational nameplate. Not counting the WRX/STi, which, as niche products, are fantastic to have but won't make or break the company, the Outback is really the only nameplate that represents something that the great unwashed masses view as a car to long for. The Outback has great brand equity, and even though I got sticker shock just looking at a new one the other day, Subaru is on the cusp of that great automotive position of being able to have people pay the sticker because the nameplate, in their mind, is worth it. The Legacy GT, on the other hand, is a fantastic car that is not getting nearly enough of a marketing push from Subaru. This is a car that in every way except perhaps at the ragged edge of cornering limits, can stand in with any $30-$40K sedan in the world, and some that are pricier even then that. It is too good of a car to be relegated to the bottom of people's shopping lists.

Time will tell, but Subaru is making some inroads into the game of being an object of desire, and not simply bought because they are "Inexpensive and built to stay that way". That's the difference between an also-ran and a frontrunner. Mitsubishi says "Buy a Galant because it's as good as a Camry!", while Toyota says "Buy a Camry because it's a Camry!". The Outback is a good start to build on. If they can convince more people to make an emotional connection between an Impreza 2.5 and the STi, so much the better. If they can successfully market the Tribeca then they are marketing gods.

Ultimately though, all of Subaru's products are a reflection of the brand values Subaru stands for in a way that the SVX wasn't. Subarus reflect practicality, ruggedness, the allure of AWD traction, dependability, and some surprisingly quick, athletic versions of such. When people think of Subarus, they don't generally think of large, opulent, expensive grand touring coupes. And there's nothing wrong with that. Success for Subaru will be based on continually playing to their strengths (and convincing people that the new corporate schnozz is great design), and continually improving upon what they do best. Best to stick with what you're good with and not be distracted by shiny objects along the way.

Personally, I'd much rather not see an attempt at another SVX. The SVX is special partially because it didn't fit in at the time. It was wasn't the right car for Subaru to devote resources to, but they did anyhow. No one understood them when they came out, and dealers had struggled to give them away after they did. Only the devoted few saw all the good things hidden under that unconvential skin, and as time passes by they will be more and more rare, more and more special, and hindsight will provide more and more appreciation of what they really were. Think of some other examples of the breed: the split window Corvette, the Shelby Cobra, the Tucker Torpedo, the Chrysler Airflow, the Dodge Charger Daytona. All outrageously styled, all sold like coldcakes, all now highly desireable and loved. That's not bad company to be in.