Pontiac/Holden...Vauxhall?

[Trevor]

[QUOTE= like the shroud over the EG33 throttle body... trashed it too...[/QUOTE]

You'll do me.

[Beav]

Originally Posted by Boxer6SVX

I dunno. I love my 840Ci... They may be expensive to repair but hey... If you can afford to buy one you should be able to afford repair bills. Anything can break on any car. Left front axle broke on the 01 S4 I drove in California... $3000 later it was back on the road. But its a $50k car... expensive cars are expensive parts. I wont even bother doing anything to my BMW myself... Germans have a really screwed up way of designing things and it takes like 8 hex nuts to even get the air filter cartridge open.... But oh hell does it fly.

Sometimes I miss the simplicity of my Mustang... And other times I look in the parking lot and just love my Bimmer... its all in what you like. Just SOMEONE explain to me why BMW has to put those pointless engine bay shrouds over EVERYTHING!!?? First thing I did was remove mine... Serves NO purpose... like the shroud over the EG33 throttle body... trashed it too...

That's kinda my point. It's not close to being a $50k car, you just paid that much for it. Life Lesson #1 > The most expensive thing any of us will ever purchase is perception. Difficult to place a dollar figure on enjoyment. Just don't confuse it with value.

Engine shrouds serve a few purposes: aesthetic, heat insulation and noise insulation.

[Shadow248]

Originally Posted by Boxer6SVX

Anyway back on subject. Holden is a good company but just because they share ownership with GM doesnt mean they use alot of the same parts. GM doesnt have a 4.5L v8 here just like the Falcons 302 and inline 6 arent used here either.

I was surprised to see that some didn't know that Holden was GM. Also surprised to see that some apparently don't know that just because it's called a "4.5L", that doesn't mean that it's actually 4.5L. Case in point, the motor in my very own car. Called a 350, it's actually a 346. The "6.0L" LS2 is actually a 6.1L motor.

That 4.5L "holden motor" IS sold here in the US as a 4.6L (Bonneville GXP, Cadillac). That 302 WILL be sold here starting spring 2008 in a certain returning musclecar who's name I won't mention. BTW, that inline six wouldn't happen to be around 4.2L, would it? If so, it's here too. All that said, I certainly wouldn't be surprised to find that there are a few engines they got that we don't, even though they are all GM powerplants. Always seems to happen that way, even with American automakers. Everybody but us get the cool cars.

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by Beav

That's kinda my point. It's not close to being a $50k car, you just paid that much for it. Life Lesson #1 > The most expensive thing any of us will ever purchase is perception. Difficult to place a dollar figure on enjoyment. Just don't confuse it with value.

Engine shrouds serve a few purposes: aesthetic, heat insulation and noise insulation.

Sorry Beav, don't agree. Only two. Please leave out "aesthetic".

P.S. Your first analysis is spot on. I like it. Advertising agents thrive on the concept.

[Boxer6SVX]

If someone will pay 30 grand for a stripped down Evo MR then I'll gladly pay 20 more for something with a reputation lol. I paid 28k for my S4 btw. I also paid 26k for my 840Ci. Funny how the value in European cars drops so fast. Contrasts car like the 03/04 Terminator Cobras which are still worth practically what they were new. Unlike the GTO.. They drop like rocks.

As far as the shrouds purposes... I hadly see a thin piece of plastic playing a noticeable difference in heat or noise dissipation... Most of us have intakes, exhaust, etc so obviously noise reduction isnt a major priority So that leaves heat insulation.... If thats such a big deal the how come the SVX doesnt have one covering the entire engine too? lol I say this myth is busted.

[Beav]

Well, the reason they drop so fast is the 'perception' has worn off, leaving you with a lot less. I'm not trying to tell anyone they shouldn't buy what they want or that they have bad taste, etc. I certainly don't want anyone telling me the same so .... Buy what makes you happy. Just realize the difference between enjoyment and value.

[Boxer6SVX]

Enjoyment... for some its luxury, others its performance... For some its just being able to say you own a certain car. I loved saying I owned an SVX or having a crowd of people at a gas station looking at the windows even lol. IF i had my way I'd have an Elise. But the BMW fit the budget and its kind of nice to be part of an elite group, just like the SVX owners here.

[crusader8]

Hmmm, I'll just give my view of the grappy new GTO thats just a holden vaux/ whatever as reading the first post and skimming the rest. Ive got alot of driving time in the 05 LS2 GTO and none in its overseas counterparts. The seats in the GTO are rediculously comfy. the LS2's 400hp push the car along swimmingly. The car Ive driven has been in the shop once for hitting a deer @ 75mph. Parts were a premium, having to wait a week or two for parts coming from aust. Dont see a problem with the goat at all? Great short cut by GM...

EDIT: GM's risk taking days are over. Their elite group is the vette. they put no money elsewere cause they got none. the good ole days are over for them. People look at my truck and dont believe its out of the factory. like people look at your windows and say WTF?

[Boxer6SVX]

Why put money in a fiberglass coffin? Its the lowest production car in their lineup and i see hardly any here in DC. For the money you can have a nicer car. the LS2 is a nice engine for a pushrod but lets get real here, pushrods are a design of yesteryear and its time they started an OHC engine program. the LS series engines are showing their age just like the LT's. 6.0L is a big engine to only make 400hp. Ford makes 300 with only 4.6L and Subaru makes over 300 with a boxer 4.
If GM wants to remain profitable they need to invest in mainstream models like Toyota does. Toyota is successful because of cars like the camry. They dont dump money in low production cars. Put your money where it will make money.

[crusader8]

your speaking the truth...as a GM lover, its true, they are going in the wrong direction. Ill just stay back in the good days when they built my truck and made 280hp and 360ft/lbs on a 4.3 My old trucks prob the only GM im ever gonna own cause they just arent what they used to be. Id rather have something thats gonna last then some of the **** they put out.

[Speedklix]

Originally Posted by Beav

I guess it has been a while since you've seen that. GM dropped Subaru some time ago. Their only joint venture that actually produced something was the Saab 9-2x (WRX). Currently GM is wafting on whether or not to cut Saab loose.

I read that the offerwas made since there was an apparent niche waiting to be filled in india, but no way to reach it.... Chevy Forester. For some reason I remember also seeing that GM took the bite to put out an AWD option for the then, soon to be released G6.... never mentioned afterwords though. When the plan failed, GM also ran into a bit of a financial bind and deicided to drop cost and recoup some revs by liquidating all of it's Subaru stock ASAP.

The 9-2x was a horrible slap, but it certainly made the "WRX" more affordable for some. There were some other subaru technologies exploited by "SAAB" but so what. The biggest I think as already been named. They were supposed to be dropped with the shares, there was an agreement made to continue the sale of the 9-2x alone, but guess what!

[benebob]

Originally Posted by Boxer6SVX

Toyota is successful because of cars like the camry. They dont dump money in low production cars. Put your money where it will make money.

What's that about the NSX competition they have coming out next year with a V-10? Wait, Toy must've made a huge profit on the last gen Supra to make it worthwhile! Flagships showing talent of the designers is an very important part of brand awareness. Actually my guess is GM throws more money at the midsized car segment than does both Toy and Honda combined. That just throw it at the 6-7 models they have competing against eachother and all the other mid-sizers.

[PDSides]

Parts bin cars have been around for forty years now, and some of them were great. The original Mustang was a parts bin car. How about Subaru making a parts bin car for us? A two-seater AWD sports car that would blow the doors off the competition. Its all there, in the parts bin just waiting for the order to come down from on-high. When?
Preston

[Boxer6SVX]

NSX is a Honda by the way, NOT Toyota. The NSX has been discontinued if you didnt know. Last year Honda sold 23 NSX's. Theyre putting money in cars that sell 2-300,000 a year into the accord and hybrid technology which is common sense to me. Also Toyota has no concrete intentions of bringing the Supra back now. They have toyed with it but Im glad theres a manufacturer thats putting their money into an everday car for everyone. Not everyone is going to buy a Supra but a LOT of people will buy and are buying Camry's. I For one HATE the Celica but thats just me. The Japanese have taken their culture ideals and put them into corporate innovations by catering to the public. I dont want a 400hp GTO, I dont want a fiberglass corvette. I want something I can live with and keep for a long time. I think thats most anyone. And btw Crusader I love the typhoon and the sister vehicle. Cool idea. Tow a boat and then go take out a Mustang or two. More or less a crossover vehicle like the Trailblazer SS.

GM needs to invest in the Impala/G8 platform, make it rear wheel drive and go from there instead of spreading already dwindling funds into multiple cars. For example Im glad Ford is dropping the Taurus and Crown Vic. I love the fusion and an SVT version of it is rumored as well. The Focus RS is coming with a Volvo I-5T and all wheel drive. thats what Im talkin about. American cars need to be less American persay in its pursuits of the elite car buyer. Elite low productions cars dont make a car company profitable, everday average production cars do. Thats where the Taurus SHO and the current Impala SS/ Grand Prix GXP come in. make performance versions of average cars and make that a niche. Most people buy things with 4 doors. Just like the first Mustang aimed to do. Depending on who u were you could have an sporty economy car or a drag nightmare all in one car. Thats what they need to do. Give people choices in one platform. And technology is proving you can have performance, fuel economy, and reliability in one package. Take the GP GXP, you have 303hp, 28mpg, and room for 5... it caters to everyone. We need more like that. Im just SO glad the G8 will be a rear drive platform. Screw front wheel drive... thats about as performance oriented as a Ford Festiva on bike tires and the GXP cant put 303hp down effectively with fwd. I raced a Lexus IS350 in a GXP rental and it had me by the balls because its rwd. Even the japanese are making rear drive performance... why cant the americans put pride aside and learn a lesson from the foreigners... its not all bad.

[oab_au]

Well it looks like you are going to get some of the same. It was just announced here what we are going to build the new "Holden Monaro/Pontiac GTO." here and send them over to you.

Harvey.
Ps. these are going to be built out of the Australian parts bin.