who likes Bush?

[andrew.anderson]

Tiger,

My apologies. I have not been getting alot of sleep here.

Mike621,

See post # 44

[Phast SVX]

will somebody lock this thread already! i think everyone should agree that a lot of memebers agree to disagree!

[andrew.anderson]

Your right. We should all just get along and sing happy songs.

[Speedklix]

Originally Posted by andrew.anderson

Your right. We should all just get along and sing happy songs.

Gonna find my baby, gonna hold her tight Gonna grab some afternoooooon delight My motto's always been 'when it's right, it's right' Why wait until the middle of a cold dark night?

[Royal Tiger]

I appologize to Mike for the use of the strong word "loser" for his blindly assuming that anyone who fights for his country does so out of a so called need of a power trip because they have nothing else in their life. I also appolgize for all the idiotic protestors I've run into who would rather act like angry 6 year olds then actively try and change what they are so upset about in the first place. Truly America is great because we protect mock abortions on street corners in full view of 5th graders in the name of free speech.

[NapaBavarian]

A friend of mine got back from the death zone recently, and from talking to him it was just like any other job. The boss tells you what to do, then as you go about doing your job he tells you not to do it the way you are doing it, but dosn't have a better solution, finally he gets upset that it dosn't get completed.

One of his buddies was shot at, by the time his buddy got turned arround and shot the asailent the attacker was shot in the back, then the attacked got in hot water...WTF??? If he hadn't shot then the attacker would have shot someone else

One thing that keeps drawing this out is the fact that the boys over there are often not allowed to fully do their jobs, then blamed for a poor outcome

[andrew.anderson]

Originally Posted by NapaBavarian

One of his buddies was shot at, by the time his buddy got turned arround and shot the asailent the attacker was shot in the back, then the attacked got in hot water...WTF??? If he hadn't shot then the attacker would have shot someone else

One thing that keeps drawing this out is the fact that the boys over there are often not allowed to fully do their jobs, then blamed for a poor outcome

Alot of this is due to the militaries fear of the negative media attention. This has resulted in the military creating too stringent ROE's and propogating a fear to fire mentality.

Allowing the media full access to the battle field has created all type of issues. Most media outlets fail to correctlly report the news or tell the full story.

[Electrophil]

Originally Posted by andrew.anderson

Alot of this is due to the militaries fear of the negative media attention. This has resulted in the military creating too stringent ROE's and propogating a fear to fire mentality.

Allowing the media full access to the battle field has created all type of issues. Most media outlets fail to correctlly report the news or tell the full story.

Then what is the real story? Our news media is reporting 2,322 of our military friends are dead, 16,653 wounded, and there are no WMD's. We are hearing that over 300 Iraqi civilians have died in the last 5 days due to sectarian violence, and the country is indeed now in civil war. We are hearing they still haven't settled on a governing body months after the vote, with no solution in sight...which prolongs the amount of time we must have our military in harm's way. We see video footage of concrete rubble piled up in front of homes which are half blown up, or completely destroyed.

What is the media failing to correctly report, and what is the full story?

Originally Posted by Electrophil

Then what is the real story? Our news media is reporting 2,322 of our military friends are dead, 16,653 wounded, and there are no WMD's. We are hearing that over 300 Iraqi civilians have died in the last 5 days due to sectarian violence, and the country is indeed now in civil war. We are hearing they still haven't settled on a governing body months after the vote, with no solution in sight...which prolongs the amount of time we must have our military in harm's way. We see video footage of concrete rubble piled up in front of homes which are half blown up, or completely destroyed.

What is the media failing to correctly report, and what is the full story?

Aww... c'mon... I've been posting reports of the real story... stuff written by soldiers in the field who aren't journalists by profession. If you want, there are also blogs out there by soldiers in Iraq and other places, too. I've just been concentrating on Afghanistan because that's where the Canadian troops are. Not my fault that the US media is so bad .

And you should know that the average soldier's perspective is completely different than a civilian's view from back home. They have taken an oath, and have a very specific job to do that entails obeying their political masters regardless of personal feelings. Honour and Loyalty in the Armed Services also means that many of the troops will refuse to criticize the current administration in public, which isn't really a bad thing in my mind. But there are also lots of retired vets speaking out against current Administration decisions.

You know that being in the military is not just a job, it is a whole different way of life, a different culture. They practically speak a different language, and have responsibilities that many average civilians simply don't comprehend. The few "bad apples" that get into the military are usually identified pretty quickly and either "rehabilitated" or else isolated.

I have always been a strong supporter of both the Canadian and the US military. They are doing the best they can, given their orders and the circumstances they find themselves in.

The problem isn't with the troops, but with the civilians commanding them.

[NapaBavarian]

Originally Posted by Bipa

And you should know that the average soldier's perspective is completely different than a civilian's view from back home. They have taken an oath, and have a very specific job to do that entails obeying their political masters regardless of personal feelings. Honour and Loyalty in the Armed Services also means that many of the troops will refuse to criticize the current administration in public, which isn't really a bad thing in my mind. But there are also lots of retired vets speaking out against current Administration decisions.

Agreed, and I'd like to add one more thing, they are there, we are not, no matter who tells the story it will come out to sway us in the direction they want us to go, it would be almost impossible to gain all the facts if we were right in the middle of it, being half a world away just makes it worse.

Originally Posted by Bipa

The problem isn't with the troops, but with the civilians commanding them.

[Royal Tiger]

Here's my take on the media;

Remember, oh about 10 years ago I guess, a certian ABC exec was involved in a class action lawsuit against GM over Chevy and GMC pickups with side saddle gas tanks blowing up? 20/20 did a piece and crashed one. But it didn't blow up. So they did another. And another. So finally they strapped it with explosives, and boom. After the TRUTH got out, they appologized. But GM settled 14 months later. You think they could have gotten a fair trial ANYWHERE in the US after that?

[YellowBird]

Originally Posted by Landshark

I'm gonna take the time now to answer the real question.


Bush baked beans are among the best in the nation. I do NOT buy any other brand as they just pretty much suck when compared to Bush's.

I'm not real crazy about all the different varietys, but the family always knows when I try to substitute them for a cheaper brand.


(the politics in every thread between post #1 and this post.....well we could hash those out forever and nothing would change. So why keep going there?)

Originally Posted by YellowBird

I'm gonna take the time now to answer the real question.


Bush baked beans are among the best in the nation. I do NOT buy any other brand as they just pretty much suck when compared to Bush's.

I'm not real crazy about all the different varietys, but the family always knows when I try to substitute them for a cheaper brand.


(the politics in every thread between post #1 and this post.....well we could hash those out forever and nothing would change. So why keep going there?)

I still want to know if they go well with Vodka

[Landshark]

Originally Posted by YellowBird

I'm gonna take the time now to answer the real question.


Bush baked beans are among the best in the nation. I do NOT buy any other brand as they just pretty much suck when compared to Bush's.

I'm not real crazy about all the different varietys, but the family always knows when I try to substitute them for a cheaper brand.


(the politics in every thread between post #1 and this post.....well we could hash those out forever and nothing would change. So why keep going there?)

i don't like baked beans at all. yuck.

[andrew.anderson]

Originally Posted by YellowBird

(the politics in every thread between post #1 and this post.....well we could hash those out forever and nothing would change. So why keep going there?)

Because the back and forth debate is fun and productive. It helps us to understand each others believes even if we disagree.

Plus, arguing is fun.