tranny cooler

david_12121 · #1 11-26-2011, 09:46 PM

hey guys
so i was looking through the whole forum for info and wanting to be sure, i'm asking here
i bought a hayden 402 cooler(16000 gvw) and noticed that many of you people have 26000's on and some even have 2 coolers!
so would it be bad in any way to have a 26k? doesn't it get too cold?

i'm also planning to make a how to install a tranny cooler pdf file(cuz the one in the docs isn't for attaching it to the radiator)

so in short, you take out the plastic bottom panel, then the bumper and the middle headlight thing.
then you tie the cooler to the radiator, and attach the hose to the outlet of the radiator oil cooler
can i put an oil filter in the way as well?

Green1995SVX · #2 11-27-2011, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david_12121

hey guys
so i was looking through the whole forum for info and wanting to be sure, i'm asking here
i bought a hayden 402 cooler(16000 gvw) and noticed that many of you people have 26000's on and some even have 2 coolers!
so would it be bad in any way to have a 26k? doesn't it get too cold?

i'm also planning to make a how to install a tranny cooler pdf file(cuz the one in the docs isn't for attaching it to the radiator)

so in short, you take out the plastic bottom panel, then the bumper and the middle headlight thing.
then you tie the cooler to the radiator, and attach the hose to the outlet of the radiator oil cooler
can i put an oil filter in the way as well?

There is basically no such thing as "too cold" as long as the transmission fluid temp goes above roughly 40 degrees Fahrenheit. Above that temperature, the transmission operates normally. Heat is very deadly to these transmissions. Keeping the ATF temp down is of utmost importance. If you keep the OEM radiator "cooler" in line, this will serve to heat the fluid and bring it up above 40 degrees more quickly.

david_12121 · #3 11-27-2011, 12:48 PM

so what's the biggest i can fit in there? (in front of the radiator)
these are my options so far:
hayden 405
flex-a-lite 4126
hayden 678,679

i'm guessing they all will fit but wanna be sure...

Huskymaniac · #4 11-27-2011, 02:27 PM

I disagree. From what people have said, lack of line pressure and fluid flow is what kills these transmissions. Once it starts slipping it generates huge amounts of heat. Keeping this massive heat from spiking temperatures will prolong the tranny life but it is only a temporary measure. The key is to keep the tranny from degrading in the first place. For that, one needs better flow. Keeping the stock cooler inline (series) keeps the flow resistance high. You are better off putting an external cooler in parallel or completely eliminate the stock cooler all together.

As for cooling, people in cooler climates will have issues if they put in a massive external cooler. The car isn't THAT heavy so a masive cooler simply isn't necessary unless you are trying to nurse an already failed tranny. If you go with a smaller capacity cooler to enable lockup sooner, a tube and fin cooler may actually be a better choice than a plate cooler. Small plate coolers have higher flow resistance than smaller tube and fin. When you get to the massive coolers, plate coolers have lower flow resistance. The reason is that they achieve higher cooling capacity by adding more plates in parallel. But then you have excessive cooling capacity and, in cold weather, you will have a delayed TC lockup if it locks up at all.

92snowmachine · #5 11-27-2011, 03:54 PM

i just installed a tube and fin for full size trucks and noticed that when in bypass mode (mainly only used up in the mountains) it won't lock up the torque converter until about a half hour of driving, when in series (used during daily driving during the winter) it only takes a few minutes. also the space in front of the radiator is very limited so unless you have a really good reason to put it there i would recommend to put it where the how to docs shows, only took about 1/2 hour and works just as well.

david_12121 · #6 11-27-2011, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huskymaniac

I disagree. From what people have said, lack of line pressure and fluid flow is what kills these transmissions. Once it starts slipping it generates huge amounts of heat. ...
But then you have excessive cooling capacity and, in cold weather, you will have a delayed TC lockup if it locks up at all.

i actually read one of your posts and that was why i kinda average between the huge ones and the 4110 that you recommended...i also sent you a private message which you didn't read i guess

well i live in the SF bay area and it hardly ever gets below 40F here...
is it possible to put some sort of pump in the way to increase the flow?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 92snowmachine

i just installed a tube and fin for full size trucks and noticed that when in bypass mode (mainly only used up in the mountains) it won't lock up the torque converter until about a half hour of driving, when in series (used during daily driving during the winter) it only takes a few minutes. also the space in front of the radiator is very limited so unless you have a really good reason to put it there i would recommend to put it where the how to docs shows, only took about 1/2 hour and works just as well.

so as easy as you say it is to change the hoses, can i put it on the stock cooler when it's cold and on aftermarket cooler when it's not?

I don't think that the place in the how to docs gets anywhere near the airflow in front of the radiator...and it gets to be helped by the radiator fan in stop n go traffic....
the one i currently have is 3/4" which CAN fit in...with a lot of cursing:P

92snowmachine · #7 11-27-2011, 04:55 PM

it's easy to switch the hoses, i intended to put a valve to make it easier but it only takes a couple minutes anyway. the radiator doesn't really get any more airflow then the rest of the car, if you look under your car at where the faq says to install you will see that there is a scoop there that picks up the air after you cut out a hole. while the radiator fans might pull air through the cooler in traffic the cooler will also increase the resistance to flow for air over the radiator, and sitting in stop and go is not generating a lot of heat.

icingdeath88 · #8 11-27-2011, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david_12121

is it possible to put some sort of pump in the way to increase the flow?

No! The trans fluid pressure is supplied by the pump in the trans, and the pressure is supposed to change according to the speed of that pump. Do not mess with that system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by david_12121

so as easy as you say it is to change the hoses, can i put it on the stock cooler when it's cold and on aftermarket cooler when it's not?

You will lose fluid and have to top it off each time the hoses are un-done. It would be better to just choose a cooler that isn't too big and keep it on all year.

92snowmachine · #9 11-27-2011, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

You will lose fluid and have to top it off each time the hoses are un-done. It would be better to just choose a cooler that isn't too big and keep it on all year.

this is why i wanted to install a valve but i have switched them 5 times in two weeks and haven't added a drop of fluid, i always warm up the car, drive it and recheck the fluid but the level never changes. i usually end up with two spots on the ground about the size of a quarter which wouldn't be enough loss to add any fluid anyway. the trick is to use clamps to hold the line while you switch them. i am very sensitive about fluid levels, i actually filled up my tranny cooler with atf before installing it, measured it and added that much fluid, a cooler meant for an expedition only holds less than 1/2 cup of fluid.

icingdeath88 · #10 11-27-2011, 05:35 PM

^Smart. I wouldn't have thought of that.

david_12121 · #11 11-27-2011, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by icingdeath88

No! The trans fluid pressure is supplied by the pump in the trans, and the pressure is supposed to change according to the speed of that pump. Do not mess with that system.

You will lose fluid and have to top it off each time the hoses are un-done. It would be better to just choose a cooler that isn't too big and keep it on all year.

so if you were me, would you keep the 16000gvw(tube n fin) or get a 26k?

icingdeath88 · #12 11-27-2011, 06:06 PM

Honestly, I haven't shopped for one in too long to remember, but I'd get whatever is mid-range, that looks like it has a nice flow path for the fluid. Bends that aren't too sharp, etc. Tube and fin does make sense, like Tony was saying.

92snowmachine · #13 11-27-2011, 06:42 PM

i would keep what you have. it's already meant for a truck that has gvw rating 4 times what the svx weighs.

david_12121 · #14 11-27-2011, 06:49 PM

ok then

thank y'all

i'll try to make a tutorial too...feels bad always receiving but never giving

dcarrb · #15 11-28-2011, 04:59 AM

"Too cold" = not allowing enough heat for normal torque converter operation. Seems I recall reading that number is about 150 degrees F.

I've put 50,000+ miles on one with a Hayden cooler (I've forgotten the size) in front of the radiator, in series, and 30,000+ miles on another that's pure stock. FWIW, both take about 10 miles to warm up enough for TC lock. I've come to the conclusion that prematurely cooking the transmission (particularly a reman) is a compelling concern only for cars that are routinely driven hard or neglected.

dcb