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  #46  
Old 02-10-2006, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrophil
Exactly! And the person who comes up with a solution of the Jews living in the Middle East gets the big prize. This will....eventually...be the cause of a world war. No doubt, and surprised it hasn't already.
You know what one Rabbi said about his country?
"Israel should have been in Europe and not in the Middle East"

I think I answered you
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  #47  
Old 02-10-2006, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSpear
You know what one Rabbi said about his country?
"Israel should have been in Europe and not in the Middle East"
Is that why they enter the 'Eurovision Song Contest'?
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  #48  
Old 02-10-2006, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSpear
Either Likud or Kadema, pls just put in mind that they have only one belief: "David's promised land", no more and no less, maybe Kadema (in arabic means "old") is only a political party, but in the end they all head towards one thing and one thing only. In Lebanon Christians have 4 major political parties and 2 minor ones. The major ones are "Kouwwat", "Kataeb", "Ahrar" and "Taghyir & Islah". They never agree on one thing, they are always in a quarrel, but when it comes to Christianity, they all agree... In the deputies elections, the Kouwwat were running with Hizbollah against the Taghyir & Islah. So in the same area "Ain el Roummaneh", a bunch of Hizbollah guys entered the area (remember it is an extremist Christians area), and starting teasing the Taghyir & Islah guys. Even though the Kouwwat were running politically with them, both Kouwwat and Taghir & Islah guys united and beated the crap out of the Hizbollah guys . So in politics people always disagree but in reality and in the middle east, what unites people is religion.
No, actually the Kadema party fully endorses the Roadmap of Peace or any plan that would prevent a war from breaking out between Israel and Palestine, except if they are forced to. No matter how many may think of Sharon, it is good to see a politicians who can actually think reasonably outside political party lines, at least in a way the majority desires. In which it is quite obvious that a majority of Israeli citizens are willing to coesist with a Palestine if it means peace. Also, Israel has plenty of political parties that reprisent not only religions but also ideals on what the country should be. Here is a list from 2003 so the Kadema party is not included.

Quote:
(sorry but I am giving you live examples just to show you how religion plays an important role in the Middle East so you can understand how things work over here)

I was referring to the Likud party in Israel. They have a branch of SWOT team, they are trained not to abide by rules, but rather a mix of police and a heartless killers. They are taught to do anything just to get their goal, even killing other Jews just to nail someone. They have very Unorthodox methods of conduct. Try to dig their teachings if you can online if you want. Let me give you an example: They ask the new trainers (you call them the kadets) to go for example to the third floor of that building and wave from the balcony in exactly 2 mins. How they enter that apartment? they must do anything to get in, even if it was killing the owners, or else they will fail and get kicked out from the party. believe it or not, it is true.

As for the the Jews with different mentalities, I am not saying otherwise, they do exist, no doubt about it, but they are a minority. The majority still believe that the next messiah is coming on an army. But I think nowadays they are getting convinced that this will never happen. But let me tell you a fact Weebitob, the Jews have occupied Lebanon at one time, we get used to their way of conduct. The Jew is not a person you can trust concerning his word, he never keeps it. You know in 2000 they withdrew from southern Lebanon, they were expecting the disarmament of Hizbollah over here, but were scr*wed to know that this will not happen as they are still occupying the "Chebaa farms" in Lebanon. Don't think for a moment that they are never interested in Lebanon, in the contrary, they do just to get their hands again on southern part of it because it is a part of David's land. They withdrew because Hizbollah was launching missiles to the heart of Israel and sustaining heavy damage there, and they know it will never stop until they get out and by getting out, Hisbollah will be disarmed. Once that, they will be able to invade it again with no resistance. (PS: our army is very weak, we have no air resistance, we are limited to 6 helicopters used just for transportation and exstinguishing fires ). Pls do believe that Hisbollah's existence is for the sole purpose of Israel's occupation. And let me go further in this subject: Hizbollah is not a terrorist group as the "Al Kaeda". They have no interest in other countries, nor to do terrorist actions. In fact the Lebanese Muslims hate the Palestinians Muslims, in fact they are opposing the fact that they must come to over here and become Lebanese for the fact that "they have their country which is now invaded by Jews, so they must always have the sense of Patriotism for Palestine and never forget about it by coming to Lebanon and become citizens". But in fact both Christians, Druzes and Muslims hate Palestinians because they are more conning than the Jews. How you think the Lebanese war started in 1975? That F*cking @sshole Yasser Arafat was planning to invade our country and have it as Palestine
And in Saudi Arabia your hands are chopped off if you are caught with a Bible in them as well as your tongue if you speak it, that must mean there must be people who are trained there to do this. Also with almost any SWAT team in any nation if there are people clearly getting in their way with the only purpose to obstruct them, they would be forced to supress you even if that means possibily shooting. At least the fact that they state that they would kill even Jews shows they are not religiously biased. Funny they sound allot like Spetsnaz. I suppose it makes sense considering a good portion of Israelis were those that flead from Russia. And guess who were recruited into the IDF at one point. And with terrorist groups such as Hizbollah, Al Fatah and unless they change their caimpagn slogan Hamas you wonder why Israel resorts to these tactics?

I am well aware everything in the Middle East is largely centered around religion, that is why a primarily Jewish country such as Israel is being given a double standard. For example you stated how Lebenon ousted the Palestinians because Yasser Arafat seeked control, well guess what that is also why Jordan did the same but instead did so by killing them. The somewhat ironic part about that was that in the Bafour Decloration Jordan was meant to be the home of Muslims who wanted to leave Israel, but of course the natives including the king of the newly independent Jordan didn't want that. Aside from Americans, the Palestinians seem to be the only other people that are loved yet largely disliked by everyone.

So you see the only reason why Israel is clearly hated in the Middle East is because it is not a Muslim country.

Quote:
And as you know, France and Britain were occupying the Middle East before we revolted (Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Iraq...) against them and got our independance by means of force. It is natural that Europe go with Israel against the Arabs at that time just to get revenge, isn't it? And understand the fact that USA is extending free high tech weapons to the Jews for the sole purpose that they have the ability to freeze your economy over there if otherwise is not met, Period. I just cannot understand, why on every Palestinian demand in the UN sessions, only USA uses the Veto? God don't tell me the Jews are always right in their decisions?? Even killing innocent people? this is just not right.
The European block never wanted "revenge" upon the Arab States, they just looked to Israel as a distraction so they didn't focus their efforts on building up against them, as insane as it sounds. And when Abdul Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal, Europe as well as Israel were afraid that their ships would be boycotted from passing, so thats what resulted in the Suez War. It is pretty much up to any of you to decide on if logical choices were made and by whom.

Quote:
The extremists want to wipe out all Palestinians, they even want them exported to the surrounding countries (Jordan, Syria and Lebanon) and claim the whole Palestine as Israel for the Israelis only. They also want chunks of Syria, Lebanon and Jordan because in this way they are preserving their borders from possible attacks and they are taking over the rest of David's promised land.

When they invaded Lebanon, Israeli's were Jealous from Lebanon's economy and our touristics attractions. in the 70's the exchange rate was 1USD = 2.5 Lebanese Lira, which is considered extremely good for an economy. Nowadays it became 1USD=1507.5 Lebanese Lira . Israel jsut want to steal Lebanon's success and in consequence develops itself both touristically and natural resources (one of their interests is the Lebanese water resources). So when they attacked Lebanon because of the PLO, they didn't just aim on tanks, they destroyed the infrastructure over here, bridges, electricity, water dams, etc... and each time they make a raid on Lebanon, they just destroy another power plant, causing us to fix it and pay huge amounts for that. We are stuck with 50 billion USD debt, we do not need to drown ourselves by a higher amount. They know what they are doing...

As for the concerns from Israeli's attacks, don't get your hopes so high in this case, 3 years ago the Israeli's destroyed a power plant in a Beirut suburb and they are constantly breaking our boundaries by air, twice a week. We are constantly protesting in the UN sessions, but USA is always using its Veto power to go against us, so you are telling me your country now is rightful in doing so? Do you think it is rightful for your country for example to be constantly raided by Canada with no one to stop her? tell me is it right? We are people and we want peace with no one's interfierence, either Palestinians, or Israelis or Syrians or even USA. Is it too much to ask for? Can you stand someone occupying your country by force? I know I don't, what about you?
I think most Israelis are satified with the borders they currently have. As for those who want more they pretty much look to the Gaza and West Bank but no further. So no I don't think Israel as a whole has any ambition right now to grow to their ancient borders, if you even consider them that large in the first place.

But yes, I do agree that some of the conduct the IDF did was wrong, but their way of thinking was that your government supported those who were against them. I guess you can compare it to how NATO behaved in Kosovo or a better example maybe Iraq.

Quote:
You know what one Rabbi said about his country?
"Israel should have been in Europe and not in the Middle East"

I think I answered you
But what about the Arabic Jews and Yemminites? You know that Judaism is a religion and not a people from Europe right? And the only reason they are in the Eurovision Song Contest is because if there was such a one for all Middle Eastern countries Israeli artists would probably be not invited, sorry if I killed your joke.

And not back to the topic of this controversial cartoon. It appears that some governments of nations in the Middle East are using this cartoon to cover up other people and guess who else reprinted it.

Last edited by Weebitob; 02-10-2006 at 04:43 PM.
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  #49  
Old 02-10-2006, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
No, actually the Kadema party fully endorses the Roadmap of Peace or any plan that would prevent a war from breaking out between Israel and Palestine, except if they are forced to. No matter how many may think of Sharon, it is good to see a politicians who can actually think reasonably outside political party lines, at least in a way the majority desires. In which it is quite obvious that a majority of Israeli citizens are willing to coesist with a Palestine if it means peace. Also, Israel has plenty of political parties that reprisent not only religions but also ideals on what the country should be.
You truly believe that??? , You don't know what is the military background of Sharon. Have you ever watched the three musketeers? , well cardinal Richelieu was never a true representative of the Christ..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
And with terrorist groups such as Hizbollah, Al Fatah and unless they change their caimpagn slogan Hamas you wonder why Israel resorts to these tactics?

So you see the only reason why Israel is clearly hated in the Middle East is because it is not a Muslim country.
HIZBOLLAH ARE NOT TERRORISTS, did you ever hear they did similar actions as the "Al Quaeda" ? they are Lebanese Muslims extremists whose only purpose is to defend Lebanon from the Israeli invasion... just erase all those beliefs you have becasue they are all wrong. I am the one living in the Middle East and having a closer look at things. Also Al Fatah and Hamas are just defending "Palestine" from becoming entirely "Israel". As I said the Jews have Nazi thoughts, they just want to "terminate" what's around them.

No, this is not the only reason why Israel is hated in the middle east, well as a matter of fact Lebanon was a Christian country before 1990 before it became now a mixed country. We were never hated at that time... So pls Weebitob, understand what I am telling you, all those beliefs you have are all wrong. You will never get the picture until Jews invade your country and slaughter your countrypeople in front of you.. They are known as Backstabbers, at the point they assure you that everything is Ok, they just shoot you the first second you turn your back to them. Look I am not defending muslims, and I am telling you again that we hate each other here, we were in a civil war and killed each other... but I have to put my finger on the wound, even though I never trust Muslims, I still entrust them more than Jews.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
The European block never wanted "revenge" upon the Arab States, they just looked to Israel as a distraction so they didn't focus their efforts on building up against them, as insane as it sounds. And when Abdul Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal, Europe as well as Israel were afraid that their ships would be boycotted from passing, so thats what resulted in the Suez War. It is pretty much up to any of you to decide on if logical choices were made and by whom.
What you read are not facts. They are just stories they want to ruin people's minds with. This is one of the causes for helping Israel. But in fact Europe was furious from the middle east and they want revenge. THIS IS A FACT, DON'T GET IT THE OTHER WAY AROUND, they were hurt from Arabs how they kicked them out of the Middle East

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob

I think most Israelis are satified with the borders they currently have. As for those who want more they pretty much look to the Gaza and West Bank but no further. So no I don't think Israel as a whole has any ambition right now to grow to their ancient borders, if you even consider them that large in the first place.

But what about the Arabic Jews and Yemminites? You know that Judaism is a religion and not a people from Europe right? And the only reason they are in the Eurovision Song Contest is because if there was such a one for all Middle Eastern countries Israeli artists would probably be not invited, sorry if I killed your joke.
That wasn't my joke, that was the Rabbi's, and rather a fact more than a joke. He meant that because of the Israelis technical and economical advancement, It is like another American state over there... unlike the Arabs, they have a very modern way of life... this is what that Rabbi meant...

Look I dunno why you are defending them that much, but we have experienced Israelis over here and believe it or not, they can never be trusted. Here is the order: Jews, Druzes, Muslims.
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  #50  
Old 02-10-2006, 06:11 PM
Weebitob Weebitob is offline
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Originally Posted by SilverSpear
You truly believe that??? , You don't know what is the military background of Sharon. Have you ever watched the three musketeers? , well cardinal Richelieu was never a true representative of the Christ..
Yes I do know Aerial Sharon's background he created Israel's first counter terrorist unit and then became head of all armored devisions, so with your way of thinking would George Washington or Andrew Jackson (during his time in military service) be considered a war criminal? He already tried a militarist aproach for the last few years and it did not work. So I believe his current steps toward making a compromise for peace are legitimate. For example, Yasser Arafat and the PLO couldn't function as a terrorist organization once their jurisdiction and essensially ownership resided over a plot of land, as for money laundering with connections to other terrorist organizations that is a different story.

Quote:
HIZBOLLAH ARE NOT TERRORISTS, did you ever hear they did similar actions as the "Al Quaeda" ? they are Lebanese Muslims extremists whose only purpose is to defend Lebanon from the Israeli invasion... just erase all those beliefs you have becasue they are all wrong. I am the one living in the Middle East and having a closer look at things. Also Al Fatah and Hamas are just defending "Palestine" from becoming entirely "Israel". As I said the Jews have Nazi thoughts, they just want to "terminate" what's around them.
Ok, I do take back what I said about Hizbollah conidering they only attacked Israeli military position that were in Lebanon or on the Lebanese border. But justifying Al Fatah and Hama's attacks on buses, cafes and other civilian targets in the name of Palestine is just ridiculous.

Quote:
No, this is not the only reason why Israel is hated in the middle east, well as a matter of fact Lebanon was a Christian country before 1990 before it became now a mixed country. We were never hated at that time... So pls Weebitob, understand what I am telling you, all those beliefs you have are all wrong. You will never get the picture until Jews invade your country and slaughter your countrypeople in front of you.. They are known as Backstabbers, at the point they assure you that everything is Ok, they just shoot you the first second you turn your back to them. Look I am not defending muslims, and I am telling you again that we hate each other here, we were in a civil war and killed each other... but I have to put my finger on the wound, even though I never trust Muslims, I still entrust them more than Jews.
Anyone can be a backstabber and aside from smartbombs and their campaign against the PLO as well as Hizbullah did Israeli troops actually deliberately massacred themselves Lebanese village? I am actually curious and would like to know, however I do not count Sharon's suggestion as an IDF action.


Quote:
What you read are not facts. They are just stories they want to ruin people's minds with. This is one of the causes for helping Israel. But in fact Europe was furious from the middle east and they want revenge. THIS IS A FACT, DON'T GET IT THE OTHER WAY AROUND, they were hurt from Arabs how they kicked them out of the Middle East
What exactly are just stories? The part where families migrated to Israel with nothing and some earning enough they can purshase the land they worked so hard on? About how they had to fight a war of independance as well as against neighboring countries because the UN decided to not eactly follow the Balfour Declaration to the point? Ok, I admit there were some quite wealthy people behind the the creation of Israel but it is not like every Jew there automatic became or even were doctors and lawyers. How about all the other wars, did Israel and the US point a gun to the leaders of Syria, Jordan and Egypt to make them say all those things about wanting to destroy Israel as well as making their armies attack?

As for the Arab countries that become independent from colonial rule. Those people did suffer allot of strife and oppresion but the European countries simply let them go after WWII because they couldn't afford to continue to occupy them. You are aware that main land Europe layed in ruits after WWII right? But all wasn't lost since the oil companies of those nations managed to arrange deals with the Arab ones to continue operations.


Quote:
That wasn't my joke, that was the Rabbi's, and rather a fact more than a joke. He meant that because of the Israelis technical and economical advancement, It is like another American state over there... unlike the Arabs, they have a very modern way of life... this is what that Rabbi meant...

Look I dunno why you are defending them that much, but we have experienced Israelis over here and believe it or not, they can never be trusted. Here is the order: Jews, Druzes, Muslims.
I never thought of it as a joke, I was just implying if a Jew believes in Jesus he is not quite a Jew. Also, what makes the economic posistion Israel is in the justifacation to wipe it out of existence? Perhaps instead of complaining the other nations, including Palestone now, should work their way economically up Egypt and your country are doing it.

Btw, you know that the president of Israel Moshe Katsav, the one who actually handles foriegn afairs is or at least was born in Iran?

I would also like to know what makes Druzes so untrustworthy?

Last edited by Weebitob; 02-10-2006 at 10:20 PM.
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  #51  
Old 02-10-2006, 06:46 PM
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Very interesting thread. Danny - it's really interesting to see your point of view from there vs. what they want us to see on the news.
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  #52  
Old 02-10-2006, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by immortal_suby
Very interesting thread. Danny - it's really interesting to see your point of view from there vs. what they want us to see on the news.

Traveling internationally the first thing I do is find an english news station to get a different point of view...
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  #53  
Old 02-10-2006, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by NapaBavarian
Traveling internationally the first thing I do is find an english news station to get a different point of view...
Whats wrong with just getting BBC here?
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  #54  
Old 02-10-2006, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSpear
You know what one Rabbi said about his country?
"Israel should have been in Europe and not in the Middle East"

I think I answered you

NaaaaaHH!!!
On WALL STREET!!! That way Most of them wouldn't have to MOVE!!!
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Old 02-11-2006, 12:14 AM
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since I have been reading this thread, I no longer need the LIARS that own our media

Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrophil
I understand what you are saying. Especially about the statue. We do go through that here, but it is more low key, and usually involves separation of church and state, not people tearing things up. (Reminder...to protect the state, not the church.) It involves placing the 10 commandments at government buildings, stem cell research bans because the stem cells come from aborted fetus', etc. You are also dead on about our mix of religion. We tend to be very tolerant of other religions, even though everyone thinks everyone else is going to hell but their religion. I agree this would affect my comprehension on the matter.

The analogy toward our African American community is sound, but just a little generalized. The word itself is not taboo in the United States, African Americans use it among themselves as almost a blasted endearment. It's just whites have lost their priviledge of saying it, due to our blatant abuse of the word in decades past. I won't even type the word myself, because I feel the African American community is dead right. We lost any rights to that word long ago. But the word itself is not taboo. Most African Americans...and whites look at a person saying it as low class white trash...if they are white, and get uncomfortable when blacks use it among themselves because we don't know how to respond. But very few break out AK-47's. I'll definitely agree on that.

This extreme violence is brought on through agitation from the leadership. Someone or maybe some people spread the word of this foul act around the statue and agitated the community.. somebody rallied the troops...even though the bible clearly states the position they have on worshipping idols and statues.

I know it sounds offensive, and I truly don't want to be, but religion isn't a good thing. Regardless, it causes more death, and terror in our world more than any other factor. And this includes so called "evil dictators" that my country seems bent on "fixing". Funny, this too is being caused by an extreme "right wing" religious mindset that has control of our country at this time. (But not for much longer. , they are so corrupt, they are getting themselves thrown out.)

Just remember, when the Israeli's came marching into Beirut back in the early 80's, that wasn't religion. The Israeli's claim was the continuous guerrilla attacks across their border by Muslim extremists. But.... The Muslims were doing it out of "religion"... or so they say.

Canaan included all the land around the penisula, which included where Israel/Palestine is now and also present day Lebanon. Actually, it was quite larger than that, and went beyond both borders. You were all Canaanites prior to Moses and David. It was a huge plot of land at the time. The areas around Lebanon were never conquered by the Israelites. But they sure as heck tried..... for almost a century.

The Canaanites were big with carriages back then with a driver and bow equiped sharp shooters. They were EXTREMELY effective with them. But the Israelites would lure them up in the higher elevations, get the carriages stuck in mud, then pick them off. The Canaanites in the Lebanon area had learned from the mistakes by the Canaanites down south, and didn't usually fall in the same traps.

The Isrealites were also one of the first societies to start using "embargos" against cities. Surrounding a city, starving them out, and during this time, planting "helpers" within the city walls. They would then attack when the city became weak. And they were extremely vicious attacks that followed a plan of complete anniliation of every man, woman, and child in the city..trying to wipe the race out. If you study the history during the periods of Moses, and his successor David, you immediately pick up on just how bloody things were. They were both pretty ruthless for being "God fearing men". They say God gave him the 10 commandments, but he obviously felt above these laws.
Thank you ALL, for opening the 'blind eyes' , that have to rely on CNN ( Commie news network) for their 'mis-information!!!

I have an opinion on most subjects, and go to the source to get what I need to form the opinion. When it was 'gun control' , I went to my friend in Austrailia, where they hunt rabbits with a dog and stick, because the government has dis-armed them!!

My friend that had the 'cookout' previously discribed' , is a world traveler, that started a newspaper when he came home from Germany in the late 70's

He was a 'starter' at Duke Univ, (Basket ball) and was one of the star players. Steve Vandenburg..

I wish to ask 'permission' from all of you that have posted on this topic, to show it to Steve, and let what happens, happen!!
The major players in this 'saga', have gotten a 'pass' on the major outlets, and Steve would present 'the facts', and let the chips fall where they may!

This is a topic that could use a few facts interjected with the opinions that dominate the media, ( however, the only place this is being discussed, is Rush Limbaugh), and it is a 2 way street there!

Jerry
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Old 02-11-2006, 01:22 AM
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Electrophil Electrophil is offline
Which manual is "that" in??
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subi-crosser
This is a topic that could use a few facts interjected with the opinions that dominate the media, ( however, the only place this is being discussed, is Rush Limbaugh), and it is a 2 way street there!

Jerry
Yeah, I heard Rush is almost a moderate when he's sober.

It's just that nobody has ever seen the guy sober.
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Is Bush in jail yet? (Looks frantically at watch, then back up) How about now? Now? Come onnnnnn...... Someone freeze me until January, this wait is killing me.
Update: 09 January, and still not in jail! Wassup??

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  #57  
Old 02-11-2006, 11:02 AM
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SubaSteevo SubaSteevo is offline
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There is only one religion worth fighting for

Well, there's also the Invisible Pink Unicorn, but I mean come on, how can she be invisible AND pink? It's just entirely unbelievable...
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  #58  
Old 02-11-2006, 12:11 PM
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Electrophil Electrophil is offline
Which manual is "that" in??
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaSteevo
There is only one religion worth fighting for

Well, there's also the Invisible Pink Unicorn, but I mean come on, how can she be invisible AND pink? It's just entirely unbelievable...
I am a high priest of the Invisible Pink Unicorn, and I find your remarks highly offensive.

I'm sending a team to your street, and we are going to burn up the stuff in your garbage can.

And we plan on yelling alot, and we got signs buster!

That's right.... Lots of signs.

(Disclaimer to George Bush - this post is the result of my chuckling over the invisible pink Unicorn, and is totally fictional and light hearted in nature. There is no team. Please disregard, and remove the swat team you just put in my front yard.)
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Robert

Is Bush in jail yet? (Looks frantically at watch, then back up) How about now? Now? Come onnnnnn...... Someone freeze me until January, this wait is killing me.
Update: 09 January, and still not in jail! Wassup??

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  #59  
Old 02-11-2006, 03:03 PM
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SilverSpear SilverSpear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
Yes I do know Aerial Sharon's background he created Israel's first counter terrorist unit and then became head of all armored devisions, so with your way of thinking would George Washington or Andrew Jackson (during his time in military service) be considered a war criminal? He already tried a militarist aproach for the last few years and it did not work. So I believe his current steps toward making a compromise for peace are legitimate. For example, Yasser Arafat and the PLO couldn't function as a terrorist organization once their jurisdiction and essensially ownership resided over a plot of land, as for money laundering with connections to other terrorist organizations that is a different story.
Look Weebitob, let me tell you something, there is no one in this Earth who hates Palestinians more than I do. You know why? the PLO murdered my Grandmother and my Aunt (my dad's mom and sister). I didn't want to mention it but it seems that you are not getting the big picture about the Israelis, so i had to draw your attention on things. If you are going to talk out from the Heart, I can go with the Jews against the PLO. The news are nothing. I was googling some info about a certain massacre to show you WHO really is Ariel Sharon, well the fact are all INCORRECT. The Jews were backing us (Christians Maronites) in our war against the PLOs, there was a war going on, they wanted to conquer our land, they destroyed our economy and our touristic places and way of life. We were living in heaven before but they took our lives and our dreams. So I hate them from all my heart... but still the Jews are more dangerous than them. Ok here is the link to that massacre, it is called Sabra & Chatila http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_Massacre. The news tell you that the Lebanese Maronite Militias under the leadership of Elie Hobeika entered those camps and murdered 2000 palestinians (men, women and children), and they were backed up LOGISTICALLY by the Israeli's. What if I tell you that the real thing was that Maronite Lebanese Militias, Israeli's troops and some Syrian troops all entered those camps and murdered those Palestinians UNDER THE ORDERS AND SUPERVISION OF ARIEL SHARON. He is a blood thirsty @sshole, you can say defend him by whatever you want to say about him and link me to articles and stuff (which are never true), either he will be blessed by God himself, he will always be a murderer.. no... more like a heartless vampire... in the article, the only thing that stands true is this:

"On February 14, 1983, Der Spiegel (a leading German magazine) carried an interview with one of the Phalangists who participated to the massacre. According to this person, Israeli soldiers fought along the Phalangists and shelled the camp to help them overcome the Palestinian resistance."

"Sharon was directly responsible for the massacres."

Sabra and Chatila's file was opened again in mid 2001 and Elie Hobeika who was supposed to testify in the court what really happened in those camps, was blasted into pieces by a car bomb. That bomb was either set by the Israeli's or the Syrians... we never knew...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
Ok, I do take back what I said about Hizbollah conidering they only attacked Israeli military position that were in Lebanon or on the Lebanese border. But justifying Al Fatah and Hama's attacks on buses, cafes and other civilian targets in the name of Palestine is just ridiculous.

Anyone can be a backstabber and aside from smartbombs and their campaign against the PLO as well as Hizbullah did Israeli troops actually deliberately massacred themselves Lebanese village? I am actually curious and would like to know, however I do not count Sharon's suggestion as an IDF action.
Ok I am going to give you an example. Consider your neighbor has an armored SVX while you have an ordinary SVX and there is no police whatsoever, you are both in charge of things. He grabs his M-16 and put a round in your car. You do not have a weapon of any kind, so you grab a rock and throw it onto his SVX. Your SVX is damaged, his SVX is as good as new. how will you feel? HE SCR*WED YOU, and you couldn't do anything about it. But he has a house full of windows also. So you grab a bunch of rocks and throw them on his windows and you break them. You couldn't defeat him by his car but you did by attacking his house!! This is what's happening over there! Frankly speaking, as much as I Hate PALESTINIANS, logically speaking, I wouldn't call what hamas and fateh are doing as terrorist attacks. 9/11 and the London trains are terrorists attacks, but I cannot categorize what is happening in Palestine/Israel as terrorism.

As for the second paragraph, sorry I didn't understand what you are saying... can you elaborate more?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
What exactly are just stories? The part where families migrated to Israel with nothing and some earning enough they can purshase the land they worked so hard on? About how they had to fight a war of independance as well as against neighboring countries because the UN decided to not eactly follow the Balfour Declaration to the point? Ok, I admit there were some quite wealthy people behind the the creation of Israel but it is not like every Jew there automatic became or even were doctors and lawyers. How about all the other wars, did Israel and the US point a gun to the leaders of Syria, Jordan and Egypt to make them say all those things about wanting to destroy Israel as well as making their armies attack?

As for the Arab countries that become independent from colonial rule. Those people did suffer allot of strife and oppresion but the European countries simply let them go after WWII because they couldn't afford to continue to occupy them. You are aware that main land Europe layed in ruits after WWII right? But all wasn't lost since the oil companies of those nations managed to arrange deals with the Arab ones to continue operations.
Man what are you talking about in the first paragraph? is that dated from 1920? come onnnnn, I am talking from the era going from 1968 till now. Tell me what do you categorize an act of demolishing an entire village by force and building a complete complex instead in just a couple of months? and the Israelis have no money, they are poor
Convince me with one thing, HOW COME USA IS EXTENDING FREE WEAPONS TO ISRAEL WITH NOTHING IN RETURN? and pleaseeeeeeeee, don't tell me it is a tactical benefit !!! the Israelis are supernatural fellas to convince a great country such as USA to give them FREE stuff and matching YOUR current technologies... WAKE UP MAN, stop relying on BS news of CNN and BBC and start reading between the lines... We lived the Turks, we lived the French, we lived the Palestinians, We lived the Israelis and we lived the Syrians... we know how each and every one of them thinks.

As for the Europeans colonial rules, PLEASE just recheck your info again. Do you remember that the French used to rule us? could I be lying about it? Don't think for a moment, than any country which is benefiting from her existence in another country, wishes to leave it. "Al Taef" agreement which was signed to end the Christian Civil war in 1990 states that Syria must get everything back in order before it leaves in a maximum of 2 years time. How long did it stay? 15 F*cking years!!!!!!! and how did it leave Lebanon?? You know... the French colonies faced a similar thing, with the difference that pressure was from the inside and not the outside.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weebitob
Btw, you know that the president of Israel Moshe Katsav, the one who actually handles foriegn afairs is or at least was born in Iran?

I would also like to know what makes Druzes so untrustworthy?
Do you also know that our current Prime Minister is a Muslim Sunnite... and Palestinian? He was born in Lebanon but his parents are Palestinians (no one likes him, he is an @sshole ) but a very intelligent guy who was appointed as Minister of Finance... don't be surprised, the Israeli president may be born in Iran, what's the problem, he has been living as an Israeli president for more than 5 decades...

The Druzes are minorities in the middle east. The Druze guy or girl are not told what is the basis of their religion until they reach a certain age (usually more than 45 ) so he stays without belief for a long time, that period which makes him get used to have NO GOD and in consequence they do not have a discipline criteria to rely on. When they reach that age, they become well known about their religion and in other terms, they gain the title "WISE CHEIKH"... when it is too late: they are used to one thing and they have to abide by another , which is very difficult for a guy who got used to stealing, cheating, beating... without any sense of guilt absent by lack of religious teachings from little ages. There is no Druz person I know that he didn't cheat to reach his objective. Plus they are a minority, so they must switch sides all the time to keep himslef inside the Lebanese game. Let me show you the Druze leader over here, he is the ugliest guy on earth, read about him, the facts are always not accurate:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walid_Jumblatt

P.S: my hometown is in Chouf area of Lebanon, the place (Chouf) where the civil war ignited the most. My hometown (Mtolleh) is the only one who successfully killed 92 druzes while trying to enter it (the people from other towns just escaped without resistance, they saved their lives), on the other hand they killed 3 persons from us, two elderly, who refused to escape the town when they finally entered it (Druzes) and one 25 year old guy who was wounded, captured and murdered (like the murders that you used to see in Vietnam, when they let the prisoner sit on his knees and they put a round in his head )

So Weebitob, you may read all the info you can, watch all the news, they are all BS. They never tell you in reality what is happeneing, they just tell you what THEY want you to know. Do not take it as an insult, but I do not consider USA as the most powerful country in the world, rather Israel is for controlling USA . Do not take it as an insult, I love USA but what I am stating is pure facts. We can keep this discussion running on day and night and I have all the reasons in the world to defend Israel and go against the Palestinians, that if I want to give you a "heart" answer, but the "mind and logical and what is really happening" answer I tell you the Israelis are worse than even the Druzes
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Last edited by SilverSpear; 02-11-2006 at 03:26 PM.
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  #60  
Old 02-11-2006, 03:08 PM
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SilverSpear SilverSpear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by immortal_suby
Very interesting thread. Danny - it's really interesting to see your point of view from there vs. what they want us to see on the news.
Matt thank you for you trust in my replies, the war in the middle east has hidden spots that don't want you or anyone in the civilized world to know about. I may be carried away in this thread by attacking the Jews, Palestinians, Druzes, Syrians, etc... pls I tell you this is an objective discussion and real true facts for what is really happening over here. Please whatever happens, just ask the offending member to edit his post the proper way or you do it yourself... but I say again, not all facts that have been advertised are true, I hope this thread stays as it is... Thanks in advance
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