New Shift Kit Developed

[RSVX]

Originally Posted by Myxalplyx

...snip...

Wow. Thanks for that post, truly informative.

[oab_au]

Originally Posted by sicksubie

Is it just me or are people going ga-ga over supposed dyno ##'s....

I really hope it is just you BobbyI don't want people to think there is a power increase. I will say it again. There is no power increase, it just causes 100% of the engines torque to be delivered through the change, instead of 50%, as Kevin says. It comes down to interpreting the charts.

These are not engine dyno charts that would show engine torque, they are from an Inertia dyno that measures the torque at the wheels of a car accelerating through the gears. These then show all the events that are going on in the engine, gear box, and drive line, every bump and jar that happens, is interpreted as Horsepower by this type of dyno.

Originally Posted by processengr

When I interpeted the dyno plots, I looked at the graph, which showed power was on continuosly during the shift. I ignored the whp.
Would I be wrong to compare the effect of the QC to a 4 spd manual, one run "power shifting, one run letting off the pedal during the shift?

That would be the way it feels Gordon, but there is a distinct difference that can be felt between the effects of "power shifting" a manual, and the auto doing a full throttle change.
If a manual transmission was used to produce these charts, and a flat, full throttle, change was used at 6500 the clutch would have to slow the engines speed down from 6500 to second gears speed of 3700. This would show up as a sharp increase in torque over a very short time, as the engines stored inertia was converted to instant torque. Felt as a hard jarring shock.

With the auto the converter acts as a variable ratio gear box, that can change its ratio from 1:1 to 1.95:1. When the brake band comes on and slows the Turbine down to 3700, the engine driven Impeller is still spinning at 6500. This speed difference of 2800 in the converter, forces it to its lowest ratio of 1.95:1, multiplying the torque due to the rotational speed difference. As the engines speed is reduced to 3700 the converters multiplication ratio reduces to 1:1. This is felt as a longer thrust on the change, turning the engines speed reduction into useful torque, instead of the manuals short sharp shock.

As with any mechanical gear or lever system. As the input/output speed ratio changes, so does the input/output torque ratio. The power remains the same.

Harvey.

[oab_au]

Originally Posted by b3lha

Good work Harvey, that's a nice looking board.

I've been looking at it and I think I must have misunderstood your previous explanation. I was thinking that the QC actually generated its own duty cycle for solenoid A. But from looking at the picture, I'm fairly sure I was wrong about that. Unfortunately the technical explanations have become lost in amongst all the fighting.

I see an Op-Amp, a relay, a V-reg, a transistor and a few resistors, diodes and capacitors. A fairly straightforward analogue circuit. As you said K.I.S.S.

Am I right in thinking that the below is a reasonably accurate description of how the QC works?

1) The Op-Amp circuit causes the relay to close when the voltage signal exceeds the pre-set level.

2) When the relay closes, two things happen:

2a) The torque control line is held high to prevent the ECU from reducing engine power during shifts.
2b) A fixed resistance is inserted into the Sol A line to reduce the voltage (Amplitude) of the duty cycle sent by the TCU.

?

Thanks Phil I was happy how the board turned out, this was the first time that I have used a computer design program to do it. I used FreePC, a good tutorial, looked like the one that Calum used with the ECU board.

Yes that is a reasonable description, 1 and 2 correct, the other two are the hard parts.
As you say it is an on/off function but the voltage and current levels are monitored from both ends, both the ECU and TCU monitor this line for faults. So you have to satisfy all the requirements of both.

The A solenoid line is different as it is also checked for inductance reactance feedback. So this line cannot be opened or shorted, only the solenoids current level can be altered.

As this solenoid is driven by two different duty cycle signals, a 12V one is derived from the throttle position sensor, that is the main line pressure control, increasing it with throttle load.
The other is a 5V one from the TCU that is used to modify the Throttle signal for various reasons including softening the band or clutch engagement. Driving this solenoid on reduces the line pressure.

To allow these two voltage levels to be combined, they have to be isolated from each other, this is where the Dropping resistor comes in. If the throttle is down the 12V signal will be on for 5% of the cycle and off for 95% of the cycle, when the change starts the 5V duty cycle will go to about 80%, on fore 80% of the cycle and off for 5% of the same cycle. You can see that the throttles 5% signal would short the 5v 80% signal down to the same 5%. The dropping resistor prevents this from happening.

Why it was done like this when it could have been done in the software much easier don't know, may have been an evolution thing.

Harvey.

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by b3lha

As you know, my electronic knowledge is not as good as Harveys or yours. The requirement is that the torque control input is "not ground". Probably the best way to achieve this is to tie it to Vcc. I don't really see any problem with Harvey's arrangement unless the regulator fails in such a way that the line is pulled up to 12v, which might damage the ECU, depending on the (unknown) tolerances of the ECU circuitry.

Yeah. But it wasn't obvious to me because I don't fully understand how the solenoid works. Harvey said:

That is what confused me. I thought he was generating a duty cycle based on the throttle position but after looking at the board, I think he is just putting a resistor in the line to reduce the voltage of the duty cycle generated by the TCU. I think I need to go and study the service manual to get my head around how this works.

Phil,

But, tie an input to a separate power source rather than its own Vcc!
The correct thing to do would surely be to take it off ground, but include high resistance or a capacitor so that the input is not left floating and open to noise.

There is very good reason why you are confused with the remainder and the reference to a separate throttle signal.--- “Two signals drive the solenoid even though the may be opposite. If the dropping resistor was not used, one line would short out the other line, so it acts as an isolator.”
If it were not in black and white, I would regard the statement as being purely a joke.

It would be interesting to have Harvey's interpretation of the word "opposite," as included within in his explanation. Opposite to each other? If so in what way, surely not in polarity? If not, opposite to/with what and exactly how?
The same goes for the word "short." Are we to take it that this means a short circuit?
Again the word isolator? Does this indicate a device which separates? If so exactly what from what?

With this information on hand you may be relieved of your confusion.

At the moment I am not fully recovered, but I will come back to the topic.

[immortal_suby]

Originally Posted by oab_au

I

This is felt as a longer thrust on the change, turning the engines speed reduction into useful torque, instead of the manuals short sharp shock.

Harvey.

That's exactly what it feels like - a long thrust. It is a powerful change. It pains me to think that I drove this heavy hunk of metal around for 8 years without it shifting like this. I'll say it again, the QC shift kit + the switchable Nomake power mod is how the svx should have come from the factory. Might have even helped sales.

[poweredx2]

Intial Results:I got my quick change yesterday and installed it before work.The install was a little tough being 6' 6,had to remove drivers seat for after that no problems.Ok lets get down too it.
#1. Shifts are very fast indeed and very fast with my resistor unplugged not recommended.I have a lifetime warranty so my tranny.
#2.No change in tranny temps,but I do have a cooler half the size of my radiator.
#3.Throttle feel more connected with tranny,wot 1-2 breaks traction on certain roads,also rolling along at 25mph,I went wot and the car went back to first and spinned the tires a little,I have toyos 235/40/17s
#4.I did get one 0-100mph run last night,seat of the pants tell me my 1/8 mile time should drop .05-.07 sec and 1/10 of a second on the big end because there is no delay at all during shifts.
#5.I will get the car on the dyno within two weeks and to the track also,results will be posted.WHAT the prior dyno post show is not what is felt,I can feel the power staying on between shifts now.
I'm very impressed with this product.

[svxistentialist]

That's great news to hear.

I'm looking forward to getting mine. I need to sort a problem with the gearbox first.

Joe

[Myetball]

Anybody install this with the ECUTune Stage 1V(whatever) chip also?

[ensteele]

For anyone who has installed one of these, how long does it take?

[bwb3]

So far I'm hearing no compatibility problems with 1V4, 1V5 and 2V7 versions. Time will tell. From what I understand about it, there will definately be one in my 4.44 conversion when I get that done. A slow process for someone who has just graduated from brake upgrades. And also an engine swap but, that still doesn't run (wiring madness).
Gene

[92svx95]

Originally Posted by ensteele

For anyone who has installed one of these, how long does it take?

depending on how tall you are, installation should take anywhere between 10-30 minutes.

[poweredx2]

Well after removing my drivers seat,very easy install.I also reconnected my resistor to have engine braking in third gear.Also from my earlier post I should pickup about 7/10ths to a full tenth in the 1/4 mile.To confirm this me and a friend found a deserted backroad to test my QC,his celica gts runs 15.2 at 90mph and I normally have him by half a car up to about 100mph,this time I had a full car lead and backed off at 100mph,after 4 passes his clutch started slipping.This was just a safe test and not street racing,what I found is that during my shift change and power drop the celica is on its big cam and overpowers the svx on the bigend.With the QC power never drops off just lightning fast shift so the gts can never make a move.More info coming soon.

[immortal_suby]

Great news, Walter. Can't wait to see what it does at the dragstrip. I expected you would break traction on the shift.

The install took me about 30-45 minutes taking my time to make sure to get it right. I could probably do it again in 10 minutes.
I have 2v7 and I don't have any compatabilty issue and I wouldn't expect any for any of the ecutune software versions.

This kit plus the power mode mod is a sweet setup. Between this kit, the TomMyx intake, and the power mode mod my svx feels like a different vehicle. If it came like this from the factory "Where the suckers moon" might have never been written. I am still puzzled why every one of these kits hasn't been sold.

[poweredx2]

I am heading to the track hopefully friday night,its only a 1/8 mile track but its open ony day off,so I need to get some runs in.So far tranny temps are no problem,car still shifts great and still runs a little richer reason unknown.My mph indicates a 9.50 with the mods I have now.A few years ago with my other cylinder heads were milled a little and it helped the car run 9.59 at 73mph.I have rebuilt cylinder heads with stock components and my best so far is 9.77 at 72mph.I'm trying to get some runs before my PRM intake some free E3 plugs and a stage 1 chip arrives,If I can get down to a high 9.4 I will be completely satisfied with this svx.I am running those E3s in my 88 toyota truck and yes I got an extra 35mpg to my 15 gallon tank and seat of the pants I feel a little more pep.I'll report back with timeslips from prior runs to compare the slickshift to.

[oab_au]

Glad to hear that you like it Walter, I knew you would. I would reconnect the resistor though, it will make it more progressive to how hard the throttle is on. Disconnecting it doesn't do anything, during the shift, just causes problems.

With the 3.7:1 that you have it will probably only do the one, first to second change, so it will be interesting to see how it goes. Are you going to run the Nos?

Harvey.