not a good day

mranderson · #1 03-09-2004, 04:30 PM

Ok so after questioning the left and right pulling on my steering in another thread i was given the idea to put my car on gravel and spin the tires. In fact only the front ones dug in. So according to that post my transfer clutch is gone. Is this a given?

I have no trouble with the driving and the only time it really pulls like that is high way driving. I can be going straight and it will pull that way.

Well if this is the transfer clutch then i guess i might as well go ahead and do the 4.44 swap if it turns out to be possible.

So what if any transmission would be a direct swap with a final drive of 4.44? Or does anyone know if the one from a forester would in fact not work with the tcu given that is has a different diff.?

This car will be the end of me.

lee · #2 03-09-2004, 04:54 PM

Wow, what a leap.

The transfer case can be fixed without transmission removal. Diff replacement will require R&R, then you still have to fix the transfer case issue.

mranderson · #3 03-09-2004, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lee
Wow, what a leap.

The transfer case can be fixed without transmission removal. Diff replacement will require R&R, then you still have to fix the transfer case issue.

um what do you mean R&R

I wanted to do the swap anyway, i figure this might be my ticket. But i need lots of info that i cant find anywhere.

NomadTW · #4 03-09-2004, 11:46 PM

forester driveline

i believe 01 or 02 on they had lsd rear

if you get the entire thing, trans and rear end it should bolt straight up

if you go with an older forester transmission you can get the diff and have them rebuild the rear end with different ring and pinion

i recomend describing it as that instead of trying to explain what your doing

just say that you need a rear differential rebuilt with different gears in it they'll understand much better

UberRoo · #5 03-10-2004, 02:35 AM

The transfer clutch, once you source the part, is butt-simple to replace. The 4.44 differential swap of course won't fix the transfer clutch problem, and won't really make replacing it significantly easier. Swapping differentials requires pulling the whole transmission and a lot of other dilly-dallying. The transfer clutch just requires removing the tail of the tranny; pop the part out - put in a new one.

Aredubjay · #6 03-10-2004, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mranderson

um what do you mean R&R

It don't mean "Rest and Relaxation" for sure!

R&R in "autospeak" is "Removal and Replacement."

mranderson · #7 03-10-2004, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by NomadTW
forester driveline

i believe 01 or 02 on they had lsd rear

if you get the entire thing, trans and rear end it should bolt straight up

if you go with an older forester transmission you can get the diff and have them rebuild the rear end with different ring and pinion

i recomend describing it as that instead of trying to explain what your doing

just say that you need a rear differential rebuilt with different gears in it they'll understand much better

ok so I see my problem of not getting to the point.

Well lets forget the 4.44 gearing for now and just stick with the transfer clutch for this thread.

We put it up in the air today and the back tires sure enough were spinning. They were noticibally slower than the front though. I guess this is because of the power split?? Also there was a horrible grinding noise coming from beneath the rear of the car. Is it possible that the clutch is just going bad and not actually dead yet? This sound does not happen when i am driving.

oab_au · #8 03-10-2004, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mranderson

ok so I see my problem of not getting to the point.

Well lets forget the 4.44 gearing for now and just stick with the transfer clutch for this thread.

We put it up in the air today and the back tires sure enough were spinning. They were noticibally slower than the front though. I guess this is because of the power split?? Also there was a horrible grinding noise coming from beneath the rear of the car. Is it possible that the clutch is just going bad and not actually dead yet? This sound does not happen when i am driving.

The F/R wheels should rotate at the same speed, the torque split wont affect it. If the noise is comming from the rear of the transmission, then it has broken the transfer clutch basket off the back of the transfer gear. It wont make a noise on the road as the rear wheels are being driven by the road, and the clutch has both sides turning at the same speed, Up in the air, only the fronts are driven and the rear are being driven by the broken basket, thats why it makes the noise then.

There has been a few that this has happend to lately. It is caused by the transfer clutch not taking up instantly when the front spins, by the time it comes on the front are spinning hard so the shock of the clutch engaging breaks the basket off.

This problem won't occur in the Euro VTD version.

Harvey.

mranderson · #9 03-10-2004, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oab_au

The F/R wheels should rotate at the same speed, the torque split wont affect it. If the noise is comming from the rear of the transmission, then it has broken the transfer clutch basket off the back of the transfer gear. It wont make a noise on the road as the rear wheels are being driven by the road, and the clutch has both sides turning at the same speed, Up in the air, only the fronts are driven and the rear are being driven by the broken basket, thats why it makes the noise then.

There has been a few that this has happend to lately. It is caused by the transfer clutch not taking up instantly when the front spins, by the time it comes on the front are spinning hard so the shock of the clutch engaging breaks the basket off.

This problem won't occur in the Euro VTD version.

Harvey.

is there any way to avoid this?

UberRoo · #10 03-11-2004, 02:32 AM

oab_au is exactly right about what's wrong. As for why it broke, his explaination is as good as any. Personally, I think the design of the clutch basket is horrible and I blame the design solely for the failure of the part - not abuse by the driver or any other fault of the transmission or controller.

More pictures for the curious.

Here's what the broken part looks like:

mranderson · #11 03-11-2004, 09:44 AM

so is this something i just need to plan on fixing like every month or what??? There has to be something i can do or get done to help at least delay the problem??

thanks for the help

Mr. Pockets · #12 03-11-2004, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mranderson
so is this something i just need to plan on fixing like every month or what??? There has to be something i can do or get done to help at least delay the problem??

thanks for the help

Every month? What's with the huge leaps in logic? If your clutch basket is broken, then you need to either have it repaired (Harvey welded his back together) or get a new one. The part is about $250 on subaruparts.com. While you're in there, you may or may not want to replace the clutch discs themselves (a total of $160 for all twelve) and duty solenoid C ($80).

But it's certainly not something that's going to break 'every month.' I've only seen it happen a couple of times so far. Once was Harvey's car and...wait...have we had any other confirmed cases?

Oh, and if the clutch basket is broken, and you don't fix it, then you may or may not be distributing more and more metal filings throughout the tranny. Tough to say, but I wouldn't want the reduction gears (which drive the front wheels and so happen to be in the same cavity) chewing on the broken bits anyway. I don't even know how much the reduction gears would eventually cost to replace (subaruparts.com doesn't list a price), but I bet at that point you'd be better off replacing the entire tranny.

Edit: By the way, this thread totally belongs in Tech Q&A. I'm moving it there now, but please post in the correct forums in the future. Thanks.

mranderson · #13 03-11-2004, 03:10 PM

sorry about the wrong forum

anyway thanks for the help. Its just frustrating when everything starts breaking at once

Mr. Pockets · #14 03-11-2004, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mranderson
sorry about the wrong forum

Don't worry about it. It's my pet peeve, but thankfully the administrators of this site have entrusted me with the ability to indulge it. Hopefully I also help keep the site a little better organized.

Quote:

Originally posted by mranderson
anyway thanks for the help. Its just frustrating when everything starts breaking at once

Don't...

...I...

...know it.

But what a special car it is when it all works.

Good luck, man. Let us know what happens.

oab_au · #15 03-11-2004, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr. Pockets

Every month? What's with the huge leaps in logic? If your clutch basket is broken, then you need to either have it repaired (Harvey welded his back together) or get a new one. The part is about $250 on subaruparts.com. While you're in there, you may or may not want to replace the clutch discs themselves (a total of $160 for all twelve) and duty solenoid C ($80).

But it's certainly not something that's going to break 'every month.' I've only seen it happen a couple of times so far. Once was Harvey's car and...wait...have we had any other confirmed cases?

Oh, and if the clutch basket is broken, and you don't fix it, then you may or may not be distributing more and more metal filings throughout the tranny. Tough to say, but I wouldn't want the reduction gears (which drive the front wheels and so happen to be in the same cavity) chewing on the broken bits anyway. I don't even know how much the reduction gears would eventually cost to replace (subaruparts.com doesn't list a price), but I bet at that point you'd be better off replacing the entire tranny.

Edit: By the way, this thread totally belongs in Tech Q&A. I'm moving it there now, but please post in the correct forums in the future. Thanks.

Hi Nick, I would love to take the credit for pulling down the box and welding the basket back. Sadly This ability disappeared along with the right arm.

That was Uberoo that did that nice piece of work. I think there was somebody else that had the same problem lately, and I think Immortal Suby broke the first one that I heard of some time ago.

Harvey.