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  #1  
Old 09-12-2003, 09:15 PM
FearWhat
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Tranny Fluid

How true is this sounds good for sure hehe, If this is true, maybe we could have like a how to doc posted with that info? for people with tranny Questions?

We could edit this as a nice chart? thanks to the orginal writter to this.

Peter,

Just for the record, you should understand that the SVX has the ability
to spike the ATF temperature rapidly, just from a single drive up a long
hill, or a day in stop and go traffic, or anything that causes the
tranny to continually upshift and downshift. If it gets high enough, it
will cause your transmission to self destruct in only a few miles. I
drive in 3rd gear in city traffic to eliminate all the shifts to high
and back to 3rd. I only shift to 4th when I can maintain 45 mph for a
reasonable distance.

Here is an ATF temperature vs tranny lifetime chart.
----------------------
Automatic Transmission Fluid Oxidation
Automatic transmission fluid (Dextron) will provide 100,000 miles of
service before oxidation occurs under normal operating temperatures of
about 170°F. (The SVX thermostat is set at about 170.) Above normal
operating temperatures, the oxidation rate doubles (useful life of fluid
is cut in half) with each 20° increase in temperature.

The approximate life expectancy at various temperatures is as follows:

175°F 100,000 miles
195°F 50,000 miles
212°F 25,000 miles
235°F 12,000 miles
(In a 93 SVX with an external cooler and temp gauge, and RedLine High
Temp ATF, I once saw temps of 240F. I was driving around slowly in some
hills, looking at houses in 70F weather. Note that, for standard
Dextron, I would have had less than 12,000 miles left on that ATF. I
would never have known except for the guage.) 255°F 6,250 miles (I
suspect that many SVX's see temps of 275F without their drivers being
aware of it.)
275°F 3,000 miles
295°F 1,500 miles
(The SVX ATF warning light comes on at about 305F.)
315°F 750 miles
335°F 325 miles
355°F 160 miles
375°F 80 miles
390°F 40 miles
415°F Less than 30 minutes

This information clearly shows why transmission oil coolers and the
various maintenance intervals are recommended for severe usage. (The SVX
should be considered Severe Usage, because of the added load of the AWD
and the limited cooling capability.)

Above 300°F, the metals inside the transmission will warp and distort in
varying degrees depending on the severity of overheat. Because this
damage occurs and fluid life is so seriously impaired, rocking out of
snow, mud or sand should never exceed a very few minutes.
-----------------------

The point is that it's not how often it is changed - it is that it must
be changed if it has been damaged. So you need to check the quality of
the ATF regularly, and change it if it has been damaged. If you EVER see
the ATF light, you have big problems. Stop immediately, and leave the
engine running until it cools off (make certain your fans are working).

It is exactly for that reason that I use the RedLine High Temp. It lasts
longer without damage. It takes an additional 70F before it begins
breaking down. My local Subaru service department uses only RedLine for
all their transmission work. They also have and use a flush system. They
said "It doesn't make sense to add good ATF to bad ATF."

You should try to find out the working temperature of the Mobile
Synthetic ATF SHC. Compare it to Dextron, and to RedLine HT ATF. If you
are driving 25000 miles between changes, you are betting that your ATF
temp never exceeds 212F. I assure you, it does, regularly.

John
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  #2  
Old 09-13-2003, 05:07 AM
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that was an excellent read - thanks for posting it.

i don't know about his cooler type/configuration, but 240 seems kinda high. i got over 200 a few weeks ago, but the driving i was doing would have been PUNISHING for any car. 85+ degrees out, lots of stop and go traffic, and for some reason i ended up on all these long uphill roads. i kept close attention to the gauge, and it peaked once at 207, and then quickly went down. my gauge will display peak temp at the push of a button, so its kinda helpful if you aren't paying attention and want to see how much damage you caused on a drive.

this is a tip from Mike Davis, and i can't recommend it enough:

REMOVE YOUR PLASTIC UNDERTRAY!!!

i think this is why my temps rarely go above 200 now. the belly pan has a BIG effect on tranny temperatures. i've also noticed that the temps drop MUCH more quickly than they did before. this is no B.S. - i watch that temp gauge like a hawk, and i noticed the difference right away. i plan on putting the undertray back on for winter to allow the tranny fluid to warm up properly, and to keep salt and sludge off the underside. do yourself (and your tranny) a favor and get that damn belly pan off in the summer!!!! those in warmer climates may want to just leave it off all year long.
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Old 09-13-2003, 09:58 AM
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We had a meet and drive last weekend over a pass in the North Cascade mountains. The max temp my tranny got to was 290. It was there only for about 2 minutes, but it still got to that temp. I was considering changing the transmission fluid, but now I know I am. Thanks for the post. I am working on a graph and a how to. Oh, and one other note - the belly pan was on, and the temp was in the 80s. Over the rest of the trip when the temp was over 90, the transmission temp was only around 180.
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  #4  
Old 09-13-2003, 10:12 AM
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I buried the needle on my temp gauge at the tail of the dragon this year - 318 curves in 11 miles will create alot of heat. For the fall meet I'll try it without the belly pan but I don't think in this case it's going to help.
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Old 10-15-2003, 10:26 PM
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The highest I've EVER seen on mine was 228°F (92, no external cooler)
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Old 10-16-2003, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Earthworm
The highest I've EVER seen on mine was 228°F (92, no external cooler)
Dave, You are just not pushing that baby fast enough, get on the gas, man.
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Old 10-16-2003, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by svx_commuter


Dave, You are just not pushing that baby fast enough, get on the gas, man.
the highest i've gotten was 212, and i drive pretty 'enthusiastically'. that was before i removed the plastic undertray, too (thanks Mike! ) i may have hit 201 once since then. its starting to be around that time to put the belly pan back on, though. BTW, i am in mostly stop-n-go traffic, as anyone in the south hills of Pittsburgh knows about.
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  #8  
Old 10-16-2003, 06:01 PM
JJay
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Question Tranny Knowledge for Dummies

I am a neophite to all the information you are dropping, but I am here for a purpose. To save myself some trouble.

Do all you guys have tranny coolers?

You recommend removing the tranny cooler belly pan, but not in winter climates? I understand that.

Do SVX's have tranny fluid temperature gauges? Or are all of yours aftermarket?

I am only asking to make sure I understand. I am printing this out and taking notes. I am about to buy a 1992 or possibly 1994 SVX and I want to make the tranny lasts as long as possible, but I have no idea how the previous owner abused it or not. Thanks for any help, because I am new to the car and really don't have a lot of money for expensive repairs, but like a lot of people I love the looks, perforance and design of the RARE SVX.
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Old 10-17-2003, 05:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Landshark


the highest i've gotten was 212, ......
212 is fantastic! That is more the temperture of what I have seen on the fuild going back to the tranny after being cooled. Are you hooked up in series with a large cooler?
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Old 10-17-2003, 07:45 AM
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I too have never gotten past 212. Did that once. Other highest reading was 208 sitting in NY I95 traffic for 3 hours in 100 degree weather. My readings come from a sensor in the pan (which I would suspect should be higher)
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Old 10-17-2003, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by benebob
I too have never gotten past 212. Did that once. Other highest reading was 208 sitting in NY I95 traffic for 3 hours in 100 degree weather. My readings come from a sensor in the pan (which I would suspect should be higher)
Bob, I think the pan temperature is the correct place if I remeber right. The fluid from the TC is the hottest and this goes out to the cooler. It isn't hot for very long and it isn't the majority of the fluid in the trans. The fluid from the pan is pumped to the clutches and other parts directly.
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Old 10-17-2003, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by svx_commuter


212 is fantastic! That is more the temperture of what I have seen on the fuild going back to the tranny after being cooled. Are you hooked up in series with a large cooler?
i only hit that for a few seconds, too, in 96 degree weather, about an hour of stop and go traffic, and driving up several large hills (that is the KILLER!!!). if it goes over 200, i start to take preventive action (i'm a wimp, but a wimp with a stock tranny that shifts perfectly ).

not in series - i bypassed the stock cooler (heater?) completely. i'm not sure what GVW rating my cooler is - my Summit catalog is at work. its just a TCI 'fin-n-tube' cooler.
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Old 10-17-2003, 10:13 AM
vikesfandan
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Anybody have a pic of the tranny cooler belly pan or some distinguishing feature they could describe for us "neophites" as JJay put it? I don't want to remove something that shouldn't be.
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Old 10-17-2003, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Landshark
.................not in series - i bypassed the stock cooler (heater?) completely. i'm not sure what GVW rating my cooler is - my Summit catalog is at work. its just a TCI 'fin-n-tube' cooler.
So what's the size of the cooler? Is it as wide and tall as the radiator? or half the size?
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Old 10-17-2003, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by svx_commuter


So what's the size of the cooler? Is it as wide and tall as the radiator? or half the size?
here's the spec from the Summit website, but it doesn't say what the GVW rating is. i'll look in my catalog at work later. it fit between the radiator and the condensor easily.

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...t=TCI%2D823800
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