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  #16  
Old 10-05-2005, 10:34 PM
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Parts that Toyota supplies? Sheet metal or engines? Everything else is made by outside sources, neither designed or engineered by Toyota. This is common practice for all OEMs, they specify parameters and prices, that's about it. Parts shared by different OEMs only save development costs - why reinvent a wheel that can be bought cheaper from someone else's shelf? Ford used to buy GM's A6 a/c compressor, in return they sold their ATC (auto climate control) system to them.

The vast majority of recalls are due to vendor supplied parts. That's not to say the OEMs don't have any responsibility, they keep pounding the vendors for cheaper and cheaper. They have to answer to stockholders and executives that don't want to give up their golden handcuffs and parachutes nor the lobster lunches in the executive cafeteria. We're now in a recall situation that TI caused by changing specs to reduce cost on a part that is a entirely redundant safety backup. But the media doesn't fault the supplier so the OEM gets the black eye.

Uh, when you leave something alone you don't have to announce it before making a comment.
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  #17  
Old 10-06-2005, 12:09 AM
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Parts prices

Hi everyone, When I read Lwins post I took it to mean that he would not get a discount anymore as I believe he works for a gm dealer. Of course this would not be the first time I was wrong! Take care, BOBB
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  #18  
Old 10-06-2005, 12:59 AM
Tofu
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Toyota is fixing to make a bid to buy GM anyhow. They have the cash on hand to purchase every outstanding share of GM stock; they are simply waiting for a politically expedient time to do so. The hybrid technology sharing agreement that was signed earlier this year is believed to be a precursor to an attempted buyout, as GM has exactly zero hybrid technology that's of interest to Toyota.

On a related note, Ford and GM's financial troubles are primarily due to the overwhelming amount of healthcare and pension related costs each company is dealing with. Overseas, the governments of Japan, Germany, Korea, among others, contribute to or pay for healthcare, which lowers the operating costs for the manufacturers significantly. In the US, it's estimated that the healthcare and pension costs for GM and Ford employees can add thousands of dollars to the cost of each car, costs that eat the already razor-thin profit margin- one of the reasons that the Big Two concentrate so heavily on their pickups and SUVs is that the profit margin on those vehicles can absorb the overhead, unlike pretty much every actual car they sell.

It's quite a bit like Airbus surpassing Boeing as a supplier of commercial aircraft because Airbus is heavily supported through state subsidies and Boeing pretty much pays for everything itself.
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  #19  
Old 10-06-2005, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tofu
Toyota is fixing to make a bid to buy GM anyhow. They have the cash on hand to purchase every outstanding share of GM stock; they are simply waiting for a politically expedient time to do so. The hybrid technology sharing agreement that was signed earlier this year is believed to be a precursor to an attempted buyout, as GM has exactly zero hybrid technology that's of interest to Toyota.
What?! You are insane!

I'm going to have to take Pockets' stance on this: show me proof.

I've said it before and i'll say it again, Toyota has no interest in buying GM. There is no advantage, nothing to be gained. Only a huge financial burden that is GM's healthcare program. They would basically be purchasing the highest interest loan available today.

BTW - Toyota got it's "hybrid technology" from GM. GM has moved onto other programs that may actually have a shot at becoming a mainstay. Hybrids are a fad, not a solution to the world's energy crisis. Ideas such as fuel cells offer a much more promising future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tofu
On a related note, Ford and GM's financial troubles are primarily due to the overwhelming amount of healthcare and pension related costs each company is dealing with. Overseas, the governments of Japan, Germany, Korea, among others, contribute to or pay for healthcare, which lowers the operating costs for the manufacturers significantly. In the US, it's estimated that the healthcare and pension costs for GM and Ford employees can add thousands of dollars to the cost of each car, costs that eat the already razor-thin profit margin- one of the reasons that the Big Two concentrate so heavily on their pickups and SUVs is that the profit margin on those vehicles can absorb the overhead, unlike pretty much every actual car they sell.
However, that is a good point.
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  #20  
Old 10-06-2005, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by MidnightBlack92
I agree with the above though, what is this going to do to the price of parts?

Confused?

I work for a dealership that is going to be tied with GM soon. With GM, I can still get bigger discounts on parts than being a regular dealer. Thus, making my parts costs higher. Not much higher but still higher.
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  #21  
Old 10-07-2005, 06:11 PM
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Funny, hybrid technology is here today. Fuel cells aren't expected to be available on the open market for at least seven to ten years and that's only if someone can trip over a pile of answers.

Toyota brought hybrid to market before GM. GM had pure electric technology that they abandoned due to lack of adequate battery technology. It would have been a bonehead move to not market hybrid, those that have it can't produce as much as the market is buying. I don't recall, (and I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time) GM ever displaying any full-hybrid tech.
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  #22  
Old 10-08-2005, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beav
Toyota brought hybrid to market before GM. GM had pure electric technology that they abandoned due to lack of adequate battery technology. It would have been a bonehead move to not market hybrid, those that have it can't produce as much as the market is buying. I don't recall, (and I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time) GM ever displaying any full-hybrid tech.
Hybrids are not old enough for anyone to say that they are here to stay. We haven't even begun to see the maintenance costs and dangers of these vehicles as they age, no to mention the problem of disposal. Even many of the people who pioneered Hybrids will admit that they likely are not here to stay.

Gm hybrid vehicles...

http://autos.msn.com/advice/article....tentid=4022529

Even more importantly, their new technology actually has a shot at becoming a standard, not an expensive fad. Being barely more expensive than a standard vehicle, and requiring no more maintenance or care than a standard gasoline only setup, it would seem this is where the (at least immediate) future lies...

http://www.hybridcars.com/silverado-sierra.html
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  #23  
Old 10-08-2005, 10:34 PM
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Matthewmongan Matthewmongan is offline
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thats not news, shadow. when i was thinking of being a mechanical engineer i worked on a hybrid suburban at umd college park, that was almost 4 years ago.


hydrogen fuel cells will work great to power houses. the problem is using electrolosys to extract h from h2o requires alot of power and power means fossil fuel. so for a car market it is not feasible. but i have seen good aplications on sailboats where the motion of the current of water powers the electrolosys to get hydrogen.

Last edited by Matthewmongan; 10-09-2005 at 12:53 AM.
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  #24  
Old 10-11-2005, 10:50 AM
Red SVX 92 Red SVX 92 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tofu
On a related note, Ford and GM's financial troubles are primarily due to the overwhelming amount of healthcare and pension related costs each company is dealing with. Overseas, the governments of Japan, Germany, Korea, among others, contribute to or pay for healthcare, which lowers the operating costs for the manufacturers significantly. In the US, it's estimated that the healthcare and pension costs for GM and Ford employees can add thousands of dollars to the cost of each car, costs that eat the already razor-thin profit margin- one of the reasons that the Big Two concentrate so heavily on their pickups and SUVs is that the profit margin on those vehicles can absorb the overhead, unlike pretty much every actual car they sell.
Just curious, since the Japanese companies have set up shop here in the US, are they similarly burdened with such problems? Pretty much much every Japanese company has factories, etc., in the US.
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  #25  
Old 10-11-2005, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Red SVX 92
Just curious, since the Japanese companies have set up shop here in the US, are they similarly burdened with such problems? Pretty much much every Japanese company has factories, etc., in the US.
Nope, they're non-union. So they can say "bend over" and the employees have no choice but to listen.
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  #26  
Old 10-12-2005, 05:00 AM
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Matthewmongan Matthewmongan is offline
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Originally Posted by Shadow248
Nope, they're non-union. So they can say "bend over" and the employees have no choice but to listen.

having studied Japanese management, i have to say its not what you think it is.
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  #27  
Old 10-12-2005, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthewmongan
having studied Japanese management, i have to say its not what you think it is.
How many of these companies have you worked for?
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  #28  
Old 10-12-2005, 05:21 PM
Red SVX 92 Red SVX 92 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthewmongan
having studied Japanese management, i have to say its not what you think it is.
You almost got me in trouble at work, I was laughing so hard.
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  #29  
Old 10-12-2005, 08:44 PM
JeffN JeffN is offline
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Can a hybrid forester be far behind? Say, 290hp?
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