HELP! Stranded in U.P.! SVX is dead!

Chicane · #1 10-19-2003, 01:19 PM

Alright, I'm not going to tell you everything, I'll save that for when I get back. But basically, long story short, I was driving on a dirt road in my SVX, and I was traveling about 15mph or so. I saw a big dip coming up, so I slowed down, but heard a 'scrape' and my car lost all power. The engine died, and it will not start.

I've been under my car a little, and the oil pan is fine, the transmission looks fine, the suspension looks fine. The only part that does not look fine is that rear 'frame rail' type parts of the undercarriage (basically under the rear seat and not directly in the center of the car, but not on the edges of the car, kinda between them) were crushed upwards. I thought that maybe a fuel line runs in one of those rails, and it crushed the fuel line, and thats why it won't start. However, fuel is not leaking, and... this is the really weird part.

I'm sure most of you recognize the sound an SVX makes when it starts. Instead of the Rir Rir Rir Rir >VROOOM< it usually makes, it has a different sound now when I try to start it. The engine still turns over, but it now goes "RIR-RIR" >space< "Rir Rir!" >space< "rir Rir >space< "rir rir!" in that pattern. Does anyone know what could possibly cause this?

Like I said, my car was running fine, I bottomed out and heard a scrape, and now it will not start. I'm going to a car repair shop tomorrow at 5:30 in the morning and any information you could provide would be extremely helpful!

Thank you!

- Rob

BTW: Some good news: I know that the SVX is capable of hanging with a modded Audi S4, and a modded S8. In the straights, and in the corners. My god. The SVX is an incredible car. I have a video that you will all LOVE.....

thumper_svx · #2 10-19-2003, 02:01 PM

Did you check to see if any part of the exhaust was crushed... especially around the resonator area (where it drops to a single pipe)? If the exhaust is completely collapsed then the backpressure could be preventing ignition.

It COULD also be fuel starvation... so your theory about the crushed lines might be good too. However, since the starter is electrical and doesn't need gas, the engine should still be turning. However, it is possible again that no fuel is coming through when the engine computer expects it... that could explain the noise.

Also... one other thing to check us the drive-shaft to the AWD... (is yours an AWD? I can't remember!) if that's badly bent then that would definitely stall the engine. Wouldn't necessarily explain the starting problems though.

Hope this helps! Keep us all posted.

Seraph · #3 10-19-2003, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by thumper_svx

Also... one other thing to check us the drive-shaft to the AWD... (is yours an AWD? I can't remember!) if that's badly bent then that would definitely stall the engine. Wouldn't necessarily explain the starting problems though.

Hope this helps! Keep us all posted.

If the car is in 'P', the drive shaft is not being used. Neither is the tranny. My guess, just like Rob's is that fuel line getting crushed since our tanks are directly underneath our rear seats in the form of the seats. Check and see if there is fuel coming up to the front of the car. Also, like thumper said, check your exaust as well.

Subafreak · #4 10-19-2003, 04:00 PM

Yeah check to see if you got fuel at the engine, I don't think you could have crushed a fuel line but if you pushed up the bottom of the gas tank it might be cutting fuel off from getting sucked into the pump or the pump might have broke. That or the exaust thing but I would try pulling off the fule line at the filter to see if you got pressure there, just be carefull not to spray it all over yourself or the car.

Chicane · #5 10-19-2003, 05:06 PM

See, I would agree with the fuel line/starvation explanation, but that does NOT explain why the car turns over differently. Instead of a solid steady 'whir whir whir whir whir' its more 'stacatto-like'; its a 'whir whir' >.5 second pause<whir whir' >.5 second pause<whir whir' >.5 second pause<whir whir' >.5 second pause<.

I'm fairly mechnically inclined and while I agree that it might be a fuel problem (will check tomorrow) I cannot think of ANY REASON why it would start different. It just doesn't make any sense, especially considering I didn't SLAM the car on the bump, and instead just sorta bottomed out.

Any other ideas?! This sucks. I'm already going to miss a day of work. UGH.

- Rob

Chicane · #6 10-19-2003, 05:07 PM

Also, where are the fuel lines routed???? ALong the sides of the car, in the center of the car.... etc. If someone could provide a diagram that would be great, but like I said, the only thing that looked crushed was that 'quasi frame rail' that runs from front to back, and the crushed section was basically underneath the passnger footwell area.

HOWEVER; it still doesn't explain the weird starting/turning over noise.

- Rob

svx_commuter · #7 10-19-2003, 06:27 PM

The fuel lines run in the side rocker panels. Look under the back seat and you will see the lines coming out of the fuel pump. Most likely the bottom of the tank is pushed up. It sounds different because it has no fuel.

Motorsport-SVX · #8 10-19-2003, 08:45 PM

My guess is maybe you hit the bottom of the trans
and possibly bent the flex plate and a small section
is scraping against something....
Or you knocked a cable going to the starter loose
and its not getting good juice to the starter...

You sure you where only going 15 ???

Chicane · #9 10-20-2003, 08:58 AM

It has been towed to a foreign car repair shop; and they tested the fuel pressure. The fuel pressure was fine.

They also found out what was wrong: The drivers side cam is not aligned properly; it jumped teeth somehow. I just had my waterpump replaced about 3500 miles ago at the dealership. The repair shop was saying that incorrect tension on the tensioners could have caused this. This is really bad news, since we all know the SVX engine is an interference engine. I'm thinking about purchasing a 79 Pickup with a slant six to get us home, and perhaps coming up next weekend to tow the SVX home on a flatbed. Can I get the dealership to pay for this? Just because it jumped a few teeth, does that mean that the engine is toast? Or is it possible that the valves just closed and thats why it wasn't turning over, because it was trying to compress the air at the bottom of hte stroke? This is horrible. I'm supposed to be at work right now but instead I'm stuck in this town of 10k people, and 7 hours away from home.

ACK.

DOes anyone have any suggestions?

- Rob

Zeppelin · #10 10-20-2003, 09:14 AM

Rob, the SVX is NOT an interference engine.. Just readjust the cams and drive it home, then get another timing belt.

Mr. Pockets · #11 10-20-2003, 09:15 AM

I think it's unlikely that your engine is wrecked. The timing belt turns the exhaust cam and the intake cam is driven, by gear, by the exhaust cam. It's very unlikely that the intake cam skipped unless one of those gears is broken.

It is possible, though, that if the tensioner is bad, that the exhaust cam jumped a couple teeth on the timing belt. Your jolt from bottoming out very well could have caused this (given the bad tensioner).

It sounds to me like all you need is to get a new tensioner, install the timing belt correctly, and you should be good to go.

More info: The EG33 is only called an 'interference engine' because the valves could, technically, touch eachother. But something pretty catastrophic would have to happen to make them jump teeth in the first place.

Frickin' a, Rob, I'm sorry to hear about your problems.

Mr. Pockets · #12 10-20-2003, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zeppelin
Rob, the SVX is NOT an interference engine.. Just readjust the cams and drive it home, then get another timing belt.

It is and it isn't. If there's just a problem with the timing belt, then typically you're fine. But since the valves could, technically, touch eachother, then it's an 'interference engine.'

But that's extrememly unlikely. So, you're right, for the most part it is a non-interference engine. But not completely.

Chris · #13 10-20-2003, 11:00 AM

Rob,

Mr. Pockets is correct. The EG33 motor is by design a non-interference motor. It would take a catastrophic failure to actually get the valves to crash into one another and then cause the dreaded piston failure. The Subaru 2.5 motor has four cams similar in design to our SVX motor, but the main difference is the drive system. The 2.5 motor drives all four cams off the timing belt. The EG33 only drives the two exhaust cams. The intake cams are driven via a helix cut pair of gears that remain in time off the exhaust cams. Although its very possible to throw the valve timing off by slipping a tooth or so on the belt, the intake to exhaust valve timing will always remain true. The only exception would be some kind of serious failure in the gear drive system between the cams. I also agree with the other members here and recommend replacement of the gas charged belt tension assembly.

Good luck

Motorsport-SVX · #14 10-20-2003, 11:46 AM

that had to be a coincidense...
but my tensioner bolt broke about 3000 miles
after I did my belt etc too....
Installed a new one from the dealer and it was all
fine....

Mr. Pockets · #15 10-20-2003, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chris
Rob,

Mr. Pockets is correct. The EG33 motor is by design a non-interference motor.

Just to be clear, it's only practically a non-interference engine. Non-interference means that no failure in timing can cause a valve to come in contact with a piston or another valve.

That's just not the case with the SVX. The valves are positioned in such a way that, if the timing between them was messed up in some way, intake valves could come in contact with exhaust valves.

But that's so unlikely that I'd contend that something pretty horrible would have to happen to the engine first. A big frontal impact comes to mind as an example.

So, the EG33 is practically a non-interference engine. The whole point of such a design is so you can prevent further damage if there's a timing failure. But the only ways, that I can see, of causing a timing failure between the cams would severely damage the heads in the process anyway.