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  #16  
Old 11-21-2003, 02:42 PM
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I don't care one whit about prevailing public opinions on car manufacturers and their images. I grew up driving American cars even though my Dad kept pushing Toyota on me. I refused to drive anything but American cars back then.

My experience with many American cars finally pushed me to try something else. I tried several different Japanese cars, some German and even some Italian. My experiences with owning and driving all makes has led me to my current situation. One Subaru and one Honda. The Honda is my first Honda ever so I reserve judgement on Hondas at this point, but I do notice they have had a rusting problem. The worst cars I have ever owned have been Fords, and I have owned a lot of them. The best cars have been Subarus (honestly, my SVX has been the most reliable car I have ever owned). Regardless, I still have fond memories of most of my cars, some were just a little more problematic than others.

I do not rule out American cars automatically, but every time I own one I begin to notice some really poor quality in many areas. My relatives mostly drive current model American cars. Some are nice, most are not.

So I actually had to fight off my American manufacturer biased thoughts in order to try something other than American cars. American car quality is getting better, but I still believe they are behind several other companies, no matter what any study findings say. I form my opinions based upon my own real world experience with owning cars and consulting with my friends and family on their experiences.
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  #17  
Old 11-21-2003, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow248
...
My girlfriend has spent almost as much money fixing her SVX as i did BUYING my GTP, which is more comfortable, faster, and even gets better gas mileage. Oh but the SVX is better quality. Yeah you should hear the symphony of creaks, cranks, and thumps when she drives down an average PA road. The GTP? Nothing.

...

Stop watching TV and join the real world.
why dont you drive it around ten years or so then get back to us on its reliability. ive heard the gtp is substandard and the weight was poorly distributed.
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  #18  
Old 11-21-2003, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow248
I find it amazing how susceptible people are to "image promotion". Like how so many people on this site think american cars are substandard just because they are american. Especially while most of those who make the comments really have no clue what they are even talking about. How many of you have actually driven a 2000 or newer Corvette? Better yet, how many of you have even seen the interior on one? Everyone has this opinion that American cars are just not built as good as japanese or european cars. Well I've got news for you folks...consumer reports published their reliability ratings for the 40 largest automakers in the world. The results astounded most consumers. In the top ten were Cadillac and Pontiac. Not subaru. Ford and Chrysler both fell in the 20-30 ranking...which is well ahead of Land Rover (34) and Mercedes Benz (31).

My girlfriend has spent almost as much money fixing her SVX as i did BUYING my GTP, which is more comfortable, faster, and even gets better gas mileage. Oh but the SVX is better quality. Yeah you should hear the symphony of creaks, cranks, and thumps when she drives down an average PA road. The GTP? Nothing.

In the end it all comes down to Image. Just like VW. So many people think that VW's are some of the most reliable and well built cars on the road, when in reality they have scored next to last in every major quality and reliability test there is. But hey their advertisements say they're reliable, so they must be, right?

Stop watching TV and join the real world.
i've owned Plymouth, Chevy and Buick - garbage, every one of them. so your girlfriend has a beater SVX and you have a new GTP......give it time.
my brother-in-law has a 2000 Gran Prix and its already going to hell. he drives like a little old lady, too, so its not from abuse. i'll buy American again when i see more signs of quality control.
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  #19  
Old 11-21-2003, 05:56 PM
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oh yeah? well my friends 2001 grand am is already having problems.
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2012 Honda Insight, slow but cute.
  #20  
Old 11-21-2003, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shadow248

My girlfriend has spent almost as much money fixing her SVX as i did BUYING my GTP, which is more comfortable, faster, and even gets better gas mileage. Oh but the SVX is better quality. Yeah you should hear the symphony of creaks, cranks, and thumps when she drives down an average PA road. The GTP? Nothing.

I am going to ask you to compare apples to apples. You can not compare a 92SVX to a 2000+ GTP. That's just not fair. Do a comparison between 92SVX to majority of 92 American cars or hell japanese/European cars. Now we have something we can compare.

I am not saying SVXes are the best things since slice bread or the wheel but they are pretty good and reliable. Also, some american cars are very nice inside and are amazing. I think SVX itself needs better seats and such but hey that's me.

L
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  #21  
Old 11-21-2003, 07:26 PM
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im with you on the seats. a lot of my passengers have complained of them, and i sometimes get intense lower back pain on long trips.
also remember the gtp is s-charged. thats the only reason it can even move, though i was a pontiac fan and applaude them for trying.

edit: whoa. the truth is ugly.
http://www.c6corvette.com/

i await the '06 Z06.
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2012 Honda Insight, slow but cute.

Last edited by NikFu S.; 11-21-2003 at 07:56 PM.
  #22  
Old 11-23-2003, 10:52 AM
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I am going to ask you to compare apples to apples. You can not compare a 92SVX to a 2000+ GTP. That's just not fair. Do a comparison between 92SVX to majority of 92 American cars or hell japanese/European cars. Now we have something we can compare.


Got news for you fellas...it's a 1994 GTP, not a 2000. If it was a 2000, i wouldn't even bother to comment because those cars have been rated one of the most reliable and well built cars around, not only once...but by just about every reputable source. It's been on Car & Driver's ten best list since 2000. Again, no subarus on that list. So the car i'm speaking of is only 2 years newer than Mandi's SVX. Not only does it have much fewer problems, but the ones it does have cost 1/10th of the price to fix. Except for timing belts...for some reason it costs $800 to do the timing belts on the GTP and mandi got hers done for $300. But that's routine maintenance anyway.

I do not rule out American cars automatically, but every time I own one I begin to notice some really poor quality in many areas. My relatives mostly drive current model American cars. Some are nice, most are not.

There is not a car out there that doesn't have quality problems in some areas. Like the electrical systems on the mighty BMWs. Or Honda and Chrysler's transmissions. Or GM's starters and alternators, or Ford's Cylinder heads, or Mercedes Benz's engines, or Subaru's suspensions...the list goes on and on.

My point is simply that American cars these days are equals to the foreign makers in quality and reliability. In fact you can't even differentiate between domestic and foreign anymore cause there is no such thing. Chryslers are a perfect example of this. GM now shares platforms between the US and europe, Hondas and Acuras are made in Ohio now. And i know of alot of other foreign makers that build on US soil, just can't remember exactly where at the moment. The point is, there really is no such thing as foreign or domestic anymore, so how can we say there is a diference in quality? Every car has it's problems, and i don't see any consistency in the problems that people talk about in american cars.

also remember the gtp is s-charged. thats the only reason it can even move, though i was a pontiac fan and applaude them for trying.

Side note: the 1994 GTP is not supercharged...it's a 3.4L DOHC motor making 215hp/240lb. torque. the 1994-96 GTP is one second faster to 60mph than the 97+ GTP with the supercharger. For a good comparison, the 94-96 GTP was faster than the 94-96 Mustang GT (V8). The 97-2003 Grand Prix GT has 200hp (no supercharger) and next to the GTP, was the fastest car in it's class. Trust me, GM has never had problems with power.

Last edited by Shadow248; 11-23-2003 at 11:05 AM.
  #23  
Old 11-23-2003, 11:40 AM
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ok stop fighting, i started a thread about a c6 corvette and now people are fighting about a GTP, i will close this thread if no one has anything else to say about it.
phil
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  #24  
Old 11-23-2003, 12:01 PM
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I closed this thread at Phil's request.

Mike

PS- SVX's are the best cars in the universe!!!!
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