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  #16  
Old 10-13-2005, 11:23 PM
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Matthewmongan Matthewmongan is offline
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i agree, ron. discrimination is pervasive in our society. we cant help but make generalizations about groups of people. this by itself is not a form of discrimination but the way it manifest itslef creates an inviroment in which those who do not represent the norm have to work harder to sucseed.

i agree that the bluring of gender roles has caused confusion in the homes and in the work place. but in an intelectual arena should a woman not be given qual opertunity as man.

if you look at language, the masculine pronoun is considered to be used as the nongender specific and genderspecific article. is man the norm and woman a deviation of that norm, or his human the norm and man and woman smaller parts of it?

i wonder if it is human nature to subscribe to generalizations or if it is a social construct. am i realy matt mongan or am i just a product of said social construct? are we shaping society or is society shaping us?

Last edited by Matthewmongan; 10-13-2005 at 11:30 PM.
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  #17  
Old 10-13-2005, 11:42 PM
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"Feminism strives for equality but the way it does this is by creating a division. Suddenly, the world is divided into feminist and non-feminist. By accepting the labels of manliness and womanliness we create a fracture between the two."

One thing that has not been memtioned yet is that TRUE FEMINISM does strive for equality, but goes one step further! Now many of the true feminists celebrate being superior to man and that they can do anything without men. They no longer need men for partners in life, husbands, or fathers of their children. This movement has confused the roles of men and women to the point that many no longer really know what role they play in life. There is a Big difference between the sexes, and we should be happy that we are different. If we are the same, how boaring it would be.
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  #18  
Old 10-13-2005, 11:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Matthewmongan
There is no female action or male action
What about childbirth?

Anyhow, shouldn't you post some pics of those Victoria's Secret models and the chicks in those other ads so we can see what you're talking about?
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  #19  
Old 10-13-2005, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthewmongan
In the Kung Fu world there is no disabled, man or woman, there is only human. We see in movies drunken old men with canes, women and children fighting as proficient as the best male martial artist. But we still have societal pressures to look and behave a certain way..........

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  #20  
Old 10-14-2005, 01:02 AM
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First post is pretty much on-par with what I think.
Subsequent posts show nobody gets it.

The world, or at least the USA where I live, is divided into penis and vagina.

If you aren't one, you're the other.
If what you are doesn't match what's under your belt, you're an outcast.

In my opinion however the problem is not the machinated society dropping a heavy hand upon the non-conforming individual, but the individual being too weak willed to represent themselves truthfully.

Things are the way they are because the majority of people would rather avoid conflict and go with the flow so to speak.

This annoys me in that I strive to break most societal norms, and being a so-called man of under 6ft and 140lbs my words means next to nothing because I cannot live up to other people expectations of what a "real man" is.

I stopped getting haircuts 18 months ago and suddenly the "girly" jokes and comments are at an all-time high? I'm being taken less and less seriously because of this, and cutting my hair would just be an act of weakness, of pure conformity to societal peer pressures.

A question I often ask is if this particular act of cutting hair (hair length, it's an easy subject for everyone to grasp so I'll using keep it) is sign of upper class civilization. After all long dirty manes went out with the caveman. Society and the world today is viewed as an advanced civilization because of these constant changing fads that manage to weave into every facet of life.
Are these popular things supplanting natural man or has it lead us towards our advancement?
Most people consider the latter and view this as the sole reason they lead a comfortable life with numerous ammenities, and associate historical trends with advancement and consequently what is right and practically universal law which must be followed blindly.
While I see current society as a good thing and behold advancement with open arms as I am one of these people with at least a semi-comfortable life the nature boy in me disapproves of the spoon fed ideals and morals born of shoddy interpretation of ancestral (RE: peer pressure blighted) views.

The lazy populace of today observes the media highlight and absorbs it like a mindless sponge and sadly people lose the ability to think for themselves on the most basic of levels: good and bad, like and dislike, right and wrong.

Luckily these people are not the majority.
However find not solace in the fact most people are too spineless to speak out agianst what they consider popular opinion.

-----


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Last edited by NikFu S.; 10-14-2005 at 01:04 AM.
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  #21  
Old 10-14-2005, 01:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikFu S.

First person to call me a hippy who's name is not Alan or Harry gets it.
hippy.

i had hair halfway down my back until i was 24 (metAlhead), and from then on it was shaved completely off. i don't care about fads and trends. if i did, i'd drive a Mustang and wear a striped shirt with a popped collar. i only aims to please myself (and Mrs. Shark).

i don't know what the hell the rest of your post means, or this one, but now i've had too many beers and i'm going to bed.
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  #22  
Old 10-14-2005, 01:35 AM
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Haha! I half expect at least this as much from teh j00.
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  #23  
Old 10-14-2005, 02:58 AM
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Matthewmongan Matthewmongan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ensteele
"Feminism strives for equality but the way it does this is by creating a division. Suddenly, the world is divided into feminist and non-feminist. By accepting the labels of manliness and womanliness we create a fracture between the two."

One thing that has not been memtioned yet is that TRUE FEMINISM does strive for equality, but goes one step further! Now many of the true feminists celebrate being superior to man and that they can do anything without men. They no longer need men for partners in life, husbands, or fathers of their children. This movement has confused the roles of men and women to the point that many no longer really know what role they play in life. There is a Big difference between the sexes, and we should be happy that we are different. If we are the same, how boaring it would be.
in the philosophical view of feminism, what you describe would be considered feminist elitism. they are as unjust as the men who orpess women or the any other racist.

it is easily aparent that thier exist diferences between the sexes. however, those diferences to easily become steriotypes. it is easy to see the diferences between two things and infer an opinion. e.g. any child can see that a cube is a cube and a ball is a ball but it takes wisdom to understand the similarities between the two.

Maybe it is western philosophical importance on the self that makes it so hard for people to understand the importance of unity.

let me put it this way. what would you say is the largest life form on this planet? a whale? what if i told you that it is a forest of aspen trees? you see only the tops of the trees but when you dig under the surface of the earth you can planly see that all the roots are interconected and that each tree is part of a larger organism. dig under the surface of your perception and you will find the same thing. descarte's idea that he is a "thinking being" which he uses to postulate that he "thinks there fore (he) is" is a good view to take. if we are all thinking beings are the diferences that we can see really important?
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  #24  
Old 10-14-2005, 05:13 AM
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Uh, yeah!

How about 'I think, therefore I am and as such I have a preference'? While some may prefer two boobs on a stick, ome may seek out a plastic lawn bag with three hundred pounds of unrendered fat inside. I'm certain the vast majority prefers something between the two extremes.

Personally, the only place gender roles are important to me is behind closed doors. Beyond that I treat everyone with the same level of consideration.

Sociopsychobabble - It's much ado about nothing.
If I don't fall into somebody's little box does that mean there is something wrong with me? Do you think I care as much about what someone thinks of me as much as they apparently feel the need to categorize or judge me? Sorry, there's only one person I need to impress - me. Do I live up to my own expectations?

Thanks, but no thanks. I'll just stick to keeping my side of the street clean. It's a big enough job for me.
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  #25  
Old 10-14-2005, 05:25 AM
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BTW, throw this into the mix. Aspen trees are 'starter' trees in an environment. They are the early life in an area of low/no vegetation. Their unity provides them the ability to survive in hostile areas, developing a soil base for other vegetation to later take over and dominate, eventually displacing them entirely.

So, unity is self-sacrificing to the needs of the individual?

Hmm... using non-sentient vegetation to mimic human sociopsychology, an interesting concept. You get an F.
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  #26  
Old 10-14-2005, 08:58 AM
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LMAO!


Beav gets an A+, and extra credit.
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  #27  
Old 10-15-2005, 03:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikFu S.
First person to call me a hippy who's name is not Alan or Harry gets it.

HIPPY


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  #28  
Old 10-15-2005, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Landshark
LMAO!


Beav gets an A+, and extra credit.
^^^i agree with Beav and Muleface-Horsebreath(who is 'more human than a hu-man'....:P)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikFu S.
I stopped getting haircuts 18 months ago and suddenly the "girly" jokes and comments are at an all-time high? I'm being taken less and less seriously because of this, and cutting my hair would just be an act of weakness...
sounds like a personal problem. i don't know about LongManedMule, i had long hair and no one ever called me "girly" or made such jokes. i never had a problem with people not taking me seriously whether i had long or short hair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Landshark
i only aims to please myself (and Mrs. Shark);.
yeah, you better or she'll put you on time-out (no ps2 & no car modding) and have you mow the lawn.

Last edited by Noir; 10-15-2005 at 11:59 AM.
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  #29  
Old 10-15-2005, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy
HIPPY
j0000!!!11

Noir: Yeah it is a personal problem but not enough to matter in the long run. Screw everyone that tells me to cut it.
It's more rebelAr!
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  #30  
Old 10-19-2005, 05:35 PM
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Alycone Alycone is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by NikFu S.
I stopped getting haircuts 18 months ago and suddenly the "girly" jokes and comments are at an all-time high? I'm being taken less and less seriously because of this, and cutting my hair would just be an act of weakness...
Maybe its the rednecks you hang out with? I went to an urban artsy highschool, no one batted an eye when the boys wore dresses or the girls shaved their heads.
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