'96/'97 SVX question - Page 2

Seraph · #16 03-28-2004, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chiketkd
These Subaru flat 6's seem to be one of the most under developed engines I've come across.

That I am not too sure about. You are talking about the engine from an aircraft making company. At 10:1 compression ratio, I am not sure if you can get too much more. A little more perhaps. If you can pump in H2 in there instead of gas, you can get a lot more power but we are talking about a whole new issue.

Chiketkd · #17 03-28-2004, 11:40 PM

Seraph by 'under developed' I meant in terms of its automotive applications. Also a 10:1 compression ratio is no longer considered to be very high...several manufacturers today are running above a 10.0:1 ratio. Nissan's 3.5L VQ used in the 350Z/G35 runs a 10.3:1 ratio, while the flat 6 used in the 911 Carrera runs an 11.3:1 ratio. Even Ford's SVT Focus runs a 10.2:1 ratio.

Going back to NA performance mods, the ones I'll be looking at initially will be:

JDM Grounding Kit ($40 on ebay)
Motorsports Warehouse Exhaust ($395 + 2.5" piping + labor = approx $600 total)
Cone Air Filter kit ($75)
Stage 1 ECU upgrade ($179.99)

That comes to a hair under $900 and those mods alone will not alter the appearance of your SVX in any way, while adding over 40 'safe' hp. I also don't feel I'll need to upgrade the driveshaft at that point as the power increase will be produced gradually as the revs climb, as opposed to a big surge of power as with NOS or a turbo system when it comes on boost.

As I don't plan to do my 5spd swap right away, I'll also spend $50 on a shift kit and $90 on a tranny cooler (as well as use synthetic fluid). That should bring my total initial investment to just a tad over $1000 and my SVX should be shifting better, running cooler (in the tranny) and be able to run mid to low 14's in the 1/4. Once the 5 spd goes in, 13 sec timeslips shouldn't be out of the question.

And this will all be Naturally Aspirated!

Seraph · #18 03-28-2004, 11:53 PM

I know of a 92 SVX with a ECU Chip. Talk to mohrds for more info on that.

I believe that in 92 alone they have about 11 different ECU revisions so good luck trying to get one that will fit a 92 let alone any other year. And to be honest, I don't see that much power gain.

If you want a quicker SVX, I'd go get a 92. I've driven a couple of 92s, 94s and 96s and 92s are the quickest. you are going to do a 5 speed swap too so...

Chiketkd · #19 03-29-2004, 12:16 AM

Previous ECU upgrades for the SVX have been a flop from what I've read and produced very little useable horsepower. Longassname is developing one the right way - by centering the AFR around 12.9 throughout the entire rev band. This should lean out the engine enough to produce a decent amount of useable horsepower and torque without damaging the engine or risking detonation. If his product is done correctly, 20 hp is not out of the question.

The '92 model year does seem quicker as I read somewhere that in later years Subaru made some changes to the tranny that limited shift points/speed when in 'power' mode. However, with a shift kit installed on any year SVX, the problem will be solved - no more weak shifts!

svxistentialist · #20 03-29-2004, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chiketkd
Previous ECU upgrades for the SVX have been a flop from what I've read and produced very little useable horsepower. Longassname is developing one the right way - by centering the AFR around 12.9 throughout the entire rev band. This should lean out the engine enough to produce a decent amount of useable horsepower and torque without damaging the engine or risking detonation. If his product is done correctly, 20 hp is not out of the question.

The '92 model year does seem quicker as I read somewhere that in later years Subaru made some changes to the tranny that limited shift points/speed when in 'power' mode. However, with a shift kit installed on any year SVX, the problem will be solved - no more weak shifts!

Wish you luck with the upgrade.

You are full of enthusiasm, so nobody would want to rain on your parade, but you will find quite a few who will be screaming out for realism, keep one foot on the ground, your head out of the sand, don't wear pink glasses, etc, etc, all those cliches.

You are looking at the tranny as something you will replace if it goes. Be prepared for this cost, if you race it, it[the tranny] will burn out. You will burn off the friction material from the drive band, which carries the drive to 2nd and 4th gear. This brake band device gave so much trouble that modern Subarus using the 4 and 5 speed autotranny no longer have it, they use a full clutch pack now in newer models.

You might want to change the stall speed of the torque convertor for drag racing, and you would gain a lot of acceleration by reducing the overall gearing. The car is very heavy for sprinting.

Joe

wynndi · #21 03-29-2004, 04:37 AM

To answer your original question, my '96's xmsn is going strong as it approaches 140K. I beleive that the 94.5+ xmsns were ported better to reduce some heating aspects.

OBD II on my '96 has saved me $$ in diagnostics alone. Sometimes a simple reset of an O2 sensor is all it takes to get the CE light to go out for months (I think that an occasional O2 sensor blip is the culprit)

Otherwise, OBD II is great for trending, monitoring performance and giving you a heads-up on "pending" CE light codes. I use the Auto XRay EZScan:

http://www.autoxray.com/products.aspx?sub=scanners&id=1

..........If only it could keep my SVX from eating rear wheel bearings like Pez.....

grnSVX96 · #22 03-29-2004, 05:22 AM

going forward with your discussions, are you saying that there are SVX with build dates into 97...what month was the last build

My 2 cars in Oz are 3/95 builds..would they have got the OBD II ?

We recently have seen advertised in Oz the last SVX sold here ..it was a 96 build but not registered/sold until 98...so it may have OBD II ? how can you tell... is there anything detectable under the bonnet etc that indicate this system is on board...what system if any was the predecessor to this system..

Thanks

dave

#23 03-29-2004, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Seraph

True for 95 models but AWD is standard for ALL Subarus imported in the US since 96.

But ABS is a part of active safety package.

I think 97 is the first model year without a 2WD option for all Subarus.

Dave

wynndi · #24 03-29-2004, 06:13 AM

You know when you have OBD II by the DIAGNOSTICS CONNECTOR in place of the coin holder (right of steering wheel, on dash <US version)> There is a plug-in connector connection behind the door.

On Board Diagnostics I (OBD I) predated OBD I and produced less data in a less user-friendly fashion.

Seraph · #25 03-29-2004, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by grnSVX96
going forward with your discussions, are you saying that there are SVX with build dates into 97...what month was the last build

My 2 cars in Oz are 3/95 builds..would they have got the OBD II ?

We recently have seen advertised in Oz the last SVX sold here ..it was a 96 build but not registered/sold until 98...so it may have OBD II ? how can you tell... is there anything detectable under the bonnet etc that indicate this system is on board...what system if any was the predecessor to this system..

Thanks

dave

As far as I know all 97s are left over 96s with different tyres and grills.

I am not sure about Oz but in the US, if you are selling cars that are sold as 96+ model cars (some are made in 95s), you have to have ODBII. You can keep a 92 and sell it in 2000 but it will be a 92 model.

#26 03-29-2004, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Seraph

As far as I know all 97s are left over 96s with different tyres and grills.

I am not sure about Oz but in the US, if you are selling cars that are sold as 96+ model cars (some are made in 95s), you have to have ODBII. You can keep a 92 and sell it in 2000 but it will be a 92 model.

The 97 SVX's have a different VIN than the 96's. They can't be leftovers...

According to my system, the last 97 model year SVX was made November of 1996.

Dave

Chiketkd · #27 03-29-2004, 09:41 AM

svxistentialist I understand what you're saying. I do have a lot of enthusiasm and it's due to the fact that I see such untapped potential in the SVX. I realize that the tranny will probably go out quickly if I race the car, but I'm fully expecting this.

I just can't wait to get started upgrading the car...

svxistentialist · #28 03-30-2004, 02:14 AM

Well, the very best of luck with it. Everyone here would love to see you succeed, so keep us posted on your progress.

Short of completely stripping out the interior, and putting on carbon fibre panels, you are never going to make the car a featherweight. In this respect, modest gains in horsepower are not going to give significant changes in elapsed times.

Adding a LOT of horsepower/torque will do it, and the large capacity engine allows for the potential. The cheapest way you can do this is adding NoS, which is not full-time power. After this, you are dealing with turbo or supercharged power.

When this car was conceived in the 1980s, 235 hp was "adequate" for the Grand Tourer role it was destined for. Nowadays, 1900cc turbodiesel saloons have the same pulling power on the motorways, and I see it as needing around 350hp with torque to match to stay ahead of the underclasses.

But that's just me!

Joe

Chiketkd · #29 03-30-2004, 10:09 AM

You're absolutely right. Either way, I'm going to apply all my knowledge in racing to hopefully get my SVX up into the 300+ hp range without NOS, S/C or turbo.

I'll definitely keep all members updated of my progress. I plan on dynoing my car every step of the way as well as doing 1/4 mile passes to see the 'real world' results.

Maybe I'll get a local muffler shop to fabricate some custom 3" headers and hook them up to a single high flow 3" exhaust sytem ending in dual tips. I'm also hoping that longassname's ECU upgrade will be compatible with the OBDII '96/'97 SVX's. It'll be great to have the AFR #'s centered around 12.9 througout the rev band. Those upgrades along with a cone filter should add 40-50hp and 40-50 ft-lbs. From there I'll need to talk to my friends to see where I could extract more power... (maybe I'll talk to my Japanese connection and see if I could order some JDM tuner camshafts and cam gears). Eitehr way, I'm going to extract as much hp outta this sucker as possible...

One thing I feel +ve about with this project I'm undertaking is (as you mentioned) I'm dealing with a 3.3L engine. That's a good size for a 6 cylinder engine, and power should definitely be plentiful with the *right* mods!

I pick my baby up tomorrow...then the work begins!

Chiketkd · #30 03-30-2004, 10:38 AM

Speak of the devil...just as I was getting done with my last post, my friend told me that he's going to get some custom stuff fabricated for his evo by the following tuner shop in VA:

Ultimate Performance

They can fabricate an entire exhaust system for me from the headers back at a reasonable cost. Also, they have dyno tuning services and I might be able to get them to custom dyno-tune my ECU if longassname can't. This is going to be awesome...I love stepping into uncharted territory! Hopefully that 300+ hp goal can be realized!

One thing I'll need to do this year will be the 5 speed swap. There is no way my auto tranny will be able to handle that much hp.