Tokyo Auto Show: Toyota-Subaru Coupe breaks cover

[BoxerFanatic]

Here's the Toyota version... Subaru version still under cover. RWD, and Subaru Boxer 4-cyl powered.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/10/06/t...k-the-hachiro/


Autoblog Gallery Toyota FT86

Certainly no SVX replacement, that is for sure.

What does this portend for the Subaru variant, do you think?

[SubaRyu]

The new concept from toyota, powered by Subaru boxer engine.
Wonder if they sell this car as Subaru too.

http://jalopnik.com/5375233/toyota-f...d-the-new-ae86

[BoxerFanatic]

D 'oh!!!!

we posted it at the same time!

[SubaRyu]

Originally Posted by BoxerFanatic

D 'oh!!!!

we posted it at the same time!

Ha!
Only if my coworker didn't distract me when I was trying to post this

[Green1995SVX]

Originally Posted by SubaRyu

Ha!
Only if my coworker didn't distract me when I was trying to post this

I hate when "work" gets in the way of the network.

[RSVX]

WTF is with the zippers?

[BoxerFanatic]

Originally Posted by SubaRyu

Ha!
Only if my coworker didn't distract me when I was trying to post this

Actually, I was delayed about 20 minutes when posting it, by someone coming in to my office... it was supposed to be my lunch time... but that never seems to matter...

So I guess it is just supposed to be posted here twice within one minute.

[BoxerFanatic]

Here is some more rumor to stoke this fire...

Rumored sketches for the Subaru version of the FT86 project....

RE-rumored sketches.

I've seen this one before, and it is one of my favorites:


Here are some others that maybe we haven't seen...






However, I think these may be old... this has a similar grille to the B9 Scrambler. I would think the grille would be 6-sided, something like Legacy or Hybrid Tourer concept, which seems to be their current family resemblance trend.

[sperry]

Well, the motor is likely in-line with or behind the front axle, so it's unlikely there will be an AWD variant. But a turbo version of the car could be likely if there's a Subaru branded version.

If Toyota leans their version to the sports-car market, and Subaru leans theirs to the GT market, I could see both cars selling. I'd prefer a grand tourer in the tradition of the SVX myself... especially if they can figure out how to cram AWD into it.

[BoxerFanatic]

Agreed with all of those points, save the possibility of the subaru version being a GT.

but I am not sure how much Grand Touring will fit into a car barely bigger than a Miata, and MUCH shorter than an impreza.

But I am wholly on board with them coming out with a new SVX successor otherwise. Maybe on a slightly widened and lengthened, and lower version of the GR Impreza chassis.

[bheinen74]

hybrid electric assist for the AWD part time...at a push of a button.

[Sean486]

I like the car. Can't wait to see the Subi version, but I wouldn't buy it unless it was AWD.

[BoxerFanatic]

Originally Posted by bheinen74

hybrid electric assist for the AWD part time...at a push of a button.

I hope not.

Batteries and electric motors for the front drive (as it will be in front of the engine... rear drive is mechanical on this car...) will bulk up the weight.

It is disappointing enough that it sounds like the horsepower target of this car has been dropped from 200-220 down to 160, to be an "eco-car" anyway.

I wish this "green" stuff would fade away already, and let producers come out with honestly good, real-world products that aren't hampered by social activism fads.

is a car with 160hp that you have to keep your foot planted to the floor to make the thing move, honestly more efficient than if the engine is capable of more than 100hp/liter, and would facilitate less aggressive use of the throttle in normal driving for this type of car?

Sometimes bigger, torquier motors produce more efficient results by not being constantly at their limits during a use cycle.

I was really psyched for this little Toyota/Subaru coupe until I heard it was going to be basically a RWD bone thrown to the economy car crowd, to try and snag a few enthusiasts with the driveline and handling promise of said RWD...

Honestly, this is what new cars are coming to... they either build "eco-cars", or retro muscle that weighs twice as much, with 3-4 times the power.

They either build things very small, like this, and the BMW 1-series, or they build things like Honda Crosstour/VDX, and BMW X6/5-series GT that are behemoths needlessly, without the practical advantages of a boxier SUV, like cargo and towing.

Yet middle of the road, modest, good looking cars like 2005-2009 Legacy and Outback get bloated, ugly, and de-contented, and look ever more like a Camry/Accord appliance-mobile, and the new Outback is as big or bigger than Tribeca, and Impreza gets uglier with each iteration.

Forester looks good, but doesn't have the drivetrains that one would want in a more modest SUV... if one wanted a modest SUV. no manual or 5-speed auto with the turbo. No H6 at all, no turbo-diesel with some torque.

And hardly anyone builds a decent Grand Touring Coupe anymore, besides the Infiniti G37, or maybe the new Genesis 3.8 V6... or you go over 40K base MSRP for Audi or BMW. G37 is nearly there also.

Ford has one non-FWD coupe... the retro-muscle Mustang. No T-bird, no Cougar, no Probe GT, no Capri, no Lincoln Mark IX, nothing but live-axle hooliganism.

GM and Chrysler have NOTHING, similarly, aside from similarly retroactive Camaro and Challenger, both at nearly or above 4000lbs of curb weight.

Honda no longer has an NSX or Prelude. Civic? please...

Nissan at least has the aforementioned Infiniti G coupe.

Toyota has nothing... and their answer is this little eco-car, which has potential, but I think will either be an economy-car or a tuner/drifter aftermarket darling, and difficult to turn into a more accommodating real-world coupe. I don't think it is going to be an acceptable successor for SVX. If it does well, it might succeed the 2.5RS.

So... for the SVX enthusiast... someone who likes performance, likes looks, but values sophistication and quality, as well... I find myself looking out at field of new cars, and finding very little appealing.

We either get little economy "greenies"...

or we get people trying to convince us that 4000+lb 5-door SUVs with a slicked back roofline should be called a "coupe"... which I find insulting to my intelligence...

and maybe one or two other options on the market.

I may not be buying today. But what will I buy in a few years? when SVXs are all the more rare to find and support... and I am looking for a late-model used car. Or if I somehow get a big promotion, and want to buy a new car directly...

Are G37 and Genesis really the only non-FWD options out there? Is this little Toyota/Subaru going to be something I will even be able to consider on it's merits?

[Green1995SVX]

I hope those wheels are 5x114.3.