New Shift Kit Developed

[oab_au]

Originally Posted by b3lha

Why the dyno plots are so different? I'm not trying to pour cold water on Harvey's invention, but this doesn't make sense.

Surely the QC only modifies the gearchange. Therefore the only substantial difference should be in the 1 second of the dyno run so that the transmission is shifting from 1st to 2nd.

Yes Phil, the change takes place in that 1/4 of a second. But the effects of the Torque Converters multiplication lasts a bit longer, to give the boost.

Harvey.

[immortal_suby]

Harvey - when I hit it just right - not at full throttle but about 7/8th throttle - I get a noticeably different gear change. Rather than the normal gear change it feels like a shift in a manual where you keep the throttle at max and only change gears with the clutch and gearbox. A slight slipping of the clutch as the gear is engaged and the car jumps forward much harder. In the auto it seems to only happen when my foot is not on the floor, but close to it. The engine revs stay higher on these lucky gear changes.

I like it. But it is extremely difficult to duplicate. Could this be the TCU not performing the torque reduction in the absence of WOT? Will this be what the QC kit will do? If it is, I am in.

[TomsSVX]

Originally Posted by immortal_suby

Harvey - when I hit it just right - not at full throttle but about 7/8th throttle - I get a noticeably different gear change. Rather than the normal gear change it feels like a shift in a manual where you keep the throttle at max and only change gears with the clutch and gearbox. A slight slipping of the clutch as the gear is engaged and the car jumps forward much harder. In the auto it seems to only happen when my foot is not on the floor, but close to it. The engine revs stay higher on these lucky gear changes.

I like it. But it is extremely difficult to duplicate. Could this be the TCU not performing the torque reduction in the absence of WOT? Will this be what the QC kit will do? If it is, I am in.

"Under heavy loads and in manual mode" is when the torque control is utilized. What the QC does is disable the torque control during shifts. As I quoted from the manuals earlier in the thread, there are reasons not to do this. A warning you may or may not, it is up to you. Call it negativity or whatever you like.

tom

[oab_au]

Originally Posted by immortal_suby

Harvey - when I hit it just right - not at full throttle but about 7/8th throttle - I get a noticeably different gear change. Rather than the normal gear change it feels like a shift in a manual where you keep the throttle at max and only change gears with the clutch and gearbox. A slight slipping of the clutch as the gear is engaged and the car jumps forward much harder. In the auto it seems to only happen when my foot is not on the floor, but close to it. The engine revs stay higher on these lucky gear changes.

I like it. But it is extremely difficult to duplicate. Could this be the TCU not performing the torque reduction in the absence of WOT? Will this be what the QC kit will do? If it is, I am in.

A bit hard to say Matt, the torque control is used on all shifts. The duration of the cut changes to suit the situation. The longest one is when you pull the lever into reverse, from a cold start, when the Idle speed is high, so it doesn't jump through the garage door.

But that is is feeling that it gives. It is very progressive in its operation. If you cruise around town, you won't notice anything different. Use a bit more throttle and the change becomes a bit faster and firmer. Stick your foot into it and the change becomes faster and harder.

I have been in Automotive for over 50 years, been on The Network since before it started, I wouldn't dud you Matt.

Harvey.

[immortal_suby]

Thanks Harvey,
I sent a note to Budfreak to order a QC.

[RSVX]

Originally Posted by immortal_suby

Thanks Harvey,
I sent a note to Budfreak to order a QC.

Care to share a test drive when it's installed?

I can swing by on the BMW. :-)

[Trevor]

Originally Posted by b3lha

I don't follow your reasoning Trev.

The torque control is a binary switch not a voltage. It is either On or Off, ie "Ground" or "Not Ground". What is the benefit of introducing a resistor into the circuit? The engine torque is not in any way proportional to the voltage on this line.

Phil, thanks for the definitive information.

You will note that I included the words, “ it would appear that”. Unfortunately I have not been in conference with you and shared your knowledge regarding the software, as has Harvey. On the basis of the information available to me it appeared that a voltage signal was involved, but I also appreciated that test and experiment would be necessary.

The manual indicates that either a short circuit, or an open circuit, will record a fault code and this tended to preclude on/off binary control to ground. Fault detection circuitry must be quite sophisticated. In point of fact what you state means that control is easier to achieve than I had anticipated.

Regards, Trevor.

[Trevor]

Here we have a product offered for sale via a non member, on a conflicting site, without any form of description or specification as to its purpose, performance or use, forthcoming from the manufacturer. This precludes any purchaser from establishing liability in respect of performance or fault.

The scant information available stems from a user apparently supplied with a complimentary sample. Here placebo and vested interest must be taken into account. At this point nothing is certain, it would appear by intent.

[lechnoid]

Removed by me until Harvey decides his product is complete and is ready to discuss it with the open market.

[b3lha]

Harvey,

I understand you have put a lot of work into the QC and I wish you every success with it. Would you mind sharing the technical details of exactly what it does and how it does it? So far we've discussed eliminating the torque control signal, but that could be done by cutting a single wire, so I'm sure the QC must do much more than that.

I honestly don't see any reason to keep the design secret because there are very few people here who could figure out how to build one themselves. We are all good mates here and nobody is going to steal the design. Even if somebody did, nobody here would buy a knocked-off copy on principle.

So, in terms of how it interacts with the TCU. Which of the TCU input/output signals does it read, which does it modify, in what way, and under what conditions.

Phil.

[lechnoid]

Removed by me until Harvey decides his product is complete and is ready to discuss it with the open market.

[SVXRide]

1st - thanks to WannaRace for providing the dyno plots of the before and after on one plot

2nd - I still don't understand why the dyno shop can't provide a HP/rpm and TQ/rpm plot. The mph on the x-axis is worthless, IMHO

3rd - Following the conversation up to this point and looking at the dyno plots, it really does just look like what is happening is a almost direct coupling (219 ~95% of 230) during shifts, with perhaps a more efficient coupling between shifts (?). The engine is definitely NOT making more power, we're just seeing a more efficient transfer to the wheels (?).

-Bill

[lechnoid]

Removed by me until Harvey decides his product is complete and is ready to discuss it with the open market.

[TomsSVX]

Originally Posted by SVXRide

1st - thanks to WannaRace for providing the dyno plots of the before and after on one plot

2nd - I still don't understand why the dyno shop can't provide a HP/rpm and TQ/rpm plot. The mph on the x-axis is worthless, IMHO

3rd - Following the conversation up to this point and looking at the dyno plots, it really does just look like what is happening is a almost direct coupling (219 ~95% of 230) during shifts, with perhaps a more efficient coupling between shifts (?). The engine is definitely NOT making more power, we're just seeing a more efficient transfer to the wheels (?).

-Bill

Also thanks to Wannarace, it is important to supply evidence other than how it feels to support a product.

As I have been thinking a lot on it, it is because the engine is still spooling power (lack of torque control) between shifts. This spooled up rotating mass is then unloaded onto the t/c when the shift completes and thus the spike...

Tom

[immortal_suby]

Originally Posted by RSVX

Care to share a test drive when it's installed?

I can swing by on the BMW. :-)

Of course!
I'm happy to be one of the guinea pigs. I'm already planning on a dyno day to test the tomyx intake, so this will be another one to throw in the mix.