HELP - Can't start engine! Code 13.
 

My engine just died some 38 miles from home. :-( And it would not do anything trivial on me.

The last time it started was in the morning - it run unevenly (with misses) for a few seconds with RPMs sitting at unusually low 1000, a few seconds later RPMs hit 2000 and then it was running smoothly. It has never done that before. It run the 38 miles without any problems.

Three hours later it refused to start (engine was still warm!).
Here are the facts:
1. Engine cranks, does not fire at all.

2. Exhaust does not smell gasoline after cranking (obviously ECU keeps injectors shut)

3. Fuel is there, fuel pump does pumping and produces the necessary pressure.

4. ECU produces code 13 - camshaft position sensor after ~3 seconds of cranking. This is the only code I get.

5. Camshaft sensor itself checks out OK - not shorted, not open, 2.5k ohm,
produces voltage if I move metal around it. It is the same part number as crankshaft sensor 2, so I swapped them around, but the ECU code stayed the same, it did not move with the sensor.

6. Timing belt is in place, camshaft sprocket looks OK, does not wobble.
Camshaft does turn when engine is cranked. Crank pulley is in place and the bolt is tight.

7. Wiring from the camshaft sensor to ECU seems to be OK - no shorts to the ground, some high resistance (80 k ohms), seem to be reaching the ECU.

8. Last couple of months it's been having a quite loud noise first couple of seconds/minutes after a cold start that I dismissed as lifter noise - it temporarily went away for 500 miles after oil change & flush and always goes away during warmup. But when it's there it was quite discomforting loud banging... There are no unusual noises during cranking...


It looks like I'm running out of options of what could be wrong. So far my theories are:

1. Both my cam and crank sensors are too weak for camshaft position, but OK for crank pickup.

2. ECU is bad .

3. Camshaft has developed too much endplay and shifted too far from the sensor (there is about 1/10 of an inch clearance between the sensor and the sprocket).

4. crankshaft sprocket is spinning on the crankshaft due to a sheared pin - unlikely, as I saw timing belt moving


Any suggestions - should I do a leap of faith and spend $$$ for a new cam sensor? Or shoot for a replacement ECU first (this is a cheaper option)?

Just don't undersand how the sensors could gradually go bad - do magnets gradually losing their magnetism when warm or what???

Did you check the price of the Cam Position Sensor?
I just replaced the Crank Position Sensor(basically the same part) on the wife's Outback Sport, and it was only about $20.00 through Liberty Subaru, I believe it was just a bad conection, as sometimes when We'd go to start it, it would crank, but not fire......then I'd get out and wiggle the connector for it and it would start right up.
I eventually replaced it (once I found out it was only $20:D ) and have had no trouble since.

I mean when you switched them, if it was bad woundn't it still keep the car from starting even if it were in the crankshaft position ?

Not many fixes on the SVX that are only $20.00:rolleyes:

If that doesn't fix it, it sounds electrical, and I have no ideal when it comes to electrical:confused:

Doubt I helped much, but my best wishes go out to you,

You said that the timing belt was in place, but did you check to make sure that all the alignment marks correspond with the marks on the crankshaft and cam pulleys? Just last weekend we had this exact same problem, crank no start code 13, and it turned out that we did not put the belt back on with everything aligned correctly. Perhaps your belt has slipped a tooth?

KuoH

The sensor is $158.69 plus shipping from subaruparts.com (part number 22056aa030).

What is/where is Liberty Subaru?

When I swapped sensors around, I still got the code 13. Then I disconnected the wire from the supposedly bad sensor in crankshaft position and then I got an additional code 29 - so I assume both sensors work in the crankshaft position.

I did not check the alignment marks (yet) - requires more disassembly.

Liberty Subaru is a dealer in NJ, their web site is :

http://www.libertysubaru.com/en_US/L....subarusdc.com

They don't have a web order system, but you can call them and tell them you're an inter-net customer and they give you a better rate. Thier number is 201-261-0900

First rate service, and promt delivery, hard to come by now-a-days
:D

Wow :eek: I just looked it up on 1st Subaru's web site(they have an on-line parts list), http://www.1stsubaruparts.com/
And the Cam sensor for our 96 Outback Sport is $17.24, but the SVX's is $149.94 :eek: I would have thought they'd be the same thing, as they do the same job.....you know what they say about ASSUMEing huh.

Maybe try one for an Outback Sport
:confused:

Oh well, hope you get it figured out,

An easy question for a change: is a TDC mark on the pulley aligned with the alignment mark on the timing belt sprocket?
I can't see the sprocket without removing the pulley and plastic covers...
They are either 90 degrees off by design or....

Re price of the sensors, SVX uses slightly different sensors from Impreza or Legacy (they are different too) - you can check the pictures on www.kragen.com.

Here's a cam belt allignment pic. B.

http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/files/Boone/2080.jpg

I think you can see the bottom of the sprocket just by removing the crank pulley. So if you rotate TDC to the bottom, you should be able to see if the mark on the pulley matches with the mark on the sprocket. What makes you think they might be 90 degrees off if you can't see the mark on the sprocket now?

Since the pulley and sprocket are both held in place by the same key, they only way they could be in a position other than designed is if the key has sheared, like it did on my friend's SVX.

KuoH

I aligned camshaft sprocket with the alignment mark and I saw the TDC mark on the pulley roughly 1/4 turn clockwise from the 0 degrees mark on the cover.

One of the pictures in the service manual shows the pulley, and it is clearly shown that the key in the pulley is ~90 degrees from the mark. I've just checked your picture and the key in the sprocket is also 90 degrees from the mark. Sounds like I will be unbolting the pulley tomorrow :( first and calling a tow truck next.

Anyway, the new sensor is ordered, it should be in my hands tomorrow. I estimate my chances at 20-30%, then the pulley, then ECU is my next bet.

I think the timing belt marks are NOT TDC, this, I believe, is due to the fact that the cams are hard to hold in position at TDC, as they are riding on some of the cam lobes when on TDC, the timing belt marks are aligned so that the cams are in a "rest" position to make belt changes easier.

Or, No, the pulley alignment marks DON'T line up with the belt alignment marks.

Hope this helps,

Taking the accessory belts off and unbolting the pulley is fairly easy, but get a strap wrench and a helper as the pulley bolt can be on fairly tight and the same goes for retightening. I wish I could remember where the timing mark on the pulley is in relation to the alignment mark on the sprocket right now.

From your description, it really sounds like the timing is off to me. We had the same code 13 and even swapped both sensors from my car to his and still got the same code. At that point, we knew the sensors were good and were directed to check the timing belt alignment again and finally found where we went wrong.

KuoH

OK, the covers are out and the belt did jump quite a few teeth. About 30 degrees on camshafts (both).
Crankshaft Sprocket key seem to be OK, belt is clean and dry (45k on it), the tensioner was in place and is not obviously broken.

I wish I knew what caused it to jump and how it did it. Anything to look at in particular? When I get back to the car, I will check the belt for bad/missing teeth, but other than that I have no idea what to suspect...

When you take the belt off, check all the pulleys, idlers, anything that the belt turns, I've seen the oil pump seize up and strip a belt on a Subaru 1.8 before, everything shold spin fairly easy (besides the crank and camshafts), the oil pump and water pump won't spin like an idler, but shouldn't take much effort to turn them.
If one of the front seals are leaking it could have contaminated the timing belt making it more prone to striping, so replace them while you're in there if they're leaking.

Kuoh, Huck,

Thanks for your help - your remote diagnostic was perfect, it was the timing belt jumping teeth. I've got the engine started and drove around the garage for a while.

I'm planning to drive it home with a minimum assembly (no covers, no a/c) etc and have a thorough look then.
Never thought I'd be doing timing belt in a multil-level parking garage late at night :rolleyes: with a torch in my hand as the main source of light.

There are no obvious reasons for the failure - the belt is clean, dry, no teeths cracked or anything, pulleys rotate easily and silently. Water pump rotates like a new one (35k on it).

The belt does feel longer than when it was new - goes on much easier, but the tensioner eventually settles in a middle position, not fully extended.

I don't think I can test the oil pump - it is sitting on crankshaft directly.
There is still a couple of extra noises (one is lifter, the other don't know - maybe a piston slap, but I've never heard a definite piston slap before) that go away during warmup....

Sounds like my SVX have changed the status from the commuter car to don't know what yet.