ECUTune Stage III twin screw supercharger sign up
 

The Stage III twin screw supercharger system prototype has been fabricated and is now operational. We are now looking to manufacture the first production run with a batch size of 4 systems. Details of the system development can be found in a thread in these forums at http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/showthread.php?t=21344 Orders can be placed on the ECUtune website at http://www.ecutune.com/svx-stage3.htm

From the feedback we've recieved our current mindset is that the system should be released with a 3 inch pulley generating 6 to 7 lbs of boost. This seems to be the natural ballance where the engine with it's current compression ratio will generate the most power with the most efficiency. The 1600ax supercharger used in the system features only a 1 hp parasitic loss at cruise which means that highway fuel consumption will remain for the most part unchanged despite the ability to generate %40-%50 more power whenever the accelerator is pushed. Since it is a positive displacement system the power is there whenever the pedal is pushed so that true on the street performance and drivability gains are there not just peak hp dyno #'s.

The engine management included with the system has room to grow with the expectation that in the future race minded people will build engines with closed deck blocks and lower compression ratios. We can help anyone interested in doing this. The supercharger is also capable of producing lots of "boost" on an engine which is built for it. The svx engine is for the most part rock solid and can easily built for specificalliy for more boost although the parts to do so are all custom orders.

This thread is for those actually interested in ordering. If you are interested in a system please post your desires and questions here so that we can develop and produce exactly what you want. If you do not genuinely expect to be ordering one of the first 4 systems please utilize a seperate thread and refrain from participating in this one.

Those with obdII SVXii who are interested please join in. You will need to contact me directly before ordering but we will handle your orders as well.

I'm interested, but I need to know much more. I don't want to buy the system, install it, and then find that the car rocks the world at WOT but runs poorly at part-throttle everyday driving. I would also like to know exactly what parts (where applicable, including brand) will be included in the kit. If you could start with the parts list that would be great. As you work on optimizing the system, any info you can post about driveability would be appreciated. Warranty info (manufacturing, driveability) is also important for me. Thanks.

I'm working on getting the info up on the website today....might as well put it here too :)

Major components of kit:

1) ECUtune memory adaptor and SVX Stage III software
2) ECUtune manifold
3) ECUtune throttle body adaptor
4) ECUtune hard fuel lines
5) ECUtune alternator brackets
6) ECUtune tensioner
7) ECUtune power steering / idler bracket
8) ECUtune AC idler pulley
9) ECUtune throttle body/bypass valve plate
10) Dayco power steering idler pulley
11) Dayco tensioner pulley
12) Whipple 1600AX supercharger
13) Whipple drive snout
14) Whipple bypass valve
15) NISMO SR20 740cc fuel injectors
16) Tomei fuel injector clips
17) Nissan maf meter (used)
18) Tomei Nissan maf meter plug
19) Walboro 255lph fuel pump
20) Outlaw engeneering phenolic spacers
21) Supercharger / power steering belt (Gates or Dayco)
22) AC / alternator belt (Gates or Dayco)
23) Bypass valve hose (Gates or Dayco)

Every day driving is exactly what the positive displacement supercharger excels at. The power is there whenever you press the pedal. How much power? However far you press the pedal.

Smooth idle? No off-idle hesitation? No flat spots/hesitation/surging in the powerband during part throttle acceleration?

I don't have the 3" pulley I'm going to release the system with yet so I'm not ready to answer those questions definitively. I don't expect any problems but I'm not one to make unbased claims.

At a local subaru meeting here, it was said that this kit would be one hell'ova deal. The kit costs less than the down payment on a wrx :) So for that, get twice the car than the wrx would ever be!

I'm taking out a loan to finish my current truck project. I really thinking about upping that loan by 4kl to make my car kick some butt.

Are there any expected problems with the install? Things that would make your average wrench, scratch his head for an hour wondering where this extra bolt went, sorta thing.

I am VERY interested in this system.
I would like to get some solid numbers when you put that 3" pulley on.

Is there any chance of blowing out a cylinder wall with 7lbs of forced induction?
Will this shorten the life of my engine? *never mind the fact that my foot will be to the floor all the time. Its like that currently*

Lastly, does this system come with any sort of warranty?

Hmmm, no can't offer any warranties or guarantees on performance equipment; you'll get the standard no liablity disclaimer. You just have to look at the quality of our past products and the work displayed in the development thread and decide for yourself your level of comfort and confidence you'll get a quality product.

I don't think the install should be too bad. You'll get the benefits of my having done it and being able to make up directions saying what order to do things in. Personally I would split it up into a couple seperate weekend projects. I would take one weekend to do the engine management. Install the fuel pump one day and make sure that works. Then install the fuel injectors, maf meter, and software the next day and make sure that works. It's good to split things up like that so if you make a mistake and botch something you know where to look for it and can quickly fix it. Knowing you have the engine management working correctly then you can take a day the next weekend to install the supercharger system.

Do I really need to sign up of one?? Shame I cant afford a second one, I'd put it on the 92 5-speed when I finish the tranny. :D

lol

and other stuff to make 10+ characters

HUH????????????

I got it in me to do a little tinkering tonight. I've got it running awfully nicely with 9 lbs of boost now. It'll spin the front tires as it starts out at the 90/10 split with anything more than 3/4 throttle. For those of you that don't know I'm running 8 inch wide wheels with 255 series tires so we're doing pretty well to be able to spin them. I also have the idle cleaned up so that it is now idling strictly off the idle air bypass valves without the throttle cables holding the butterflies open at all. There is no shuffling or surging or anything like that. There is however a good amount of blower rattle. From what I've heard from people I know that have upgraded to twin screw blowers on their lightnings this may just be the nature of the beast. If you run high boost the blower rattles at idle. I guess there just isn't enough air to keep the blower full. I'll check with whipple though and see if maybe improving the bypass valve set up can quiet things down.

Since there's no way to add any sort of intercooler with your SC setup, have you thought about add a water injection system? There would probably be no need to pull back any timing, and you could move the a/f ratio closer to the maximum power afr. The simplest systems will trigger at a user-settable boost level and inject a constant amount of water. Even with a simple system like that, I'd bet that you could get another 30-40 HP at 9 psi.

I'd guess that you don't want to add any more cost to the system, but since your system doesn't have any user-accessible knobs on the ECU for tweaking timing and afr, it would be nice to see your system ship with something that addresses heat and is tuned to take advantage of the reduced intake charge temperatures and better burn control.

Here's a place that has very reasonably priced systems:

http://www.coolingmist.com/

I haven't pulled out a huge amount of timing or greatly richened the afr. Thanks to the high efficiency of the twin screw charger the intake charge isn't all that hot. Cooler is better but I don't want to tune anything so that if a water bottle goes empty you get detonation. The car still has timing advance routines and if you were to install a water injection system of your own and it was much benefit the software would be able to take advantage of it.

I can't say for sure yet if I'd recomend 9 lbs or 6-7 on the stock engine. I think at this point though that the decision is likely to be based on if you want a quiet idle or blower rattle at idle. I think the tuning of 9 lbs on the stock motor will likely work out.

I'm not a big fan of the vacuum solenoids being under the manifold. The only reason i kept them there is so that the plugs on the engine harness would reach them. I've got to tell you after 10 years of age these engine harnesses aren't anything precious to be afraid of cutting. What do you guys think of making a mounting bracket to put the solenoids somewhere more accessible and extending the wires. It'll make installation a lot easier and stop you from scratching up your hands putting them where they don't really fit.

I'd go for it if I were you. The harnesses I've seen are on their last brittle legs anyway. To tell you the truth, I think there's going to be a market for new engine/transmission harnesses in the next few years.

I aggree. I don't plan on using the old harness when I build the new engine. I don't think the harnesses will just stop working on their own but I think people will bust them into pieces as they start having to pull their manifolds off to replace solenoids and bypass valves (assuming they ever come to accept there is a second bypass valve down there responsible for most of their stalling problems).

Relocating the vacuum solenoids won't just make the installation of the new manifold easier it will make the removal of the old manifold easier too. It'll be easier to get a pair of dikes under there and cut the wires than get your hand around the connectors to unplug them. Might as well cut the vaccum lines too. None of them are any good anymore and the solenoid for the evaporative system is brittle and usually breaks before the hose does.

There is a 10 character min for any post so I couldn't just say LOL

I can tell you right now where the extra bolt goes :D The front drivers side of the manifold. I wasn't willing to disonnect my ac hose and have to vacuum and recharge the system. I think i might have read something about getting it in with some prying in the phenolic spacer thread but I haven't looked into it. It doesn't leak without it so I'm not worried about it. When i change engines I'll have to disconnect my ac. I'll put the bolt in then.

We can't make any guarantees but it sure doesn't seem like there is any danger. As I'm sure some of the people who have actually torn down an svx engine will jump in here and attest, the engine is massively built to begin with. The crank is ultra supported on lots of bearings. The crank is sturdy and has all the things done to it already that performance shops recomend, knife edged and smooth and all that stuff. The rods are massive and pins are offset so everything rotates nicely. The cyllinder wall would be the weak point if there is one and it doesn't seem like much of a weak point. While the block is about as open as open can get we're using a blower not a turbo so there's no reason the temps should ever get to anything anywhere near threatening warpage. As far as actually breaking. I wouldn't expect that in a million years unless there was massive detonation and this engine just doesn't do that. The compression is high and all that but the knock sensors and ignition retard system are simply awesome. You can loose power easily but you really have to work at it to get pinging, knocking, and detonation.

This is all good info to have. Im sold!
Ill be puttering over to the bank this week, get some more cash on that loan im about to take out. Expect my order soon. :)

Im interested
 

Still interested, no real questions other then do you have
to use the phenolic spacers ? Not sure I want to put them
on, and Id consider adding a water injection kit to make up for not having the best gas available and no intercooler option. Works for me....
No hood mods right ? Once I take a look at the pics, it will answer alot of my other questions
thanks Mike

Ya, the phenolic spacers give us another 1/4 inch of clearance. You need them. No, no messing with the hood.

Mike,

I'm interested, but short of funds at the moment. Would likely go with the 6-7 lbs boost. Not racing, but would like the power available.

Jonathan

same with me I'm very interested but just short on funds I need about 2 or 3 months at the most... BUt my issue is the 5 speed... plus i want to make rear wheel drive. with a different trany but i need to find out what will fit...

I understand a Supar TT tranny is a good match (Good luck finding one) and a 300zx tranny with some minor modds. I dont know first had, but it's what I picked up somewhere. I'd check into before you buy any parts.

I smell a hijacking, not the thread you wanna do that in. Mike, I would love to purchase this blower system but it wouldn't be for at least another year, Do you see yourself still having them available then?

Tom

I think with 7 lbs you'll be fine with 91 octane. Do you have any interest in building an engine? With roundish #'s it looks like $2,500 to $3,000 in parts to build a like new condition long block with the right pistons. I still need to look into the valve train and see what we can do there; with 24 of them the factory parts prices really add up and the factory valve tension seems a little soft to me for higher boost levels.

$900 je forged pistons with offset pins, lightened pins, pin fitting, double pin oilers, contact reduction, and ring sets (repositioned)
$250 gasket set
$250 main bearing set
$250 rod bearing set ($150 for cobb bearings)
$150 oil pump
$100 water pump
? valve springs, seals, lash adjusters, etc

All i can suggest is rearranging your svx mod priorities. If we don't get the orders for the first batch you won't have the opportunity to purchase the supercharger later. I hope that is clear to everyone that's looking and dreaming of having stage III in the future. If everyone counts on others being the first you just may never get one. We will not produce a batch without orders. We will give mikecg the prototype and that will be that.

So none has contacted you for orders yet?

whe will be your final date to order it. I KNOW THAT THERE IS SEVERAL PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BUY THEM. JUST LIKE I DO. BUT I NEED SOME TIME. THE TRANY AND WHAT EVER ELSE I NEED TO BUY ARE THERE. BUT THE SUPERCHAGE WON'T. SO WHAT IS THE ANSWER BUY IT KNOW!!!! OR LIVE WITH OUT IT THE REST OF MY LIFE. I'M DOING EVEREYTHING IN MY CONTROL TO GET THE MONEY BUT JUST NEED SOME TIME. SO PLEASE LET US KNOW YOUR DEADLINE....

What is the problem with waiting? I mean, I understand why you would want to get this off the ground asap but there should not be too much of a hurry on things. I mean cap, if I make enough money this summer, I may be able to buy it by the beginning of August but right now I cannot afford to. I have been following the progress of this project with great interest but if you are gonna leave us high and dry because there are not enough orders in 2 months that would seriously suck for us and for you. Well gotta run i hope to see that you get the orders soon. Hey EARL why don't you pick up 6 or 7 of these kits? that would make Mike all tingly inside? :D

Tom

I'm sure Mikecg would be happy to answer that one. We need the system we have now on hand during the fabrication of the production batch. Mikecg is waiting to get his system. Would you like to ask him to wait till the end of summer? ;)

There is no set deadline. I think we'll get the orders but if we don't you will likely hear about it after the fact just because we'll either be fabricating the parts or giving what we have to Mikecg. It's not like we just sprung a rush deadline on people. I made the announcement that we wanted some orders to justify making a batch of manifolds before we even finished the prototype fabrication.

I don't want to rush anyone or spur anyone who can't afford it into purchasing a system. We're just letting those who can afford it and want it to know that now is the time to buy it. We are a small business and have to propperly apply our capital to a limited number of projects not sink all of it into one which will never show an economic profit and only very limited accounting profit.

thnx for a complete layout of your plans. it is very helpful. Like I said, I hope to be able to buy one of these by then end of summer but I cannot promise anything. I am moving to Philadelphia in august so I will see how things go.

As for the rest of you. If you want this system he is right, don't wait for feedback from others as Mike has proved himself twice with making excellent modifications for our cars so why would this be different. Doing his homework and thinking his projects through he has been able to make us a kit that will be incredible. So please, help him, and many others, by purchasing some of the first kits so they will be available for others later on.

Tom

Philadelphia? With the taxes you'll be lucky to afford food. ;)

2 Months!! This thing has been in the planning stages for a year. 7 Months of development. I paid for mine at the end of August last year. I have been exstremly patient. I agreed to give ECUTune a little long even though the proto-type is done, because I know they will be losing money if they cant sell more. It's hard to give up $5000 for something and waiting this long for it. Everyone know it was coming and if you were serious about it you could have started saving up. I've managed to put away enough to pick up another SVX and do a manual conversion on it plus an extra $2000 saved up for some boby parts and eventually a paint job. I know some of you are in school and make less then me, but you could have put a little away each month.

I Guess We All Have Different Situation. People I'm Sure Have Save Up The Money. And Emergencys Happend. But I Don't Care About Numbers I Care About Getting It. When In The Las 4 Months You Buy A New Tranny,clutch, Motor Mounts. Radiator Just Broke, Just Bought A House, Girl Got Sick, Mother Getting Married. Need To Buy Another Car Because Svx Is Not Running Because Of Radiator... And I Can Go On... But I Need To Make The Money To Buy The Supercharge!!!!!!!!

This is a sign up thread, we really shouldn't be talking about this here. sorry for getting off topic.

Tom

I was just explaining one of the reasons the twin screw blower far outperforms a turbo system for street use on the svx and thought I'd share it here--particularly since Mychailo had asked about every day driving performance. The #'s I used in the example i was making are rough estimates for 5 or 6 lbs instead of 6 or 7 just because we were discussing what if's with 91 octane and 100+ temps.

I don't think you'd have any problems running 7 lbs on our kit there. If you did you'd just have to go down to 6 lbs or 5 lbs which you could do in 10 minutes with a $40 pulley. Remember with the positive displacement blower even if you went down to 5 or 6 lbs you wouldn't just be getting a 40% increase in peak power. Right at throttle you'd be getting a 40% of 100% ve increase plus the difference between the factory volumetric efficiency which is pretty low at low rpms and 100% volumetric efficiency. I don't have the ve curve in front of me right now but let's just pick a # and say it's 80%. The increase from 80% ve to 100% ve is a 25% increase. The 40% of 100% ve is a %50 increase. That's a 75% increase in the most important part of the power band where a turbo will give you little or nothing.

We haven't received the check yet so nothing is guaranteed but we have recieved the first promise that a check is on the way. That's one of two. Mychailo, where are your thoughts now?