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-   -   Right bank won't fire (https://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/showthread.php?t=48632)

TomsSVX 02-07-2009 05:09 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
do you, or do you not have power to the coils on that side of the engine?

Tom

SVXDan 02-17-2009 08:53 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
I got the manufacturer maint manual and see there are two crank angle sensors. This seems like an obvious place for me to start, any one know where the one on the passenger side of the car is?

TomsSVX 02-17-2009 08:56 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
There are three to be technical. Two on the crank one on the driver's cam.

Tom

SVXDan 02-22-2009 11:44 AM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Ok, I pulled all 3, cleaned them and tested voltage, they came back correctly. I put the whole thing back together and now I get spark down to the plugs. I also have voltage going to the injectors.
The car still isn't running correctly, I fixed one problem but it appeared to have no actual effect. Now I'm suspecting fuel or air mixture. Any thoughts on how I'd test either?

svxfiles 02-22-2009 12:18 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SVXDan (Post 588531)
Ok, I pulled all 3, cleaned them and tested voltage, they came back correctly. I put the whole thing back together and now I get spark down to the plugs. I also have voltage going to the injectors.
The car still isn't running correctly, I fixed one problem but it appeared to have no actual effect. Now I'm suspecting fuel or air mixture. Any thoughts on how I'd test either?
Now that you know that you are getting spark, I really think the issue here is the passenger side camshaft timing.
If you pull the passenger side cam sprocket off of the camshaft I believe you will find that the groove is very worn.
Both YT and I have seen this before.

SVXDan 02-22-2009 02:03 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by svxfiles (Post 588537)
Now that you know that you are getting spark, I really think the issue here is the passenger side camshaft timing.
If you pull the passenger side cam sprocket off of the camshaft I believe you will find that the groove is very worn.
Both YT and I have seen this before.
You're right, the timing seems to be off about 30 degrees. I'm pretty new to timing so I'm reading up on how to adjust. One thing I see right off the bat is how do I get the cover off the center section? Seems like i"ll have to remove all accessory pullies then pull off the plastic.

SVXDan 02-22-2009 02:13 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Looks like the passenger cam jumped one tooth. Two questions now, is that enough to cause the issues I'm seeing, and second is there any way to slacken up the belt enough to move it back into place without pulling the whole front half of the engine apart?

kwren 02-22-2009 02:14 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwren (Post 582336)
sounds like the right bank is out of time.
takes a little driving for the puter to let you know there is a problem. Any code??
Jan 14 2009

svxfiles 02-22-2009 03:02 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SVXDan (Post 588558)
Looks like the passenger cam jumped one tooth. Two questions now, is that enough to cause the issues I'm seeing, and second is there any way to slacken up the belt enough to move it back into place without pulling the whole front half of the engine apart?
The timing that I am referring to is that of the cam sprocket to the camshaft.
The only way to check it is to remove the cam sprocket and look at the machined groove in the camshaft.
The cam sprocket has 48 teeth.
That gives 7.5° per tooth at the camshaft.
Being one tooth off at the cam sprocket is not enough to cause what you are seeing.
However if there is 1/8" of play at the camshaft, that allows about 20° of retard, and THAT you would feel!

These numbers are approximations, but fairly close.:o

svxfiles 02-22-2009 03:11 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SVXDan (Post 588556)
You're right, the timing seems to be off about 30 degrees. I'm pretty new to timing so I'm reading up on how to adjust. One thing I see right off the bat is how do I get the cover off the center section? Seems like i"ll have to remove all accessory pullies then pull off the plastic.
Three bolts and two hoses to the power steering pump, disconnect the battery ground and remove the alternator.
I always remove the radiator and fans as a unit for more room.

kwren 02-22-2009 06:32 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwren (Post 585397)
Mine did the exact same thing. Start great and run great a little ways and then disaster! The Subaru dealer had it and checked it out and worked on it continually for 6 weeks + a day.

They never worked it out. They never even got close. I brought it back home and worked it out myself... (I pray a lot)

When I got it home I found the cam shaft and sprocket had rusted out where it bolted on to the shaft and even though the timing belt marks were fine, the right bank was out of time because the sprocket slipped on the cam shaft.

For some reason, unknown to me, the car started and ran great for a little ways and then the right bank died. That is what was so confusing. Logic, which obviously doesn't apply, said that it couldn't be out of time and start great and run great... but it did... every time.

I think I asked you before, "Will your car still start"? Will it run a bit before the disaster hits like it did the two times you told us all about?

I don't know where you, or they, think the power loss to the right side is, but any connection that is open is a piece of cake to test and find.

There is little chance your shop will work this out. Like my old pappy used to say, "A word to the wise is sufficient."

Keith:)
Feb 1, 2009

kwren 02-22-2009 06:35 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwren (Post 585429)
I would ask them to take the sprocket off and make sure of that:cool:

Hope the thing gets worked out soon for you!!!

Keith:)
feb 1 2009

Wikedjuggalo 02-22-2009 06:40 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwren (Post 588610)
feb 1 2009
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
:) I'm sure you understand that kwren.

SoCal LS-L 02-22-2009 07:03 PM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
Mr Dan you need to remove the radiator and fan assy, crankshaft pulley, etc. to access your entire timing belt. For the power steering pump, I just removed the bolts and you can use the alternator to rest the right side of the pump high enough to access the center timing cover bolts. Its easy to do, you just remove whatevers in the way to access the cover bolts, such as the tensioner assy. You do NOT have to remove any accessory pulleys to access those bolts, thats doing it the hard way. I also removed my EVAP canister on the pass side to make it easier to get that side cover off, and turn the cam. Once you do it once, the next time is quick and easy, like 45 minutes or so to do the timing belt. You need a shop press, or a floor jack and something sturdy to re-compress your timing belt tensioner. There is no conceiveable way to adjust the timing on the cam gear with a tensioned belt still installed, and you need to also remove and check your cam gear as mentioned by Keith.

kwren 02-23-2009 02:27 AM
Re: Right bank won't fire
 
if there is a problem with the sprocket that bolts onto the cam shaft, the cam shaft is more likely than not itself damaged, the cam shaft has to be replaced.

A Serious project. You can do it with the help of the folks on this site, but you would have to be walked through every phase of the project. I would probably say, with your experience, or lack of experience so far... Maybe not try it by yourself.

I don't think there is even a possibility that the gears in the cam shafts, not the sprocket, but the gears themselves could jump out of time... It just isn't made that way.

Hope we all wake up and find out that this is just a bad dream:(

Take care,
Keith


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