Summit Point Raceway, 8/9 March 03

[newsvx]

All SVX'ers interested in running a road course with your SVX,

A number of folks late last year at BRAKESHOE I expressed an interest in joining the local Mercedes Benz Club here in the Washington area when they (we) have this year's "driving ed event" at the Summit Point Raceway in Eastern West Virginia. The dates are now firm, and they are 8 and 9 March - yes, it will still be a bit cold at that time of the year. Summit is a very active track, and the time for clubs to schedule a weekend is limited. We take what we can get. I am on the Board of Directors, so that is our (SVX's) in to participate.

So what is Summit Point? There are two courses there, but we will be using only one - the two (2) mile, 10 turn course. It has a 1/2 mile straight (the SVX should reach about 115 MPH at the end of the straight), just before a hairpin turn (taken best at about 50 MPH! - that assumes one wants to remain on the track!). Then the fun begins with right turns, left turns and more right turns - ten in all. This is great fun, where one learns his ability to control his car and learns the car's overall capability and where the limits of each are. If one has not run Summit before, he (or she) will have a licensed instructor from Bill Scott Racing that will instruct you on how to drive the course. Great bunch of guys and gals, and very good at their job too. Go to the following web site for more detail on the track: >www.summitpoint-raceway.com<.

My next posting will provide the details - how to join the Mercedes club (required), how much the weekend (can run only one day, if you like) will cost, etc.

I hope to see a bunch of SVX's there to watch and / or run.
Harry

[newsvx]

Allow me to take a few liberties (paraphasing, etc) and quote from the Mercedes Club Newsletter.

This is a 2-day Performance Driving School at Summit Point Raceway on March 8 and 9. If you can't make both days, then join us for one. The POINT is a two mile long track with a half mile straight and ten turns. It's a safe and fun track to drive with lots of runoff room (for those "off road" excursions that we hope will not occur!). One can get a good look at what it's like doing a hot lab at the Summit Point web page mentioned in the previous page.

Are you a novice with no previous track experience? No problem! Instructors from Bill Scott Racing will be on hand both days to teach you performance driving - this is classromm and on-the-track instruction. You'll like the instructors and the track. No one will force you to drive any faster than you comfortably want to drive. We want you to progress at your own pace.

You don't have to have a Mercedes to participate. You can drive any car you wish, AS LONG AS IT HAS $100,000 LIBILITY INSURANCE COVERAGE AND WILL PASS A MANDATORY TECH INSPECTION. Rag tops require a roll bar or a hardtop. The Pre-event car safety inspection sheet can be downloaded on the club's web site, as can be the registration form. The web site is: >www.gws-mbca.org<.

Rates for the event are only $295 for both days or $165 for one day and include a HOT LUNCH catered in (remember this is a Mercedes event!). Additional lunches for your guests are $12 each. Rates increase after 16 Feb, so act now and get your registration form in soon.

Listen! This is good for your soul and will help eliminate stress in your life! If you have any questions, please let me know - send an e-mail or post the questions. A reminder: Be sure to join the Mercedes club in order to be able to participate.
See you there (with a heavy coat!
Harry

[newsvx]

8/9 March is very close. The price per day has already gone up because you missed the deadline. Only two of us Subaru have signed up at this point.
If you don't come to run the track, come to enjoy the machinery.
Harry

[Ron Mummert]

Gawd, where did February go? Hey, old man, I'll try to drop in & watch the goings-on one of the two days. Which day do you recommend?

Ron.

[newsvx]

Hey, Ron.
I would thin Sat would be the best day - probably more folks running. And are you putting yours out there? You ought to try it! Once you do, you won't go back.

Harry

[Ron Mummert]

Originally posted by newsvx
Hey, Ron.
I would thin Sat would be the best day - probably more folks running. And are you putting yours out there? You ought to try it! Once you do, you won't go back.

Harry


Hahahahahaha! Moi? ...of the warped rotors & daily driver routine?
(Well, maybe in a borrowed Civic!)
If we actually have a weekend without snow, I'll try to drag my lazy butt up there on Saturday.

Ron.

[newsvx]

Hey, Ron.
Looks like the two of us will be the only SVX's to show. Bring your camera. We'll show everybody what they missed.

But like you, I hope the snow goes away. But come to think of it, your car (being black) will be easy to spot in the snow bank :D .
Later,
Harry

[Green1995SVX]

I might try to be there. I'll check into my schedule and let ya know. :)

Mike

[newsvx]

Originally posted by Green1995SVX
I might try to be there. I'll check into my schedule and let ya know. :)

Mike

Great, Mike. Do come, you'll enjoy it. You will be amazed at the Mercedes and how well they run. AND there will be a "warmed-over" WRX there to run too - upgraded brakes and suspension to match the 300 HP at the wheels! This thing should fly. He's been "working on it over the winter" :D . There will also be a 2003 Mustang Cobra - God that thing is fast! and there are a number of slots still open that we have opened up to some of the other car clubs in the area, like Porsche and BMW. Should be some very interesting cars running.

Cars in the first run will be on the track at 9:00 AM - there are 20 minute runs at a time, and the groups are broken down from beginners to advanced (done it a few times).

Be sure to bring warm clothes. It will only be in the mid-40 degree range, but NO SNOW! Wear some good boots too, since the melting snow will make for a mess in some areas. And bring your camera too. some great areas for pics.

Looking forward to seeing you!
Harry

[newsvx]

A shot of a '94 SVX going into Turn 10 and braking hard at about 85-90 MPH.

[SVXphile]

Whose beautiful blue SVX is that, Harry? Don

[newsvx]

Don,
That was my first SVX - the '94 L Model that Kyle (my youngest son) had that was totaled - I still have parts to sell off of it. It was also FWD. Running little car and faster than the AWD models, probably because of less weight. Just felt quicker and more nibble too.
Harry

[GreenMarine]

You guys go ahead and go for it... I would be there to run my Jeep around the track a few times:D :D , but I'm gonna be in Greensboro, NC this comming weekend putting on my Stebro System!!!! Be sure to get lots of great pictures of SVX's against other awesome cars...

[SVXphile]

I'm WAITING Ron....for all the details and pictures that are going to make me green with envy.....

Don :(

[Ron Mummert]

Listen! This is good for your soul and will help eliminate stress in your life! If you have any questions, please let me know - send an e-mail or post the questions. A reminder: Be sure to join the Mercedes club in order to be able to participate.
See you there (with a heavy coat!
Harry [/B][/QUOTE]


Well, I'm back from a beautiful, sunny, fifty degree day at Summit Point. Thanks once again to the generosity of Harry & Tom, Harry's son, we (Rufus & I) were treated to many miles of flat out racing. Harry's right about eliminating stress. In fact I personally just about eliminated my 7/11 hotdog right though Tom's Focus SVT's windshield. Lucky for me Tom was "taking it easy" in breaking in the new 6 speed gearbox. I almost repeated the performance in Harry's SVX, but bailed out & let Rufus finish the heat for me. Remember your first ride in a Tilt-a-Whirl, right after you ate a slice 'o pizza, a box 'o popcorn & a big cotton candy? That's enough description.

Despite my uh...touch 'o the vapors, I must say I was extremely impressed with capabilities of the drivers & their cars today. The diversity of vehicles is amazing. Everything - from our favorite car, the SVX, to Mercedes Turbo-Diesel sedans, to BMW M3s to Hondas to Mustangs to ...may I say it? OK - a Neon; were lettin' it safely all hang out around 2 miles of turns, curves & straights.

Thanks again, Harry, for a wonderful day!

Ron.

[Earthworm]

Sounds like a ton-o-fun!

I'd like to try my luck on a road course. I've done auto-x but I want a bit more speed now.

[SVXphile]

Oh....that hurts!:p

Ron, old buddy....you need to write for Road and Track.

Ya gotta be careful when you're out "hotdoggin"!

Once you get your sealegs back, give me your honest (!)
impression of the SVT at (reduced due to breaking-in) speed.

I know Harry and his SVX were lapping the place like crazy....

(shaking head....wishing I had been there...:( )

Don

[newsvx]

Great Time, Ron and Mike - John, what happened to you????

Fun time today too when I replace the brakes on the front. I made the mistake of not having new pads at least on the front, but the tech inspection indicated about 1/2 to 1/4 of the pads were left. Well, after a hard Saturday, there is NO MORE PAD on the front. But it was still stopping at the end, wasn't it Mike! I'll need another couple of race tires too - this is actually the second season for them, so a new set is sorta planned.

The WX could not have been better, although the initial 24 degrees in the morning was a little stiff.

Attached is a pic of, "the guys" yesterday. Great time. I'll post some more pics from the digital in my locker. Film from the other camera goes in today.

Thanks again for coming down, Ron and Mike. Super time!
Harry

[newsvx]

Originally posted by SVXphile
Oh....that hurts!:p

Ron, old buddy....you need to write for Road and Track.

Ya gotta be careful when you're out "hotdoggin"!

Once you get your sealegs back, give me your honest (!)
impression of the SVT at (reduced due to breaking-in) speed.

I know Harry and his SVX were lapping the place like crazy....

(shaking head....wishing I had been there...:( )

Don

Don,
Here is what you would have looked like at speed at Summit :D .
This is a pic of Tom half way down the 1/2 mile straight - consistently hitting 110 - 111 MPH at the end of the straight. Ron was riding with Tom at the time. Tom was very impressed with the little Focus and absolutely loves it. Never thought that would be the case with his previous car being the 1996 Firebird Formula.
Great time, Don. We missed you and Jean!
Harry

[newsvx]

OOPS, How about the PIC .......

[SVXphile]

Reaction to the first picture:

"Ron has whiskers....Ron has whiskers!" :D (good pic!)


Reaction to second picture:

"Gee ma nee.....the SVT is faster than I thought. The little thing is in "warped" drive!!!! (musta been the shutter speed) :D


OK, there are tears in my cereal bowl.....

WHEN IS THE NEXT ONE HARRY ???????

:( Don

[newsvx]

Originally posted by SVXphile
Reaction to the first picture:

"Ron has whiskers....Ron has whiskers!" :D (good pic!)


Reaction to second picture:

"Gee ma nee.....the SVT is faster than I thought. The little thing is in "warped" drive!!!! (musta been the shutter speed) :D


OK, there are tears in my cereal bowl.....

WHEN IS THE NEXT ONE HARRY ???????

:( Don

Yep, and the whisters are gray too :rolleyes: .

Yes, the little Focus is pretty fast, but handles better than it is fast. 7.5 sec to 60 MPH isn't great, but it is about what the SVX does. But it is faster than the average.

Missed a good time, Don. But we understand. Maybe next time, which is likely to be next March. Summit Point is VERY busy. It is difficult to get a club date. But there is always autocross - up for it?
Harry

[newsvx]

Just got a call from Tom from Summit (7:00 PM). He is awaiting a tow truck for the Focus. It appears that on his last run for the day, the drain plug of the "new" transmission came out ant oiled up his rear wheels going into turn 10. The back end flipped around and he hit the tire wall. No body damage, however, it did bend one of the rear axles.
Tom is okay - only shaken up a bit. Really angry, as one can imagine. I can not believe that the drain plug was not sufficiently tightened! Fortunately, he had an instructor in the car with him and this was a "driver's education" event for the club.

I'll keep you posted as to the dealings with the dealer...
Harry

[SVXphile]

What rotten luck!

<I'll keep you posted as to the dealings with the dealer... >

Since it was technically "driver training" instead of actually racing, there shouldn't be a problem. There is some disclaimer in my SVT addition to the Focus owners manuel, that says they don't cover anything done during competition. Of course, what they don't know....won't hurt them anyway... :)

<but handles better than it is fast>
That is what I have said on several theads. 170 hp is not going to break any speed records.....but when you don't have to slow down as much for the turns...:D Wheeeeeee! Don

<But there is always autocross - up for it?>

When and where? :D

[Ron Mummert]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by newsvx
[B]

Yep, and the whisters are gray too :rolleyes: .


That's funny, they were perfectly dark before my two carnival rides.

Bummer about Tom's axel, Harry. It's always the LITTLE things (loose plug) that lead to big things. I hope all the parts are covered under warranty. Let us know how Ford treats it.

Ron (Now feelin' good enough to crack open a fresh Box'o).

[newsvx]

Thanks, Guys. Appreciate your thoughts.

I hope Ford will do Tom right on this, since, as you know, this isn't competition at all. It truly is getting out on the track and leaning to drive your car better. While Tom instructs there from time to time with the club, I am glad he had an instructor in the car with him at the time. But I just can not believe the drain plug was not put in tight........
Harry

[rufus]

Hey Harry-

Thanks again for for letting me ride along. That was a real blast. It was also pretty cool to see how well the SVX (with you at the wheel, at least) was able to keep up with some "really" fast cars through the curves. I'll be there as a driver next year, for sure (assuming the beginner pace is a little more...relaxed)

:D :D :D

[newsvx]

Originally posted by rufus
Hey Harry-

Thanks again for for letting me ride along. That was a real blast. It was also pretty cool to see how well the SVX (with you at the wheel, at least) was able to keep up with some "really" fast cars through the curves. I'll be there as a driver next year, for sure (assuming the beginner pace is a little more...relaxed)

:D :D :D
Mike,
Really glad to see you and Ron come down. I knew you would enjoy it. For sure, next time for you. There are usually multiple groups from beginner to advanced, so don't worry about that.

Yes, I agree re the SVX. No, it's not the fastest thing out there, and neither does it handle as well as some. But for almost 4,000 lbs (4450 gross vehicle weight), it doesn't do badly. And it is such fun. And I will never have the ability to see the full capability of the car. Just too old and slow, but I do enjoy it.

BTW, I found out today that the Spec Miata (the gray one) that was running it my group had a little "off road excursion) at Turn 1 (at the end of the straight). Seems he went off the track at better than 80-90 MPH and ended up in the gravel pit (that gravel does a GOOD job of stopping a car!). Did't hurt the car, except there was a lot of gravel to pick out of brake and suspension parts. And, a red-faced driver. Pretty fast car overall. I don't know why he ran out of track, unless his brakes overheated and just went away.

Also, I completely reworked the SVX's front brakes yesterday - new rotors and pads. The pads (starting out at 3/4 thickness) were total gone - no material. I knew better and should have started out with brand new pads - another lesson learned. Yet another lesson is when the brake fluid goes down significantly, there probably is also significant brake pad wear to go along with it. But as you saw, even with extended hard use (there was some hard braking, wasn't there!), the SVX's brakes do VERY well.
I continue to be impressed with the SVX! As I have said before, it capabilities far exceed my abilities!
Looking forward to seeing you at Reading AND autoX.
Harry

[SVXphile]

<But I just can not believe the drain plug was not put in tight........>

Boy, that line had a faint ring of familiarity to it.....


Randy????? ;) :D :D :D Don

[Trevor]

I have just been sent here by Ron to have a look. You guys have me GREEEEEN with envy.

The SVX is one of the few cars I have owned which I have not tried on a road circuit. I have always taken my road cars out for a bash when racing as knowing what a car will do when driven at 10/10 is such a safety factor which can save ones life in a bad situation on the road.

Harry did you break the SVX loose and set it up for corners ? Did it over or understeer ? Was it slow to break away or unpredictable ? I have been told they break loose in a flash but have by doubts as to whether this is so.

Interesting that the brakes performed OK. Thought they would and can't understand some of the posts re poor brakes. Further advice in this regard would be interesting.

Down this way drain plugs MUST be wire locked in place before running on a racing circuit. There can be very bad news for the poor guys following behind and this has caused fatal prangs here.

Regards to you lucky buggers, Trevor.:mad: :) :confused:

[newsvx]

Originally posted by Trevor
I have just been sent here by Ron to have a look. You guys have me GREEEEEN with envy.

The SVX is one of the few cars I have owned which I have not tried on a road circuit. I have always taken my road cars out for a bash when racing as knowing what a car will do when driven at 10/10 is such a safety factor which can save ones life in a bad situation on the road.

Harry did you break the SVX loose and set it up for corners ? Did it over or understeer ? Was it slow to break away or unpredictable ? I have been told they break loose in a flash but have by doubts as to whether this is so.

Interesting that the brakes performed OK. Thought they would and can't understand some of the posts re poor brakes. Further advice in this regard would be interesting.

Down this way drain plugs MUST be wire locked in place before running on a racing circuit. There can be very bad news for the poor guys following behind and this has caused fatal prangs here.

Regards to you lucky buggers, Trevor.:mad: :) :confused:

Hey, Tevor,
Thanks for the post.
First, let me say, I am not a racecar driver - but I do enjoy pushing myself and the car somewhat close to the limit. As you pointed out, getting out and doing these kinds of things with ours cars is not only good for the soul, but it makes us better drivers.
Of course, the SVX is NOT a racecar - certainly not at 2 tons! That said, I still believe the SVX to be a heck of a road machine, and of course, it was designed to be the Grand Tourer we all know and love. It really handles quite well, and I find it to be rather neutral handling.
Re your questions: I really don't attempt to break it loose in the corners. The ole saying, if you are sliding, you are loosing time. However, there are times in autocross in particular that a slight "lifting" out of the gas or slightly tapping the brake (in a turn) will cause the car to rotate ever so slightly, pointing you in the right direction where you get back on the gas and the car "pulls" right through the turn. There at Summit there are a couple of places this was effective, such as the "chute" - a slight dart to the left followed quickly by a slight dart to the right and then 40 meters away a really HARD turn to the left. Then there is the "carousel", a delightful right turn, left turn and right turn is quick fashion - all rather sweeping but uniformly tight through all three. When one hits that right, clipping the apex of each as it should be, it just feels great. Going through the carousel is anotherplace to lift the gas just a little to settle the car going through.
Keep in mind too that I was also on racing tires, Kumho Victo Racers v700's. Compared to street tire, they stick like glue. Heck of a difference!
Regarding the brakes: Likewise, I have always liked the SVX brakes. While stopping distances are not like some BMW's, they do very well considering the weight of the car. I have even had an instructor at Bill Scott Racing (at Summit) comment going into Turn 1 at the end of the straight, "Wow, this thing has brakes!" There at Summit, I have never had brake fade. I use standard rotors out of the parts store (NAPA or the like) and AXXIS semi-metalic pads (these are made in Australia, BTW). I would like to replace the brake ines with steel braided lines, but that would move me out of G Stock class, and the SVX has a bad enough problem with a weight disadvantage as it is. I would say that if one wanted to start upgrading, then go all the way in the class you are moving up to - otherwise, one will not be competitive.
Yep, agree re the drain plugs needing to be wired. Can be very bad for the guy behind you. I remember hitting some coolant from a BMW in the chute several years ago, running 80-90 MPH. I only did two 360 degree spins before "backing" into the outside of the hard left turn. The instructor with me didn't even have time to say,"Sh_t".
Anyway, Trevor. Sorry to run on so much. Us old guys do that at times. And we get faster as we recount our experiences as we age too :)
But take the SVX out on a track. You will be pleasantly surprised.
Harry

[Ron Mummert]

Sorry to run on so much. Us old guys do that at times. And we get faster as we recount our experiences as we age too :)
But take the SVX out on a track. You will be pleasantly surprised.
Harry [/B][/QUOTE]


Hey, Harry - I think we should recruit ole Kiwi Trevor to join us at Reading, IF he'll just give up that daily dip in the ocean for a week.

Think of all the lies we can propogate between us!

Ron (Lying in wait).

[Earthworm]

I can agree on how slick antifreeze is once it's on your tires. At my one and only autocross my radiator overflow...overflowed and dripped onto the front driver tire. I couldn't brake or turn properly at all. Killed a few cones!

The culpret was the rad sealant the previous owner used. It plugged the overflow container like a 1 way valve.

[newsvx]

David,
Not good, huh? Thjat has to be the slickest stuff going! Glad it was only the cones!:D
Harry

[Trevor]

Harry thank you very much for the run down and every word was worth reading. Great to read some fact as there is far too much fiction posted.

You have confirmed my own thoughts. The SVX does ALL it was designed to do very well as built. It appears to me that many base opinions on the performance of cars which have been abused and worn out. It is assumed that the original is no good and mods are resorted to rather than restoration. Your factual experience in respect of the brakes is very, very interesting, as is the fact that you have wisely departed very little from standard.

In my experience the classic fastest line is not the way to win a motor race but "instructors" will not tell you this. The requirement to win is to have the skill to pass cars of equal or slightly better performance. One must have the ability and courage to drive the inside line and this usually involves some lateral lack of adhesion !

The purist will say that you will come out of the corner slower but the object is to be first out. A race is not a time trial. The classic line is for setting a time for a good place on the grid. After that it is -- pass every bastard in view then having got past, if they are faster than you, make sure you deprive them of their classic line until the finish line is crossed. Great fun and I sure miss it.

Possibly I don't have to tell you that the F1 procession leaves me cold.

[newsvx]

Trevor,
Well said re the racing lines, etc. If one is in front, then keep the rest of them behind you, even if they are faster. That's where the "driving" part enters the equation. Yes, the classic line through a turn is always the fastest, but in a race, it won't always allow you to "win". And every situation (and turn) is different. And you gotta protect that inside line!

But as I mentioned, I don't race at Summit Point - these are opportunities to take our street cars out on the track and have professional instructor to show us a better way to drive the track. And of course, every instructor is slightly different in approach. One learns from each - if not what to do, what NOT to do, because of many factors such as the comfort part.

But that said, we do enjoy pushing the car and ourselves in this way, and it is a heck of a lot better than on the street. I don't street race - too risky for oneself as well as others. And besides, if caught, the police can take the car up here.....:(

Agree about F1.. so sad. I don't know if I will be going to INDY again this year. I have four tickets, but I could be moving at that time. My two boys will probably go, but I doubt I will. I retire in 36 working days! And I can't wait!
Take care and stay in touch.
Harry

[SVXphile]

Harry, congratulations on your pending retirement! :) Don

[newsvx]

Originally posted by SVXphile
Harry, congratulations on your pending retirement! :) Don

Thanks, Don. 35 working days left, but who's counting? Yep, it's time to quit after 37 years - wow, that sounds like a long time!:(
But it has been a good 37 years!:D
Harry

[newsvx]

For those interested, I have uploaded several pics from last weekend at Summit Point. Unfortunately, none of the SVX since I couldn't take a pic of myself - Ron, that's up to you. Where are your pics? Mike, did you take any?

Anyway, enjoy the pics.
Harry

[newsvx]

Sorry, I didn't mention - the pics are in my locker...:D