lan's engine build and engine build how to

[longassname]

In this thread I will document the build of the engine going into my ebony SVX. This engine is being built with the same ECUtune parts being used for the EG33s being put together for forced induction by other members of the forum but a noteable difference in the build is that I have the tooling to ensure a higher level of precision in the machining and assembly of the engine. In this thread I will share pictures and explanations on how this level of precision is attained.

[longassname]

I started checking the machine work on my bottom end in order to prepare for assembling my engine. First let me say this isn't something you do the day you expect to put the engine together. That would be assuming you won't find any problems and as my case illustrates that isn't a fair assumption.

Here's a picture of my crank. It sure looks great and up until about half way through my check it measures out great too.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5057.jpg

Here's my NSK Japan 2-3" outside micrometer closed down on a 2" standard and zero'd out. (I kind of collect nsk japan micrometers). It is accurate to .0001" which in technical jargon is commonly called a "ten" which is short for one ten thousands of an inch. The first use of this micrometer is to measure all of the crank journals and crank pins. The crank pins are what the rods connect to. The crank journals are what ride inside of the block. We take two measurements of every journal, 90 degrees apart to check for roundness/out of roundness. Everything checked out round and my pins measured to ******" and my journals to ******".
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5058.jpg



So far so good. The next thing we need to do is make sure our crank is straight. To do this we install bearings into the odd number cyllinder block for the #1 and #5 journals. I actually don't have the correct bearing installed in the #5 location in the picture. It wouldn't matter for this test but I corrected it anyway because in the next step we will be installing all the bearings.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5060.jpg
We then drop the crank onto those bearings and isntall a dial gage to the block so that we can check for run out. I use the keyway in the crank nose as indicator for how far I have rotated the crank. Rotating the crank 1 full revolution any bend in the crank will show up as run out--the difference between the high and low measurement displayed on the dial gage. The dial gage is zero'd out in the picture but it doesn't have to be. The only thing we are looking for here is a movement in the gage. If there is no bend there is no movement in the gage reading at all. Everything looked good through journal #5 then I found 5 tens run out on journal 6 and 12 tens run out on journal 7. Visually that means on needle moved half a tick mark on that gage on #6 and over 1 tick mark on that gage on #7. That means there is a small bend in the crank between journal 5 and 6. I need to send it back to the machine shop.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5063.jpg



The next issue is our oil clearances. The home mechanic typically uses plastigage to to check his oil clearances but plastigage is only acurate to 5 tens. I can do much better. I have a digital bore gage certified to .00005" The bore gage has to be set with a standard and I'm using my 2-3" outside micrometer as the standard so that limits my acuracy to 1 ten but that is 5 times better than plastigage before even considering reliablity and repeatability. Plastigage also doesn't give you #'s you can use for machining; it just tells you if someting is acceptable or scary.

What we want to do is cage the bearings. Caging bearings means installing them into the block and into the rods without the crank and then measuring them. The difference between the outside micrometer readings of the crank and the bore gage readings of the bearings is your oil clearance. You will find that the readings of the bearings in the factory parts, particularly the main bearings have a large amount of variability.

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5066.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/crank/DSC_5068.jpg

The eagle rods I am using are ground much more precisly than the block and have very little variability. My caged rod bearings have a bore of ******" to ******" giving me an oil clearance of ** to ** tens. This is a little tight but I am using coated bearings so 4 tens of that is dry film coating. This is as tight as I'm comfortable with but i'm comfortable with it and won't have them mess with the crank pins anymore.

The bore of the caged main bearings had 8 tens of variation. Remember my measumrents indicated that the machine shop ground all the journals to the same size even though I had paid them to cage the bearings and grind accordingly. Obviously I have 8 tens of variation in my oil clearances with oil clearances ranging from 1 thousandth to 18 tens. This I am not happy with. I'm going to go ahead and get a set of larger bearings, cage them myself, and specify the size to grind each journal to.

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Very, very nice! So, who's Ian (your alter ego?)?:D
-Bill

[longassname]

um that's an L...every on here calls me lan so why fight it

Michael,
Very, very nice! So, who's Ian (your alter ego?)?:D
-Bill

[sicksubie]

So are you saying my build is less precise?

[longassname]

Is that insulting to you? My understanding is that your engine has the factory oil clearances and that Tom checked them with plastigauge and didn't find anything scary. I'm just describing the process to move the tollerances out another digit.


So are you saying my build is less precise?

[cdigerlando]

Very nice. Thanks for the write up. Good thing you checked your crank with the dial guage. You can't pay for that kind of piece of mind.

[longassname]

thanks,

lol, I paid for it..I just didn't get it.


Very nice. Thanks for the write up. Good thing you checked your crank with the dial guage. You can't pay for that kind of piece of mind.

[sicksubie]

I said that in jest.... I have 110% confidence in the work that Tom did.:)

[TomsSVX]

To be honest Mike is gonna need his tolerences to be larger and more precise for his plans... Running tons of boost and hoping for over 600awhp you are gonna need it. For Bobby and my builds, we are not going to that extent and a tighter motor will leave us with more longevity. Our clearances are to the upper end of the spectrum for stock clearances and I think we are perfect right there

Tom

[longassname]

The cyllinder heads are ready to be sent out for thermal barier coating of the combustion chambers and exhaust ports and I've made crates to send them out in.

They are ported and I do mean ported not port matched. What was done is kind of hard to grasp unless you've actually done it before and probably impossible for me to explain but maybe you can visually see how free flowing they are now. There was a lot of room for improvement just cleaning up the castings. There were some pretty nasty ledges and missmatched surfaces around the valve seats so removing those was 1st and foremost. After removing the casting seams and cast surface it was obvious there were some great opportunities for improvement in the bowls and deep in the ports.


Here are just a couple pictures of the heads:
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5085.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5104.jpg


Here are a couple of close ups of combustion chambers where you can kind of get a look out of the intake ports:
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5111.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5136.jpg


Here's a close up of a combustion chamber where you can see some exhaust bowls:
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5150.jpg



Here's a look down an intake port:
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/porting/DSC_5145.jpg

[SVXRide]

um that's an L...every on here calls me lan so why fight it

Michael,
that was a joke;):)
-Bill

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Beautiful work on the heads! Did you do them yourself, or farm it out? How many hours went into each head?
-Bill

[longassname]

For time's sake I was going to have someone else do them but I got tired of leaving them sitting around their shop and gave up and did them myself. I'm well tooled up it and know what I'm doing so I decided to just sit down and knock them out. I'd say I personally put 12 hours of solid porting into them myself. I have another shop that dissassembled them, knocked down the guides, and then reset them and bead blasted the ports and chambers, and surfaced them when I was done.


Michael,
Beautiful work on the heads! Did you do them yourself, or farm it out? How many hours went into each head?
-Bill

[Ricochet]

did somebody say 600awhp? My interest is piqued :)

[longassname]

I measured my pistons and bores:

bores.....

1 top 3.81** & 3.81**
1 bottom 8.81**
3 top 3.81** & 3.81***
3 bottom 3.81**
5 top 3.81*** & 3.81**
5 bottom 3.81**
2 top 3.81** & b3.81**
2 bottom 3.81**
4 top 3.81** & 3.81***
4 bottom 3.81**
6 top 3.81** & 3.81**
6 bottom 3.81**

pistons are all 3.81** to 3.81**

doing the math the side wall clearances are:
1 .00**
3 .00**
5 .00**
2 .00**
4 .00**
6 .00**

[longassname]

My heads, pistons, and valves are officially on their way for coating. Fedex picked them up today.

[longassname]

I've gotten some .50mm oversized high silicon aluminum main bearings coated which are on their way back to me now. I'm waiting on them so I can cage them and get the measurements to have the crank shop machine the crank to.

They are in the process of coating the pistons, heads, and valves now. I'm sure I'll end up waiting on the crank.

[longassname]

bearings are here. I'll cage them tomorrow and send my crank out to be redone on monday.

[longassname]

I caged the new bearings.

Journal# bearing bore oil clearance journal size
1: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
2: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
3: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
4: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
5: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
6: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**
7: 2.34*** .00** 2.34**

Now I can send the crank back to get straightened and ground to journal sizes I'm specifying based on caged bearing measurements.

[longassname]

fedex says my crank was delivered to the machine shop today. Hopefully they get right on it.

[longassname]

still waiting on that crank....

[Dessertrunner]

Though you must of left town, can't wait for the next installment.
Tony

[longassname]

I'm dropping the heads and valve train parts off for the valve job, assembly and final cleaning. I took some pictures of the coated parts while they are still seperate parts.

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/coating/DSC_5409.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/coating/DSC_5422.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/coating/DSC_5424.jpg

[Myxalplyx]

Long,

The valve job you are doing. Would this be similar to what DPR racing does for the Honda engines? What they call it...a 5 angle valve job. I remember reading up on that years ago in magazines like Sport Compact Car. Was a big thing then for naturally aspirated engines. It was done so air could travel past the valves smoothly without the corners of the ports hindering the flow. Made a big difference on their flow bench.

I went on their site last week and found they did some cylinder head work for Subarus. Probably the Impreza mostly. Poked around the site due to some ideas. Looking forward to seeing how this build goes.

[longassname]

no, it will be a redux of the factory valve job.


Long,

The valve job you are doing. Would this be similar to what DPR racing does for the Honda engines? What they call it...a 5 angle valve job. I remember reading up on that years ago in magazines like Sport Compact Car. Was a big thing then for naturally aspirated engines. It was done so air could travel past the valves smoothly without the corners of the ports hindering the flow. Made a big difference on their flow bench.

I went on their site last week and found they did some cylinder head work for Subarus. Probably the Impreza mostly. Poked around the site due to some ideas. Looking forward to seeing how this build goes.

[cdigerlando]

I caged the new bearings.



Now I can send the crank back to get straightened and ground to journal sizes I'm specifying based on caged bearing measurements.

Are these the oil clearances you are specifying or are they the clearances you measured, and you are shooting for more clearance?

[longassname]

those are the journal sizes I am specifying to obtain those clearances. As I said I measured the caged bearing bores..then subtracted the clearances...which yielded to sizes to grind the journals to.

I guess you are thinking they are tight. I am using coated bearings. If you ignore the coating my oil clearances are 4 tens larger than the #'s I listed. Think of my clearances as being 20 tens for the bearing with the thrust flanges and 16 tens for the rest.

Are these the oil clearances you are specifying or are they the clearances you measured, and you are shooting for more clearance?

[cdigerlando]

those are the journal sizes I am specifying to obtain those clearances. As I said I measured the caged bearing bores..then subtracted the clearances...which yielded to sizes to grind the journals to.

I guess you are thinking they are tight. I am using coated bearings. If you ignore the coating my oil clearances are 4 tens larger than the #'s I listed. Think of my clearances as being 20 tens for the bearing with the thrust flanges and 16 tens for the rest.

I'm also going to be using a coated bearing, so I was just curious what you did about clearance. I was going to shoot for about .0018 with the coating, which is a bit more clearance than you are using.

[longassname]

That's a lot more clearance than I'm going with. According to the Subaru specs that's way past the wear limits but with the tri-metal bearings you are using you definitely need to error on the loose side. I wouldn't go that loose obviously but then I wouldn't use the bearings you are using either. You'll just have to figure it out.



I'm also going to be using a coated bearing, so I was just curious what you did about clearance. I was going to shoot for about .0018 with the coating, which is a bit more clearance than you are using.

[longassname]

I finally got my crank back (yay).
Will be redoing the check of the crank and presumably resuming the engine build very shortly.

[TomsSVX]

check ur pm box.

Tom

[longassname]

Ok, so I had previously caged my bearings in the block and measured their bore in order to determine the size to grind the journals to in order to obtain the desired oil clearnaces.

Now I have the crank back and have put the micrometer to it to determine what the actual journal sizes came out to and thus what the oil clearances will be. Those measurements and calculations are:
journal# bore diameter oil clearance
1: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
2: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
3: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
4: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
5: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**
6: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**
7: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**

These seem acceptable to me.

[SVXRide]

Michael,
What happened on 5 and 6? I thought you sent the crank out to be worked on so you'd have a closer match across all of the bearings? The other five look great.
-Bill

[longassname]

no i wanted 5 bigger than the rest..that's the thrust bearing. The others came out looser than 6 but they are all acceptable. Ideally the crank would have come back with exactly what I specified but then this shop didn't get it right the first time either....but these specs are all acceptable. I still have to check run out though.


Michael,
What happened on 5 and 6? I thought you sent the crank out to be worked on so you'd have a closer match across all of the bearings? The other five look great.
-Bill

[SVXRide]

no i wanted 5 bigger than the rest..that's the thrust bearing. The others came out looser than 6 but they are all acceptable. Ideally the crank would have come back with exactly what I specified but then this shop didn't get it right the first time either....but these specs are all acceptable. I still have to check run out though.

Gotcha...
-Bill

[longassname]

Bill maybe it will help to put the factory tollerances next to mine then you will see that we are in fact out another digit on all the tolerances. We are just out 2 digits on most of them so now you are expecting that kind of acuracy on everything...which I don't blame you..I wanted that too but it just doesn't look like the shop I used is capable of it. This time around I used what is supposed to be the best machine shop in Florida to do this crank instead of my usual tenessee ship which is in fact capable of those tolerances. I'll check monday and see if I maybe a polish can take a couple tens off of #6--if so then we will in fact have our tolerances out two digits past factory.


my main oil clearances
1: .00***
2: .00***
3: .00***
4: .00***
5: .00**
6: .00**
7: .00***

factory range
1,3,7: .0002-.0014 (.0012 range)
my range
1,3,7: (.00005 range)
=24 times more precise

factory range
2,4,6: .0005-.0015 (.001 range)
my range
2,4,6: (.00035 range)
= 3 times more precise

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Looks good. These are all with your ECUTune bearings, right?
-Bill

[longassname]

oh of course..I'd never use anything but


Michael,
Looks good. These are all with your ECUTune bearings, right?
-Bill

[superru]

hey LAN i've been trying to keep track on this build of yours.. what's our biggest problem with breaking through the hi HP numbers? Cams? heads? valves? fuel delivery? engine managment? i'd like to put some of my time into getting around the problems, hoping to hit high HP#'s ya baby!:cool:

[longassname]

Allright, I just checked the crank for run out and it's good this time around. I'll go get the #6 journal polished and we'll be ready for assembly.

[SVXRide]

Allright, I just checked the crank for run out and it's good this time around. I'll go get the #6 journal polished and we'll be ready for assembly.

Michael,
Good news! When do you think you'll have the engine back in the car?
-Bill

[longassname]

A single turn on a belt polisher (about a 5 second pass) on journal #6 brought it down to 2.3438" so now we are looking golden and I can start assembling the short. I stopped by to check on my heads and they will be ready friday. I'll probably get the crank in today and the pistons in tomorrow.

journal# bore diameter oil clearance
1: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
2: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
3: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
4: 2.34*** 2.34** .00***
5: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**
6: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**
7: 2.34*** 2.34** .00**

factory range
1,3,7: .0002-.0014 (.0012 range)
my range
1,3,7: (.00005 range)
=24 times more precise

factory range
2,4,6: .0005-.0015 (.001 range)
my range
2,4,6: (.00005 range)
= 20 times more precise

[longassname]

Allright, so as I just posted yesterday we have our crank in good order now (good order in our case = no out of round, no run out, oil clearances all right above the factory standard range, oil clearances all fall within half a ten thousandth of an inch range, 6a finishes.)

With the crank ready it was time to put it in. The assembly of the rotating assembly deserves the same level of attention as the machining and measurement. The crank was given a thorough cleaning with non-chlorinated brake cleaner so that there was zero lint, film, etc on the crank includining inside of the oil passages.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0003.jpg




With the crank clean the rods were installed. The bearings were already installed into the rods as part of the caging process that was performed earlier to determine target crank pin sizes. So now I dissassembled each rod one at a time and coated the bearings with moly-graphite assembly lube. The rod bolts were previously lubed with the arp moly assembly lube but as it was squeezed out of the contact points, particularly the underside of the heads, I coated the threads and heads again. Rod bolts were torqued to 42 ft-lbs.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0010.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0013.jpg




With the rotating assembly ready to go in the block was given a final prep. It had been prepped before as part of the caging process for the main bearings but it was cleaned up again for good measure and to make sure there was no film, dust, lint etc on the mating surfaces. The bearings were already installed into the block as part of the caging process as well. Now they were evenly coated with moly graphite assembly lube. O-rings were installed into the 1,3,5 block half.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0015.jpg




With the block halves cleaned for assembly the crank was dropped in and liquid packing was applied around the bolt holes, top of block, front of block, and back of block.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0021.jpg




With the block ready to assemble the 2,4,6 half was dropped onto the 1,3,5 half and assembly was performed according to the factory service manual specifications. With the block assembled break away pressure was measured but the crank turns so smoothly break away pressure was lower than I am able to measure.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_0024.jpg

[SVXRide]

Michael,
So, ARP bolts on the rods and stock Subie bolts on the block? Are you using Hondabond between the block halves?
-Bill

[longassname]

Bill, the rods are eagle rods and use arp 2000 fasteners. Neither the factory rods or factory rod bolts would suffice for this build. It would be way too easy to stretch the rod bolts or deform the caps. The factory block bolts however are just fine. They don't see as much stress as the rod bolts and are much larger. The high balance of this particular rotating assembly is likely to result in a reduction of stress placed on the block bolts rather than an increase. My rotating assembly is balanced out past 12,000 rpms--which it will never come close to seeing.

[YourConfused]

Would you be able to tell me a ballpark figure of what the machine cost have summed to during this build? Also, were you able to get the cylinders machined with a torque plate bolted up? It took months for a local shop to find one for my L28 (now L30), and I assume it would be even harder to find one for the EG33.
Thanks,
Shaun

[longassname]

The machine work on my short block was $987. That price should have included (and supposedly did include) the caging of the bearings which I ended up having to do a couple times myself anyway. A torque plate was used for the cyllinder honing (and the cyllinder honing was a two step hone with standard hones--that one is real easy to tell visually by the finish quality of the crosshatch, if you look at some of the photos posted by others you'll see their cyllinder finishes are much coarser).


Would you be able to tell me a ballpark figure of what the machine cost have summed to during this build? Also, were you able to get the cylinders machined with a torque plate bolted up? It took months for a local shop to find one for my L28 (now L30), and I assume it would be even harder to find one for the EG33.
Thanks,
Shaun

[YourConfused]

What about the head work $? Did the short price include the coatings? I can't remember it all. You had chambers, valves, pistons and what else coated? I like the pics btw.

[SVXRide]

Bill, the rods are eagle rods and use arp 2000 fasteners. Neither the factory rods or factory rod bolts would suffice for this build. It would be way too easy to stretch the rod bolts or deform the caps. The factory block bolts however are just fine. They don't see as much stress as the rod bolts and are much larger. The high balance of this particular rotating assembly is likely to result in a reduction of stress placed on the block bolts rather than an increase. My rotating assembly is balanced out past 12,000 rpms--which it will never come close to seeing.

Michael,
Yep, I thought that was the case (bolt wise). What do you mean your engine won't see 12 grand? ;):lol: What are you going to use as your upper limit via the ECU software, 8-9 grand?
-Bill

[longassname]

I think retail on the coatings I had done is nine hundred something--I have $974 in my head. I did the porting on the heads but typically porting is $100 to $150 a cyllinder. I don't have a sum total for the dissassembly, cleaning, blasting, surfacing, and valve job yet.


What about the head work $? Did the short price include the coatings? I can't remember it all. You had chambers, valves, pistons and what else coated? I like the pics btw.

[longassname]

I fitted the rings today. The picture below is of the fitted top ring on cyllinder 3. The oil control rings were already at 0.***" end gap and didn't require grinding. The second rings were at 0.***" and I ground them out to a 0.***" end gap. The top rings were at 0.***" and I ground them out to a 0.***" end gap.


http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_1003.jpg

[YourConfused]

I think you forgot the piston.:D
Seriously though, is the amount of gap going to close up any measurable amount due to thermal expansion? I don't know the gap spec for various motors or anything to use as reference but that's almost a 1/32" gap and seems rather big.
This may be a stupid question as it seems I must have overlooked something here.

[longassname]

Yes .*** is a relatively large end gap. For a naturally aspirated build the end gap would be .*** or .***. The more power you are running/the more heat you have in your combustion chambers the larger your end gap needs to be because yes the gap closes up due to thermal expansion.


I think you forgot the piston.:D
Seriously though, is the amount of gap going to close up any measurable amount due to thermal expansion? I don't know the gap spec for various motors or anything to use as reference but that's almost a 1/32" gap and seems rather big.
This may be a stupid question as it seems I must have overlooked something here.

[longassname]

Before I sent the pistons out to get coated I measured each piston and each piston bore to determine sidewall clearances. The post with that information is quoted below for comparison with the after coating information. Now that the pistons are coated I measured them again to check our new sidewall clearance. I got .0005 thick anti friction coating on the piston skirts along with the thermal barrier coating on the piston top. The idea behind both is to be able to reduce our sidewall clearances. Fitting of forged pistons is critical and almost an art.

The same features which make forged pistons superior to cast pistons make them harder to fit. Because they expand more when heated they require larger sidewall clearances. The larger your sidewall clearances the more you depend on your rings to seal cylinder pressure and the more likely you are to have piston slap. Because of this forged pistons are generally considered loud and often times those with performance engines that are equipped with knock sensors must go to extra lengths to isolate the knock sensors from picking up the sound of skirt slap.

The factory engine/piston combination for an SVX specifies a tiny sidewall clearance of .004 to .0012 or in technical jargon 4 to 12 tens. The ECUtune pistons being used are manufactured by CP who specifies a .0035 sidewall clearance. Some performance Subaru engine builders use a sidewall clearance as great as .0040. Those engines have audible skirt slap when cold that goes away when they warm up but on the flip side when the pistons swell up under extreme conditions they don't drag on the cylinder walls. In this build I am using the peformance coatings to isolate the pistons from the extreme conditions they will see and reduce the temperature range of the pistons and thus the range of size they will operate at. This allows me to use a tighter side wall clearance--though still nowhere near as tight as factory.

After coating I now have 5 pistons that measure 3.81** and 1 piston that measures 3.81**. Looking at my bores I will put the 3.81** piston in cylinder #6 and my sidewall clearances will be:

1)3.81**-3.81**=.00**
3)3.81**-3.81**=.00**
5)3.81**-3.81**=.00**
2)3.81**0-3.81**=.00**
4)3.81**-3.81**=.00**
6)3.81**-3.81**=.00**

This will give me quiet, smooth engine operation along with the ability to withstand extreme outputs.

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_2007.jpg

[SVXRide]

Michael,
I think you should have titled this thread "How to blueprint an EG33":cool:
-Bill

[longassname]

OH YA, you've got to blueprint it. If nothing else the crank experience shared in this thread proves the adage "If you don't measure it you don't get it."

Michael,
I think you should have titled this thread "How to blueprint an EG33":cool:
-Bill

[longassname]

Here's a basic outline of how each piston went in.

The rings were installed with the gaps in the factory orientation. Graphite moly assembly lube was applied evenly to the pin hole. A new factory circlip was installed on the side away from the access hole that would be used for pin installation. The piston was coated with engine oil.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3003.jpg




A semi fixed bore size piston installer was used. These are much better than the type you get from the auto parts store that clamps around the piston. While there is a small adjustment range on a semi fixed bore piston installer you don't clamp it around the piston. It's a machined aluminum bore which is larger on one side and tapers down towards the other side. This allows you to simply push the piston right through.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3005.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3006.jpg



The center pistons go in first, #'s 3 and 4. I prefer to rotate the block for each piston and work downwards instead of sideways. Either way you need access to the rods through the bottom of the block. The crank is rotated to bring the cylinder you are working on to bottom dead center while you adust the angle of the rod to line the pin hole up with the access hole in the block. Then you push the piston down until the pin hole in the piston, pin hole in the rod, and access hole all line up. Then you slide a pin in on your fancy custom piston pin installer. Then you install the circlip on the near side of the piston with your fancy factory circlip installer.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3013.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3017.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_3019.jpg

[longassname]

I cleaned up all the mating surfaces on the block, leaving them with a good chemical clean for sealants and gaskets to adhere too. I cleaned the parts that would be going on and unfortunately didn't notice untill about done cleaning it that the oil pump seems to have fallen victim to someone believing the missprint on the timing cover torque specs and has a crack. Time to order a new oil pump; we'll see how I feel tomorrow, maybe I'll pay the $20 expedite fee. I used blue threadlock on the bolts for the oil pick up and windage baffle. I did not put threadlock on all the bolts as I finger tightened them and then torque them all. It's really much better to put them all on finger tight and then take out one at a time, put threadlock on it, and torque it. It's an isocyanate after all and that way it isn't half dry and drying while torqueing it.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020014.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020017.jpg





With the bottom of the short closed up I moved it over to the engine stand and reclaimed my work cart. You'll remember that this block has been given a step deck--meaning a couple thousandths were milled off the outer areas of the deck leaving the cylinders a couple thousands taller to really compress the head gasket with them and plant them solidy. While the mill barely skimmed over ther cylinders to make sure the deck was level they were left needing a cleaning which I gave them so that this mating surface like all the others was chemically clean. Then I got ready to drop on a cylinder head. I tapped new guides into the block and installed ARP 2000 studs.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020021.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020024.jpg





Like all the rest of the seals used on this engine the OEM headgaskets from the OEM overhaul gasket set were used. The head was placed on the block before the lube was put on the studs. It's much harder to do this way but again I insist on a chemical clean on all mating surfaces--especially the head gasket. The ARP moly assembly lube was used. The washers and nuts were thoroughly cleaned of packing grease and then thoroughly coated with lube. The washers were installed and then the stud threads were lubed. The nuts were installed and torqued in the factory sequence first to 20 ft lbs, then to 40 ft lbs, then to 60 ft lbs, then to 74 ft lbs. Let me tell you, at 74 ft lbs with this set up the compression force holding that head down is much greater than the oem set up.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020032.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020036.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020038.jpg

[longassname]

oh..here's the other side of the cyllinder head.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020029.jpg

[SilverSpear]

Great work Michael,

Cleanliness and Organization are everything in those builds :cool:

[cdigerlando]

Thanks for the update with pics and instructions. You should be up and running in no time. Hopefully you have a good commute so you can break in quickly and tune with the new cams. I'm anxious to see what you come up with for numbers.

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Can you provide a little more detail on "tapping in new guides" for the head studs? I didn't realize you could even buy new guides..
-Bill

[longassname]

The guides line up the block, cylinder head gasket, and cyllinger head. They are the 14.7mm x 18mm steel sleeves in the front, top and back top cylinder head bolt holes. They have to be removed when machining the deck and replaced before installing the heads. The OEM part number is 804014060



Michael,
Can you provide a little more detail on "tapping in new guides" for the head studs? I didn't realize you could even buy new guides..
-Bill

[longassname]

Today I performed the always unpleasant job of discharging the hydraulic lash adjusters. I did this by pressing them between a piece of cardboard and a short section of 1" round in a shop vise. You want the hole in the side of the lash adjuster pointing downwards for the oil to drip out of. You compress each lash adjuster it's full range of movement, letting the oil drip out of it. Each one has to be done half a dozen to a dozen times; each one is a little different. In the end the plunger in the middle bottom of the lash adjuster should be springy and compressible through it's range of motion by hand. If it's not then it's no good. I mark my piece of round on the first one to give me an indication of how far to go on the rest. You obviously don't want to try to compress them beyond the range of motion of the plunger.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1030044.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1030046.jpg

[SVXMAN2001]

wow lan this thread is great info. I would have never known to purge the lash adjusters. How many complete revolutions on the vice would you say you did to fully compress the lash adjusters? Or is it just something you eyeballed...

[SVXRide]

The guides line up the block, cylinder head gasket, and cyllinger head. They are the 14.7mm x 18mm steel sleeves in the front, top and back top cylinder head bolt holes. They have to be removed when machining the deck and replaced before installing the heads. The OEM part number is 804014060

Michael,
Thanks! I've been under the impression - until now - that you could just reuse the guides.
-Bill

[longassname]

I don't know. I just did it by feel. I was particullary careful on the first one before I marked the piece of round I was using. You'll see in the 2nd picture I marked a ring on the piece of round with a silver paint marker to indicate where fully compressed is.


wow lan this thread is great info. I would have never known to purge the lash adjusters. How many complete revolutions on the vice would you say you did to fully compress the lash adjusters? Or is it just something you eyeballed...

[longassname]

Since the hydraulic lash adjusters are so good at holding fluid, the last thing you want to do is clean them with a solvent so that it contaminates the oil inside of them. To clean them I blew each one off with compressed air and then placed it in clean 0w40 synthetic engine oil. While they were soaking in their bath I thoroughly and evenly applied graphite moly assembly lube to the journals, lobes, and thrust faces of the exhaust camshaft. I also throughly and evenly applied graphite moly assembly lube to the journal and thrust surfaces of the cylinder head and dropped the lash adjusters in.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1030049.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040050.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040054.jpg




At this point things were ready for the exhaust camshaft to go in. With the lash adjusters discharged, everything lubed, and the notch on the camshaft facing directly downward the exhaust camshaft slid right in. This is important--you do not want to use the bolts and caps to force/draw the camshaft into place. I applied graphite moly assembly lube to the caps and installed the exhaust cam caps using only a deep well socket and my hands--no socket wrench.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040057.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040061.jpg

[longassname]

The intake camshaft has a spring loaded scissors gear on it to prevent gear whine. Before installing the intake camshaft the scissors gear must be locked in a preloaded position so that the teeth of both gears line up. I have the genuine Subaru tool for doing this but you can make your own with some flat metal some bolts and some ingenuity. The gears are hardened so a large screwdriver and some care would do the trick too. With the scissors locked in the correct preloaded/aligned position I cleaned the packing grease from it and as usual...thoroughly and evenly coated the thrust faces, journals, and lobes with graphite moly assembly lube. I then installed it in it's correct alignment which is with the notch on the nose of the cam in the same direction as the notch on the exhaust cam and with the gear tooth with dot in between the two gear teeth with the dots on the exhaust cam. Since this is the left hand side the notches are facing downwards...on the right hand side the notches are facing upwards. Since there are two sets of alignment dots on each cam gear you have to first go by the notches and then go by the dots in order to make sure you use the right dots and don't get a cam 180 degrees out of phase. Same as with the exhaust cam the intake cam went all the way in by hand and the cap bolts were installed with only a deep well socket and hand--no socket wrench. I then torqued all the bolts. I then took one bolt out at a time and reinstalled and torqued it with blue threadlock.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040063.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040066.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040068.jpg





I had already coated the friction surfaces of the end cap with graphite moly assembly lube; I now applied ultra-black to the mating surface in the fsm pattern. I took the bolt out from the intake cam gear and I got a little crazy here and installed the end cap and torqued all 4 bolts with blue threadlock at one time. I installed the plugs in the back of the head with ultra-black, wiped away the excess from the mating surface, and imediately installed the cylinder head cover so that it would correctly fix the alignment of the plugs before the sealant dried.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040070.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040074.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1040075.jpg

[Dessertrunner]

Well thanks Mike I owe you a 6 pack of beer I was reading your progress and I though "I think I might have got my cam's 180 degree out". I am putting new head gaskets on my wifes SVX and I was waiting on parts from the USA. Looking at your instructions today I thought I better check these cams before I put the engine back in and guess what they were both out. I am trying to get a bit of experiance before I build up my SC kit. Have a great day.
Tony

[SVXMAN2001]

Lan, did you buy brand new exhaust/intake end caps? or just reuse the old ones? I know its assumed, but i just want to ask the cam installed are the performance ones right? Not stock?

[longassname]

What do you mean by exhaust/intake end caps? Yes the cams are the ECUtune performance cams.


Lan, did you buy brand new exhaust/intake end caps? or just reuse the old ones? I know its assumed, but i just want to ask the cam installed are the performance ones right? Not stock?

[Dessertrunner]

Mike how many miles was on this engine. The reason I ask is I am not sure if I should rebuild my existing engine for the SC (has 430,000 kilometers) or my spare (130,000). Did you check wear etc on the cam jounels. I thought my high K engine might only be good to use as a anchour in the end.

[SVXMAN2001]

Lan, end caps aka cam caps. The 3 caps that hold each camshaft. 3 for intake 3 for exhaust.

[longassname]

Those are matched to the head. Notice (although not on all model years) they are numbered so that they go back in the same place you took them off from. Also, notice the holes in the back edge of the head that line up with the axis of each cam--the holes that get half round plugs? Those holes provided the access for line boring of the heads and caps together.



Lan, end caps aka cam caps. The 3 caps that hold each camshaft. 3 for intake 3 for exhaust.

[longassname]

Your high miles engine is probably fine. Most EG33's are high mileage and most of them are fine. It's not the mileage; it's the treatment.


Mike how many miles was on this engine. The reason I ask is I am not sure if I should rebuild my existing engine for the SC (has 430,000 kilometers) or my spare (130,000). Did you check wear etc on the cam jounels. I thought my high K engine might only be good to use as a anchour in the end.

[Dessertrunner]

Mike not sure if right place to ask question but I will, how do you intend to handle the alternator/Aircon issue. What ideas do you have?

[longassname]

I don't know what issue you are talking about. If you are talking about mounting of the alternator below in order to retain air conditioning with a blower set up and standard hood line I believe that is the only possible answer; however, this engine is not getting that set up. This engine is going in naturally aspirated for break in and the details of the forced induction system it will have are not yet being disclosed.

Mike not sure if right place to ask question but I will, how do you intend to handle the alternator/Aircon issue. What ideas do you have?

[OBI]

and the details of the forced induction system it will have are not yet being disclosed.sounds very interesting:rolleyes:

[longassname]

Ok, I got my hands on an oil pump. A new one would have taken forever to get with the holidays so I got a used one. Being a used part I gave it a thorough cleaning and a thorough check over and everything looked good:
(an impact driver is the correct tool to open the pump with--also for removing the philips head screws on the covers on the back of the block--also for the injector caps and fuel pressure regulator--don't expect to remove any of these screws with a screw driver)

tip clearance: .0055
case clearance: .006
inner rotor side clearance: .0013
outer rotor side clearance: .0013


I evenly coated all the friction surfaces with moly graphite assembly lube and reassembled the pump using blue threadlock on the screws. I got a good chemical clean on all the mating surfaces, installed the oring on the block, and applied an even thin coating of sealant in the fsm dictated pattern on the pump. After installing the pump I removed one screw at a time and re-torqued it with blue threadlock. For the water pump, I hung it and it's gasket on the block with all the srcrews just barely started and then one at a time took each bolt out and put it back in finger tight with blue threadlock--then torqued them all to 8.5 ft lbs in a criss cross pattern, repeating twice.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120081.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120082.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120086.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120089.jpg

[sicksubie]

Awesome........

[SVXRide]

Ditto....very, very clean work.
-Bill

[cdigerlando]

Great job completing the long block. I am considering porting the oil input from the pump to the block. I am also replacing the pump rotors, but not the pump. I'm going to pick up my block this morning. I'll be following this thread closely to help me blueprint the assembly.

[TurnInConcepts]

What are you using to clean the mating surfaces? I've always just cleaned them up as good as I can with acetone, but yours are kitchen clean!

[crazyhorse]

I know you know what you're doing, it's obvious from the surgically clean parts.
In the pic of the oil pump open, am I seeing the lube, or scratches on the surface of the rotor?

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120081.jpg

[longassname]

The majority of stuff is removed in acid wash which for block means hot tanking and smaller parts scrubbing with degreaser and water with brushes. Beyond that steel parts normally find themselves soaking in kerosene as do some aluminum parts that need some touch up. Mating surfaces are cleaned with a fine surfacing pad (kind of a scotch pad on a die grinder). Chemical films are removed with non-chlorinated brake cleaner.


What are you using to clean the mating surfaces? I've always just cleaned them up as good as I can with acetone, but yours are kitchen clean!

[longassname]

that would be moly graphite assembly lube


I know you know what you're doing, it's obvious from the surgically clean parts.
In the pic of the oil pump open, am I seeing the lube, or scratches on the surface of the rotor?

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120081.jpg

[longassname]

New thermositors were installed. One goes in with thread sealant the other seals with a copper washer which comes with it. The thread sealer you want to use is the one that says "oem specified" on it.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1120099.jpg

Cam sprockets were torqued in the middle of the factory spec'ed range with blue loctite like pretty much every other bolt on the engine. The factory service tool was used to hold the sprockets while torqueing.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1130104.jpg


A thanks goes out to Gates for the new timing components provided through our Gates Racing sponsorship. I didn't use the cam seals they provided since I already had them from the overhaul gasket set but I'll provide the numbers anyway for those of you who may want to pick them up from your local auto parts store.

timing belt: t209
tensioner: t41213
cogged: t42119
smooth: t42118
cam seal: ks12711
crank seal: ks13427

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1160106.jpg

[SVXRide]

"Gates Racing Sponsorship"?? Do tell!:cool:
-Bill

[lhopp77]

Your high miles engine is probably fine. Most EG33's are high mileage and most of them are fine. It's not the mileage; it's the treatment.

Not all high mileage. I still have one with 2,792 miles on it. :D And a tranny with the same.

Lee

[longassname]

The timing covers all went on at 45 inch pounds with blue loctite. The crank pulley was torqued to the middle of the factory spec range with blue loctite. A new engine harness was installed along with new knock sensors, coil packs, and NGK laser iridium ifr6e11 spark plugs.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1170111.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1160108.jpg



I primed the engine with oil at this point. If I had made a mess it would have been easier to clean up with out the manifold on yet but I didn't make a mess. Pay attention here: this is an experienced engine builder's trick you should learn if you want to build an engine. I hooked up a pump to the port where the oil pressure sensor goes. It's a metric thread obviously but I happen to already have the adaptor as part of my transmission pressure guage set. I used an old svx fuel pump for the pump and it worked well. Wired a ground up to a 12 volt battery and gave myself a positive wire to connect by hand for on and off, dropped the pump in a 1 quart paint pail and filled it up with mobil1 0w40. I pumped a quart through. This primes all the oil galleys and if there should be any bad stuff in any of the galleys it can wash it through without the moving parts moving--thus preventing you from blowing out your little tri-metal bearings if you were silly enough to have used them.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1180117.jpg






The injector stacks were installed to the intake manifold with new gaskets, the fuel rails were installed the the injector stacks with new gaskets ( the fuel injectors had recently/previously been installed into the fuel rails with new o-rings), new factory hoses were installed, and the manifold harness was installed. Important note: when installing fuel injectors always use new o-rings and always lubricate them with vaseline before installing them. The manifold was then installed.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1180121.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1180125.jpg

[Crazy_pilot]

It's so clean and new looking!

I guess you're going to fire this one up without the blower first?

[Roo]

How much would you charge to do this rebuild on my motor??

There would be small changes to the specs from the sounds of it, as I'm keeping this vehicle N/A, but would like to know what you'd charge to build out a motor, given the motor is sent to you, along with a OE gasket set (I work in a parts dept. at a Subaru dealership).

Cams, pistons, rods, bearings, whatever you specified for your motor...

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Beautiful work! The use of the pump to prime the oil is a nice touch...not as easy as hooking up an electric drill to the shaft out of a distributor on a small block, but nice just the same:D
-Bill

[longassname]

I could probably do a crate engine for the same price as Subaru.



How much would you charge to do this rebuild on my motor??

There would be small changes to the specs from the sounds of it, as I'm keeping this vehicle N/A, but would like to know what you'd charge to build out a motor, given the motor is sent to you, along with a OE gasket set (I work in a parts dept. at a Subaru dealership).

Cams, pistons, rods, bearings, whatever you specified for your motor...

[crazyhorse]

I could probably do a crate engine for the same price as Subaru.

And very likely MUCH higher quality!

[cdigerlando]

Nice job! Thanks for documenting everything. It's a lot of work and makes it that much more difficult when you are taking pics the whole time. Let us know when you get it up and running for the break in. I'd love to here how everything goes.

[longassname]

She's up and running and boy does she run.

I finished the install late saturday. On first start up the lash adjusters were loud and did't pump up while warming up idling at 540 rpms. I gave her a quick test drive and got on it pretty good which did the trick for pumping up the lash adjusters. Once the lash adjusters pumped up the idle deteriorated at 540 rpms so I turned on the ac (which raises the idle to 750-800 rpms) and it idled very nicely. With the ac on it idles nicely at a consistent 775 rpms. I'll need to adjust the base idle to 750-775 rpms--pretty darn good for these size cams. I haven't bothered with it yet since this is fl and while you may be cold I have my ac on. :)

Speeking of the size cams, I installed an ecutune 3.545 trans behind the engine. I'm loving the combination; it really has long legs. I do a lot of interstate travel and it's very nice when you drop the hammer at speed and when it downshifts to 5500 rpms it takes off with loads of power coming in. I imagine with some higher compression pistons this would be a beautiful naturally aspirated set up--especially if we raise the shift points of the power mode map to speeds equivalent to 7400 rpms. I finally have a good reason to dig into the tcu. As one would expect since they are so over square these engines really like high rpms when built propperly--this is where we are going to start seeing our big power numbers.


I don't want to waste too much time playing with the timing tables when the engine isn't going to stay naturally aspirated for very long but I was able to throw in some more ignition advance for some more performance. I was also able to throw in more ignition advance than necessary to reach peak power on regular unleaded without any effect (yes I'm running regular unleaded, I'm driving around naturally aspirated with 8.5 cr why not take advantage of it). It seems very forgiving and pretty much happy with whatever you give it.

I'll see if I can hook up the old soundblaster microphone to my laptop and record a sound clip so you all can hear it....it's sweeeeeeeeeeeet



Nice job! Thanks for documenting everything. It's a lot of work and makes it that much more difficult when you are taking pics the whole time. Let us know when you get it up and running for the break in. I'd love to here how everything goes.

[longassname]

ah yes...
I knew I had the technology..even if it is 20 years old...the trusty soundblaster microphone from the closet


http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/withac.wma
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/540rpm.wma

[SVXRide]

Michael,
Sounds like you've got a little "roll" to the idle (probably the ECU still "learning"). What exhaust system do you have hooked up to the engine? Any pics of the engine in the car? By "throw in more ignition advance" do you mean you've deviated from the timing map in the 1v5/2v7 chips?
Thanks.
-Bill

[Boxersix]

Soundblaster, haha...you sound old like me :)

LAN, what springs valve train springs/retainers are you guys using to bump the rev limits above 6500(subaru engine model)? I'd love to squeeze another 1K out of this beast on my kit car and use the gearing that my transmission has. 7500 rpm would put me right around 200mph with the 355 18's in the back given the right power ;)

Oh and clean build. Been a long time since I've seen someone build a motor as clean as I do. Too bad you weren't a bit closer otherwise I'd have you stop by the machine shop and build some Porsche 3.6's with me :) Also have a Porsche 908 3.0 flat 8 coming in for a rebuild.

[cdigerlando]

ah yes...
I knew I had the technology..even if it is 20 years old...the trusty soundblaster microphone from the closet


http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/withac.wma
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/540rpm.wma

Thats great. How does it sound up top?

[longassname]

Our bearings just look so much alike you couldn't help but jump into subaru h6's? :)

I retain the factory retainers and outer springs and replace the inner springs with a custom one. That's with the longer custom forged valves I have made for this particular camshaft set up. The valves increase the seat height and lift before coil bind.

I didn't talk about the details of the valvetrain in this thread because I posted all the specs in my performance camshaft thread. The profiles I'm using are basically awesome and depending upon the needs of your build you can run the full set up I used which is currently listed on the ecutune website, or the 264 duration exhaust cams with stock intake cams, or 256 intake and 256 exhaust cams. As you would probably guess the 256i/256e set would be your best naturally aspirated street performers and the 264 exhaust only would be your best bet for a cheap build that doesn't fall on it's face after 5400 rpms.

Soundblaster, haha...you sound old like me :)

LAN, what springs valve train springs/retainers are you guys using to bump the rev limits above 6500(subaru engine model)? I'd love to squeeze another 1K out of this beast on my kit car and use the gearing that my transmission has. 7500 rpm would put me right around 200mph with the 355 18's in the back given the right power ;)

Oh and clean build. Been a long time since I've seen someone build a motor as clean as I do. Too bad you weren't a bit closer otherwise I'd have you stop by the machine shop and build some Porsche 3.6's with me :) Also have a Porsche 908 3.0 flat 8 coming in for a rebuild.

[longassname]

Same old exhaust system still. 2.25" dual with an x pipe and pair of dynomax superturbo mufflers--I really don't like the xpipe--it needs a crossflow muffler there(which i have but still haven't installed).

By throw in more advance I mean deviated from 2v7. Nothing to be taken seriously--this isn't really an engine set up to be run naturally aspirated so there's no reason to tune it for that...I just wanted to check and see.

I suppose I can take a picture of the engine in the car tomorrow. You won't see anything special--just my engine in my car.

Michael,
Sounds like you've got a little "roll" to the idle (probably the ECU still "learning"). What exhaust system do you have hooked up to the engine? Any pics of the engine in the car? By "throw in more ignition advance" do you mean you've deviated from the timing map in the 1v5/2v7 chips?
Thanks.
-Bill

[longassname]

what do you mean?


Thats great. How does it sound up top?

[Boxersix]

Actually the $600 price tag vs $18,000 for a 3.6 turbo was the breaking factor in going to the suby side of H6 wonder.

Your camshafts are on a laundry list of internals to get from you. I'll combine those with some work on the Rottler and the heads should be good to go.


Our bearings just look so much alike you couldn't help but jump into subaru h6's? :)

I retain the factory retainers and outer springs and replace the inner springs with a custom one. That's with the longer custom forged valves I have made for this particular camshaft set up. The valves increase the seat height and lift before coil bind.

I didn't talk about the details of the valvetrain in this thread because I posted all the specs in my performance camshaft thread. The profiles I'm using are basically awesome and depending upon the needs of your build you can run the full set up I used which is currently listed on the ecutune website, or the 264 duration exhaust cams with stock intake cams, or 256 intake and 256 exhaust cams. As you would probably guess the 256i/256e set would be your best naturally aspirated street performers and the 264 exhaust only would be your best bet for a cheap build that doesn't fall on it's face after 5400 rpms.

[longassname]

If you have a vertical machining center do a step deck; I'm very happy with mine.


Actually the $600 price tag vs $18,000 for a 3.6 turbo was the breaking factor in going to the suby side of H6 wonder.

Your camshafts are on a laundry list of internals to get from you. I'll combine those with some work on the Rottler and the heads should be good to go.

[Boxersix]

If you have a vertical machining center do a step deck; I'm very happy with mine.

Oh yes, 16,000 sq ft of machine facility :)

How much did you knock off the outer ridge on your particular case halves? ~.0015 is about the norm for most engines getting that treatment. I'm not looking for much power here. 450-500RWHP in a 2000lb car will be more than adequate! But anything to help seal those center cylinders is an added bonus.

[longassname]

yep, 15 tens

[cdigerlando]

what do you mean?

Higher RPM loaded and running. I always liked the sound of our engine N/A when it is running in its power band.

[SVXRide]

I suppose I can take a picture of the engine in the car tomorrow. You won't see anything special--just my engine in my car.

just the "bow around the present" after seeing all the pics of the build;)
-Bill

[longassname]

What are you doing Sunday? I'm thinking of going to sunday runday at Bradenton.



Higher RPM loaded and running. I always liked the sound of our engine N/A when it is running in its power band.

[cdigerlando]

What are you doing Sunday? I'm thinking of going to sunday runday at Bradenton.

Crap. I'm very busy this weekend. Keep me posted though I would be very interested in doing that some time. I live just north of Orlando so it wouldn't be a long drive for me.

I have a question for you that is slightly off topic. You mentioned having some special plans for this motor. I was thinking intercooled turbo. Are you planning on keeping the iris system for that?

I was thinking of running the iris system like you are during break in, but then jamming open the iris valve to see if there are any noticable changes in idle or power. It might be interesting to see what the difference would be on a dyno. I doubt it is going to be significant for a FI application. I noticed you didn't have one installed for your supercharger kit.

[cdigerlando]

Have you considered dyno tuning your mods "as is" when you are done breaking in the motor? It would be interesting to see. It would also be interesting to see what power improvements you see with your valve train/cam improvements and the stock bottom end.

[longassname]

ok, here's your bow

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/DSC_5521.jpg


just the "bow around the present" after seeing all the pics of the build;)
-Bill

[longassname]

I'll be doing that with the engine I build for my pearlie. It's getting the 9.3 compression ratio pistons and 256 duration cams for both intake and exhaust.


Have you considered dyno tuning your mods "as is" when you are done breaking in the motor? It would be interesting to see. It would also be interesting to see what power improvements you see with your valve train/cam improvements and the stock bottom end.

[SVXRide]

[QUOTE=longassname;520238]ok, here's your bow

/QUOTE]


Michael,
Nice! Looks like you've got the same fuel pressure gauge set up that I do:cool:
What's with what looks like 14 ga wires running around between the Alt and the PS pump?
-Bill

[longassname]

My alternator wiring went bad some time ago and I replaced it.





ok, here's your bow




Michael,
Nice! Looks like you've got the same fuel pressure gauge set up that I do:cool:
What's with what looks like 14 ga wires running around between the Alt and the PS pump?
-Bill

[Phast SVX]

Vroom Vroom time. Congrats. Have you fired it?

[longassname]

lol, you're a couple pages behind


Vroom Vroom time. Congrats. Have you fired it?

[cdigerlando]

What are you doing Sunday? I'm thinking of going to sunday runday at Bradenton.

Are you running the SVX? Are you going to share your times with us:) Didn't you say you are using the stock gear ratio?

[longassname]

I don't quite understand the line of questioning so I'm not sure what you are thinking but... yes, yes, and yes. I'll probably get out there this weekend.


Are you running the SVX? Are you going to share your times with us:) Didn't you say you are using the stock gear ratio?

[SVXRide]

I don't quite understand the line of questioning so I'm not sure what you are thinking but... yes, yes, and yes. I'll probably get out there this weekend.

I think Chuck is just getting antsy in anticipation of serious power being laid down;):D
-Bill

[longassname]

Once I adjust the shift maps the car will likely be pretty fast in the quarter mile even in it's current naturally aspirated state...the question is go ahead and have some fun racing or spend the weekend getting set up to adjust the shift maps.


I think Chuck is just getting antsy in anticipation of serious power being laid down;):D
-Bill

[SVXRide]

Once I adjust the shift maps the car will likely be pretty fast in the quarter mile even in it's current naturally aspirated state...the question is go ahead and have some fun racing or spend the weekend getting set up to adjust the shift maps.

I'm willing to wait on the power numbers if it means you'll have software available to tweak the TCU;):cool:
-Bill

[longassname]

ooooooh you thought the question was what you want me to do this weekend..........

actually it was...what do I want me to do this weekend ;)




I'm willing to wait on the power numbers if it means you'll have software available to tweak the TCU;):cool:
-Bill

[longassname]

I adjusted the ECU software to set the slow idle up to 800 rpms so now the car idles nicely even without the ac turned on. :)

[SVXMAN2001]

Lan, so is this going to be offered in a new ecutune software version? - the higher idle that is...

[SVXRide]

I adjusted the ECU software to set the slow idle up to 800 rpms so now the car idles nicely even without the ac turned on. :)

Yeah, but what about the TCU?:rolleyes::lol::lol:
-Bill

[longassname]

Yes I will make a new version specific to match the cams.


Lan, so is this going to be offered in a new ecutune software version? - the higher idle that is...

[superru]

Mike, what do you expect for HP numbers, when your all done with this motor?
such a bad ass project!:cool:

[longassname]

As you probably know, this engine is built for forced induction--the details of which have not been released yet and as such the hp estimates will not be released either. You will hear after the fact--not before.

There has been some dynoing on the cams done by others that I have seen and the powerband looks AWESOME--the best I've ever seen quite frankly. My engine in particular is showing all the signs of being ready to put out big #'s. I will go ahead and start doing some 1/4 mile racing after i change the shift points in the tcu software and I'll share those times. I won't be doing any dynoing until after the car goes forced induction.


Mike, what do you expect for HP numbers, when your all done with this motor?
such a bad ass project!:cool:

[Dessertrunner]

Mike when you built the new engine did you replace the cam, crank & timing sensors with new ones?

[Mission]

Up to the top

[longassname]

I did not replace the cam and crank angle sensors. I did replace the wiring harness to them. I replaced the temp sensors, the knock sensors, and the coils.




Mike when you built the new engine did you replace the cam, crank & timing sensors with new ones?

[longassname]

I just thought I'd through this out there so it's in the back of people's minds as they run into cars at rediculously low prices(I never see these deals cause I'm almost the only person in fl with an svx).

I know there are some people who would like to have a real performance engine built by none other than myself. I might be inclined to do such a build in exchange for a clean bordeaux pearl svx. If it's a low miles, low wear show queen I would even throw in a transmission build.

[sicksubie]

come to reading and win the reading car

[longassname]

is it a bordeaux show queen? Let's not forget I am 10X pickier than the next guy. When i say bordeaux I mean bordeax and when I say show queen I mean perfectly clean in and out...none of that oh it's only "surface rust" stuff or oh there is only rust on the suspension parts without undercoating.



come to reading and win the reading car

[94SubieSVX]

I believe the raffle car is a '92 Claret

[longassname]

ya i went and looked at the thread after sicksubie mentioned it. That's a long long way from a bordeaux show queen. Not my style.

[sicksubie]

Come to reading anyway....

[longassname]

I'm going to try.

[longassname]

Had the first oil change today. I'm at 1300 miles. I had used mobil 1 0w40 for the first fill. We inspected both the oil out of the pan and the filter and it was all very clean. I used another napa gold filter but switched to royal purple 10w40. With the 0w40 the lash adjusters were a little noisy at start up.

[cdigerlando]

Mike:

With the new cams, did you have to run any elevated rpms for a particular duration to get your hydraulic lash adjusters to reset properly?

Thanks

Chuck D.

P.S. How's the knee?

[longassname]

Well you will remember I had discharged my lash adjusters. They eat a lot of oil when pumping up and won't pump up fully at idle. You have to get the rpms up to get them to pump up fully. So on first start up expect to add a lot of oil. I had to add a lot of oil at first start up but and not a drop since.


Mike:

With the new cams, did you have to run any elevated rpms for a particular duration to get your hydraulic lash adjusters to reset properly?

Thanks

Chuck D.

P.S. How's the knee?

[longassname]

I guess I had also better remind people while I am talking about running 40 wt oil not to run 40 wt oil in their stock engine. The factory oil clearances will not be tollerant of 40 wt oil.

[longassname]

oh sorry, didn't mean to ignore that last part....

the knee is a little better every day, thanks.

[cdigerlando]

Thanks. Good to hear the knee is getting better. I guess you still have to have surgery though

[longassname]

yes, but the better it gets before the surgery the better the physical therapy will go after the surgery.


Thanks. Good to hear the knee is getting better. I guess you still have to have surgery though

[cdigerlando]

Bumping this thread so it shows up within 30 days. This should be a sticky.

[Johnybeas]

Hey Mike it's been a longasstime... lol since I have read on this thread, I'm too far behind to read it with the patience I have right now, so I just have a few questions. I noticed you no longer offer the separate parts on your site(cams, rods, low compression pistons etc) are you still selling them??

I'm looking to do a build on mine with the 7:1 ratio to use the gt4088R with the help of Big Valley Performance, can I still get the pistons at least from ya??? What all should I get and what do you recommend for clearances and how big of a bore etc.

[longassname]

I'm not selling the parts anymore but I am selling complete longblocks. You can't trust a machine shop to get the crank right and it takes a few thousand dollars in precision measurement tools to check it. I have a wider selection of cams now and a wider selection of pistons allowing me to build 108 different configurations to suit pretty much any applicaiton. The price is the same no matter which options you choose--$6500.



Hey Mike it's been a longasstime... lol since I have read on this thread, I'm too far behind to read it with the patience I have right now, so I just have a few questions. I noticed you no longer offer the separate parts on your site(cams, rods, low compression pistons etc) are you still selling them??

I'm looking to do a build on mine with the 7:1 ratio to use the gt4088R with the help of Big Valley Performance, can I still get the pistons at least from ya??? What all should I get and what do you recommend for clearances and how big of a bore etc.

[Johnybeas]

My alternator wiring went bad some time ago and I replaced it.

how much did the wiring cost, I need to do this. Can you just replace the harness???

[Johnybeas]

I'm not selling the parts anymore but I am selling complete longblocks. You can't trust a machine shop to get the crank right and it takes a few thousand dollars in precision measurement tools to check it. I have a wider selection of cams now and a wider selection of pistons allowing me to build 108 different configurations to suit pretty much any applicaiton. The price is the same no matter which options you choose--$6500.

Gar.... that sucks cause I was gonna have big valley performance build mine for me.... I need the parts though....

[longassname]

This short block is for sale now. The specs and pictures of the build are of course in this thread: pages 1 through 4.

The high lights are:
Ballanced past 12,000 rpms
Coated ECUtune high silicon aluminum main bearings
Coated ECUtune high silicon aluminum rod bearings
Perfect oil clearances with tolerances 20x more precies than OE
Eagle H-beam rods with arp 2000 rod bolts
8.5 compression forged pistons with thermal barrier top coating and anti scuff sidewall coating, tool steel pins, and stainless rings
.0015" step deck

In short the most awesome short block you could build for forced induction, fully documented, fully proven, and broken in with about 3,000 miles and a 7800 rpm red line. $2,900

http://www.ecutune.com/posts/eg33_assembly/P1020021.jpg