View Full Version : Performance transmission build
longassname
02-10-2007, 04:35 PM
Ok, time to prove the rumors right and start unveiling the performance 4eat build. I've been working on the ultimate 4eat rebuild for the svx. There's a lot involved in this so documenting and illustrating what I'm doing is difficult. Expect the thread and organization of pictures to be sloppy. There will be a a huge # of pictures posted; even still a lot won't be in pictures because no one was around to take a picture while I had my hands in that particular part.
The original plan was put together the ultimate rebuild kit consisting of the parts I am using to build the transmission for the sub 10 second car I'm putting together. It turned out more practical to offer the compete built transmissions (and I came back and edited this line to say that). The build is a job and a half and I found several critical points of failures that most transmission shops will probably just ignore even given the correct parts. I'll try to point them out as they pop up in pictures.
The build parts start with a complete set of super quality seals and gaskets. Most of these seals are from the same manufacturer as OEM but there are also some that are improved to prevent the leaks that create the pressure drops that are partly responsible for clutch pack burn outs and planetary over heating.
On to that are added parts to modify the fluid pressures of the various circuits. These are mostly springs and plungers in the valve body and accumulators but we also modify some fluid paths. What we are doing here is increasing the apply pressures on the clutch packs to increase their holding power, increasing the fluid flow to the planetary to improve lubrication, and modifying some shift pressures to quicken shifts.
The next major group of parts are the friction sets. Here we are replacing the frictions with graphite frictions which both last longer under daily driving conditions and have a higher friction coefficient under higher power levels. We use some special retaining plates to let us fit in more clutches for even higher power levels.
This is most of the parts originally planned to be used in the kit. Some more have been added during the course of the project. On the transmissions that I'm building I also replace the solenoids and torque converter.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/DSC_3910.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 04:42 PM
Here are some photos of the valve body removal.
pan off
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbremoval/DSC_3782.jpg
bolts reatining valve body off
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbremoval/DSC_3799.jpg
valve body pulled up and flipped over
here you can see the accumulators in the transmission body..more on them later
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbremoval/DSC_3796.jpg
valve body removed
now you can see the planetary set..on it later
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbremoval/DSC_3816.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 04:49 PM
With the valve body removed we clean the parts with kerosene and make the modifications to it modify the line pressure and various circuit pressures. Most of the modifications involve replacing the springs on the plungers which maintain the pressure for their particular circuit. We also replace a couple plungers and enlarge a fluid path in the plate between the upper and lower valve body halves and block off another.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3920.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3922.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3923.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3924.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3926.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3927.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 04:51 PM
continued....
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3929.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3934.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3938.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3940.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3945.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3953.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/vbmod/DSC_3959.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 05:01 PM
Here are some sparse pictures of dissassembling the transmission.
gear case with extension housing and differential case removed
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3961.jpg
Staked nut on drive gear on back end of pinion.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3964.jpg
drive gear being pulled off pinion
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3966.jpg
pinion unbolted from pump and being pulled out of case
note the tube around the input shaft..this tube has bonded rubber seals on each side and is a special order part most rebuilders don't replace...that's the cause of contamination between the gear oil and atf. It should always be replaced.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3968.jpg
pump being pulled off of gear case
note the lathe cut seals on the pump..they shrink and are another point of failure..these are replaced with better versions
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3969.jpg
gear case with planetary removed and the accumulator for the band apply in my hands
note the seals on the band apply accumulator..another point of failure..they wear and cause poor apply pressure and brake band burn out
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/dissassembly/DSC_3970.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 05:17 PM
I'll have a lot more planetary pictures soon. For now I just have some of the forward clutch drum to illustrate how they work and why most transmission rebuilds done on the 4eat skip right by a couple importan points of failure.
the forward clutch drum houses both the forward clutch and over running clutch.
Each is a stack of frictions, alternating steel plates and friction plates, plus dish plates, retaining plates, circlips, and pistons which under hydraulic pressure engage the clutches. The friction sets are easy enough remove and are what the transmission shops usually remove and replace in a rebuild. The pistons are more difficult to remove only because you have to either have the special tools from the factory or just the right set up to be able to press the spring loaded pistons in order to remove and install the circlips that retain them. The truth is you can pretty much count on your average transmission shop skipping right past this step and there are several piston seals in this trans that are prone to failure. We of course replace those seals with improved seals.
empty forward clutch drum in the press to remove the circlip retaining the forward and overrunning clutch pistons.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/forward/DSC_3983.jpg
forward and over running clutch pistons removed and with new seals installed
note each piston has seals on both it's inner and outer
seals and grooves are covered with trans gel
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/forward/DSC_3987.jpg
forward clutch drum reassembled with new improved friction sets installed.
graphite frictions are used for both the over running clutch and forward clutch
A special retaining plate is used and the # of frictions for the forward clutch are increased.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/forward/DSC_3988.jpg
longassname
02-10-2007, 05:23 PM
each clutch pack in the planetary is done much the same as the forward clutch pack. I'll post pictures of each as the planetary goes back in soon.
The low reverse clutch set mounts in the transmission and has a couple points of failure in it. I'll post pictures on that soon too.
The transfer clutch is a little different and has a point of failure that not only takes out the transfer clutch but clogs up other fluid paths and takes out the whole trans. Another of those special order parts that no one ever has on hand or bothers with. I'll post pictures on that soon too.
we make some modifications to the shift accumulators. I'll post pictures on that soon too.
that's it for now
longassname
02-10-2007, 06:34 PM
I've asked a few customers what they think and I think what I'm going to do is offer the two toms the option of getting either complete transmissions for them to install or rebuild kits and give the general public only the option of getting the complete transmissions.
Everyone seems aggreed that the local transmission shop can't be trusted to put in the huge amounts of time required to do it right.
longassname
02-10-2007, 06:40 PM
another thought I just had was that it would probably work well for people to order the complete transmissions from me and have me ship them to the two toms so that they can put the transmissions on credit card and I assume pay whichever tom cash for the install
longassname
02-10-2007, 06:43 PM
speeking of installation. A dedicated transmission cooler with it's own fan and 180 degree thermostat should be installed in the drivers fender. The radiator cooler should be bypassed.
Tiamat-red
02-10-2007, 07:34 PM
Finally!
Someone we know is working on the auto. Instead of just saying "just get a manual".
I emailed Level-10 with questions several times and they never even bothered to email me back.
Awesome job!
Crazy_pilot
02-11-2007, 03:04 AM
.... the sub 10 second car I'm putting together...
This is the part that makes me all happy. A 10 second 4EAT SVX? Sweeeeeet.
SSSVX
02-11-2007, 09:39 PM
Cool, lot of technical pictures.
Are you going to improve the gear ratios and the differential too?
If you want to buy an used SVX stock ratio tranny, let me know. I have one sitting in the storage. The front differential was bad but the tranny itself was still shifting fine, was told it was rebuilt 20k before I bought the car. But I replaced 4.44 tranny on my yellow.
svxstarship
02-11-2007, 10:02 PM
Wow. Can't wait to hear about the results. Might want to enlarge the casting slightly where the brake band outside bolt is. That way a gear wrench will fit on the 17mm bolt and make adjustments easier. The wall of my gear wrench was to thick and the casting was in the way.
SVXRide
02-12-2007, 07:59 AM
Michael,
Nice! I like the idea of the two Toms doing the build-up/install. Shipping transmissions around is going to add cost that may put the mod out of the reach of many.
10 second SVX? Gonna have to take some weight out of that bad boy first!;) :cool:
-Bill
TomsSVX
02-12-2007, 10:48 AM
I have a couple transmissions here. One I know lost 3rd and 4th. The other was completely fine(looking at the friction materials and steels). If someone is in the area looking for a rebuilt trans... I have no problem building it LAN's new kit. Him and I have been speaking about this for a little while now and I am glad it is finally out in the open;)
Tom
longassname
02-12-2007, 03:01 PM
I got in the transfer clutch piston retaining plates. These are one of the points of failures common on the 4eat that usually aren't propperly dealt with. A retaining plate is the thing that holds the springs that dissengage the piston from a clutch pack. They usually don't have seals on them and are never included in seal or overhaul sets but in the 4eat the transfer clutch retaining plate does have seals. They have a bonded rubber seal with a large lip seal that goes bad and turns into a crunchy, blobby, cloggy mess especially suited for clogging fluid paths.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/DSC_3994.jpg
Trevor
02-12-2007, 03:52 PM
I have been continually frustrated since joining the network, due to never ending complaints regarding transmissions, without any proper diagnosis of reasons why, and fully detailed answers. Much of the evidence presented has pointed towards inferior overhaul procedures.
At long, long last, there is someone logically tackling the issue on a proper basis.
CONGRATULATIONS TO ALL THOSE INVOLVED.
SomethingElse
02-12-2007, 04:51 PM
do you need any special tools besides the common hand tools? when will the kit be on the market?
longassname
02-12-2007, 06:50 PM
The build does require a well equipped shop but that's neither here nor there since I'm not going to be selling kits to the general public. I'll be selling the fully built transmissions. I'll have a couple available in a few weeks.
do you need any special tools besides the common hand tools? when will the kit be on the market?
longassname
02-12-2007, 06:58 PM
Eh, you're imagining freight at the rates you get quoted though. Freight would be at the rates I get.
I don't imagine the built transmission will be put in as a mod by those who don't have money either. They will be bought by those with the money to put together nice cars and those who may not have money but have blown transmissions in which case they may really need to put the major expense on a credit card.
Don't forget, while you live next to the two Toms not everyone here does.
Michael,
Nice! I like the idea of the two Toms doing the build-up/install. Shipping transmissions around is going to add cost that may put the mod out of the reach of many.
10 second SVX? Gonna have to take some weight out of that bad boy first!;) :cool:
-Bill
longassname
02-12-2007, 07:10 PM
oh and Bill, I didn't say 10 second...I said sub 10 second.
TomsSVX
02-12-2007, 07:21 PM
Mike, will you be building the valve bodies as part of the kit or will you just include the parts for me to do it??
Tom
longassname
02-12-2007, 07:24 PM
That's a pretty good idea actually. The valve body build is a pita and would probably test your patience beyond its limits. I think I will do that; I'll build the valve bodies and send them off with the rest of the parts to you.
Mike, will you be building the valve bodies as part of the kit or will you just include the parts for me to do it??
Tom
TomsSVX
02-12-2007, 07:25 PM
You want me to send the cores to you?? I have 2 that I can grab off hand and other 1 in Jersey
Tom
longassname
02-12-2007, 07:30 PM
Sure, no rush though. I have a lot on my plate.
You want me to send the cores to you?? I have 2 that I can grab off hand and other 1 in Jersey
Tom
TomsSVX
02-12-2007, 07:40 PM
no problem, I will wait until I have them all together.
Tom
longassname
02-17-2007, 12:49 PM
I'm going to have 1 transmission with 3.9 gears rebuilt soon and one with the stock 3.545 gears. That 3.9 is probably going to be the only 3.9 I'm going to have available so who ever wants it should probably go ahead and reserve their place in line for it. After it's gone I expect to be keeping two 3.545's in stock.
I have a matching 3.9 r160 lsd rear. Of course this trans also matches up with the 3.9 r180 lsd rear used in most year STI's.
SVXRide
02-17-2007, 01:59 PM
oh and Bill, I didn't say 10 second...I said sub 10 second.
Cool! To quote "old Tom"...."my license plate reads "BLK 361";) :D
-Bill (where's that e.t. calculator when you need it....500hp@crank + 2600lb. SVX = 10 flat in the 1/4....theoretically....)
longassname
02-17-2007, 02:29 PM
lol, like et calculators ever even come close for us. anyway, the sub 10 second car will not be in the 500hp range. It will breathing alcohol at very high manifold pressures.
Cool! To quote "old Tom"...."my license plate reads "BLK 361";) :D
-Bill (where's that e.t. calculator when you need it....500hp@crank + 2600lb. SVX = ???)
SVXRide
02-17-2007, 03:17 PM
lol, like et calculators ever even come close for us. anyway, the sub 10 second car will not be in the 500hp range. It will breathing alcohol at very high manifold pressures.
Oh, boy!! Can I be the first to request video clips?:cool: :cool:
-Bill
Tiamat-red
02-17-2007, 07:13 PM
Oh, boy!! Can I be the first to request video clips?:cool: :cool:
-Bill
Can I be the first to request a test drive? :D :D
RojoRocket
02-18-2007, 07:18 AM
Michael and Tom,
Before I start savings my nickels and dimes and get in line for one of your miracle trannies a question or two please. As one of your "other" potential consumer group I wouldn't want to experience jarring shifts unless provoked. Do your mods drastically change the "character" of the box ,floabt?:cool: And, will it, with proper cooling, be a "final solution" for those of us bound to our cars for life? Please, say no.....and yes!! :D
Glenn
SVXMAN2001
02-18-2007, 12:06 PM
any idea on cost? for the rebuild kits and/or the complete transmissions?
longassname
02-18-2007, 03:31 PM
There won't be rebuild kits. There are complete built transmissions. You can get them directly from me or either of the two Toms. If you get them from me the from me then the entire transmission will have been built by me. If you get them from either of the two Toms then the valve body will have been built by me and the rest of the transmission built with my parts by the Tom you are buying it from. In any case, the complete built transmission is $2,700.
any idea on cost? for the rebuild kits and/or the complete transmissions?
longassname
02-18-2007, 03:44 PM
I guess these questions are propperly addressed to me since I'm the one who developed the build.
You can expect these transmissions to last extremely well. The frictions used withstand wear under daily driving conditions better than the oem frictions do. Then build replaces all of the seals so you are starting like you're at day 1 not year 15 and the seals which are prone to failure aren't just being replaced but replaced with better ones. Put together with the circuit pressure modifications which increase the holding power of the clutches so that they see less slippage and wear we should expect these transmissions to hold up a very long time.
I would characterize the shift as fast not jarring. We certainly aren't going for jarring.
Michael and Tom,
Before I start savings my nickels and dimes and get in line for one of your miracle trannies a question or two please. As one of your "other" potential consumer group I wouldn't want to experience jarring shifts unless provoked. Do your mods drastically change the "character" of the box ,floabt?:cool: And, will it, with proper cooling, be a "final solution" for those of us bound to our cars for life? Please, say no.....and yes!! :D
Glenn
longassname
02-22-2007, 08:50 AM
Maybe get together what torque converters you can and start figuring out how to best drain them, seal them, box em up, and cheaply ship them.
You want me to send the cores to you?? I have 2 that I can grab off hand and other 1 in Jersey
Tom
ssnsltd
02-22-2007, 09:49 AM
The original plan was put together the ultimate rebuild kit c. . . I can still do that but I'm also going to offer the complete built transmissions.
There won't be rebuild kits....
I was following this thread with interest as you had previously said you would offer it as a kit. As you are apparently not going to do that, will you publish a parts list? I simply prefer to do my own work when I have the time.
Thanks,
David
longassname
02-22-2007, 09:54 AM
Nope, I've put a lot of work into developing this build and I expect to be paid for my work.
I was following this thread with interest as you had previously said you would offer it as a kit. As you are apparently not going to do that, will you publish a parts list? I simply prefer to do my own work when I have the time.
Thanks,
David
ssnsltd
02-22-2007, 10:12 AM
Thanks for the reply,
I hope you will consider offering the kit then.
thanks again,
David
AJ4U2
03-16-2007, 10:05 AM
Whatever happen to this project? Would like to hear about if anyone has install one or in the process and the results if anyone has...
Aj.
longassname
03-16-2007, 10:10 AM
I'm going to go finish the first one in just a few minutes; I'll have mor photos going up tonight. I was planning on getting it in my pearly this week but as usual have gotten sidetracked and didn't get as much done as planned.
I am on it. The built transmissions will be available soon.
Whatever happen to this project? Would like to hear about if anyone has install one or in the process and the results if anyone has...
Aj.
longassname
03-18-2007, 01:16 AM
Ok, this is going to be like the cliff's notes or chiltons manual photo coverage of the rest of the transmission build. I didn't take pictures of redoing all the seals and installing all the pistons for each clutch pack. Or packing each clutch pack. Even just showing putting in the assemblies I've already assembled turns out to be a loooooot of photos. There's a lot that goes into this build.
For now I'm just going to post pictures. I'll come back later and edit in some explanation of what you are looking at in each photo.
longassname
03-18-2007, 01:21 AM
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4002.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4005.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4012.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4013.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4014.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4018.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4022.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4025.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4031.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4034.jpg
longassname
03-18-2007, 01:23 AM
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4036.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4039.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4042.jpg
cam removed from front pump for seal and friction ring replacement
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4046.jpg
modified control arm installed into pump housing
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4050.jpg
vane pump reassembled
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4051.jpg
seals being driven out of pinion seal retainer
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4060.jpg
new seals pressed into pinion seal retainer
new o-ring on pinion seal retainer
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4061.jpg
front pump reassmbled
new lathe cut seals installed
pinion seal retainer installed
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4066.jpg
new metal type front pump gasket installed
ready for front pump installation
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4071.jpg
longassname
03-18-2007, 01:24 AM
rebuilt front pump installed
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4072.jpg
new seal installed into diff case
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4078.jpg
old axle seal being driven out of diff caps
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4080.jpg
seals and orings replaced on diff caps and reinstalled with prior lash
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4085.jpg
diff flange prepped
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4089.jpg
new converter tube seal installed
sealant applied to diff flange
ready to be installed to transmission case
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4098.jpg
differential mated to transmission
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4104.jpg
manual lever installed
parking prawl shaft installed
accumulator springs installed
1/2 accumulator spring replaced with double spring
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4107.jpg
built valve body installed
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4109.jpg
transfer clutch solenoid valve assembly removed
passages and filter cleaned
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4112.jpg
longassname
03-18-2007, 01:26 AM
transfer clutch piston re-installed with new seals
transfer clutch piston retainer replaced
notice the bonded seal on the outsie of the retainer (brown)which seals on the inside of the piston (silver)
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4116.jpg
new lathe cut seals on output shaft--the fluid which opperates the transfer clutch flows through a hole in the shaft between those seals
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4120.jpg
new transfer clutch pack installed
new transfer clutch solenoid valve installed
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4121.jpg
through bolted drive gear pressed onto shaft
new lathe cut seals installed
(through bolted drive gear is sold seperately)
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4124.jpg
transmisison with driven and drive gears installed
new extension housing gasket
ready for extension housing to be bolted on
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4126.jpg
completed built transmission ready for new filter and pan to be installed
ready for massive power
ready for extended miles
ready for improved fuel economy
ready for more power to the wheels instead of heat to the fluid
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/assembly/DSC_4129.jpg
The transmission to me at first looked massive, then I realized that it had the front diff housing on it too :eek:
Phast SVX
03-19-2007, 08:47 PM
thats one bad ass trans....for once i wish i had an auto :eek: :cool:
I've been following the thread with interest because when the tranny goes I want to replace with your prgraded tranny. I have 155,746 miles on the original tranny so I've been concerned as to when it will quit. When the tranny needs to be replaced does it all go dead at one time or do you start losing one gear or another until all gears go? I don't have the money to spend on replacing the tranny just because it will go bad at sometime in the future. Too many other projects and expenses. But I'd like to be prepared when it does go, if I have some warning and can arrange with one of the Tom's to do the installation. The car's a daily driver and can't sit for months waiting for a part. How many do you plan on keeping in stock and what kind of turn around time are you planning for shipping the tranny. Too bad your only doing one 3.90.
longassname
03-20-2007, 07:50 PM
I'm going to keep one in stock as soon as I get caught up. If you want the 3.9 I can build it for you.
The style in which your tranny will go out can vary widely. It all depends on what burns out or clogs up worst first.
I've been following the thread with interest because when the tranny goes I want to replace with your prgraded tranny. I have 155,746 miles on the original tranny so I've been concerned as to when it will quit. When the tranny needs to be replaced does it all go dead at one time or do you start losing one gear or another until all gears go? I don't have the money to spend on replacing the tranny just because it will go bad at sometime in the future. Too many other projects and expenses. But I'd like to be prepared when it does go, if I have some warning and can arrange with one of the Tom's to do the installation. The car's a daily driver and can't sit for months waiting for a part. How many do you plan on keeping in stock and what kind of turn around time are you planning for shipping the tranny. Too bad your only doing one 3.90.
definetly interested when the time comes. I was hoping that the tranny would only lose a gear as a signal that it needed to be replaced that way I could drive it to one of the Toms, rather than a tow which would cost alot.
TomsSVX
03-21-2007, 11:47 AM
where in NY are you... I may even be able to come pick up the car when the time comes
Tom
fasdude
03-21-2007, 12:31 PM
What's the advantage of the 3.9 or 4.44 over the 3.5XX that came from the factory? Won't the computer get confused with the different gearing?
Your work looks promising. I'd almost like to negociate a rock bottom price with someone selling an SVX with a bad tranny so that I could install this one and not have to worry about being stranded.
TomsSVX
03-21-2007, 12:45 PM
well as long as it is summer, I can loan you my green '92 to drive around while your's is getting the trans installed (shouldn't take more than a day if Mike is shipping a whole transmission to me) Unless you really want another SVX
tom
SVXRide
03-21-2007, 01:51 PM
What's the advantage of the 3.9 or 4.44 over the 3.5XX that came from the factory? Won't the computer get confused with the different gearing?
Your work looks promising. I'd almost like to negociate a rock bottom price with someone selling an SVX with a bad tranny so that I could install this one and not have to worry about being stranded.
better acceleration...no, the TCU won't get confused.
-Bill
longassname
03-21-2007, 02:50 PM
I got the 3.9 transmssion to match up with an r180 rear end out of an 02-05 sti. The SVX uses an r160 rear end which seems plenty stout enough for a stock SVX but I got this for a supercharged car. In 06 the sti went to the 3.545 gear ratio the SVX uses so now I will be using an 07 sti rear end in my car and going back to 3.545 gears.
I prefer the 3.545 gear ratio. There are those who prefer higher gear ratios though. The higher the gear ratio the faster you will go through your gears, the more your transmission will be shifting, and the higher the rpm your cruise speed will be at.
I hope that answers your question to your satisfaction. and now I would like to ask that all the prosayers and naysayers not jump in and give their opinions on gear ratios. There are plenty of threads on this network filled with gear ratio oppinions. This thread is on our performance transmission build. We can perform the same build on a 3.545, 3.9, 4.11, 4.44, and even do some mix and match and make an awd 3.7 if someone wants to pay for it--so opinions/debate on gear ratios really have nothing to do with our build or this thread
What's the advantage of the 3.9 or 4.44 over the 3.5XX that came from the factory? Won't the computer get confused with the different gearing?
Your work looks promising. I'd almost like to negociate a rock bottom price with someone selling an SVX with a bad tranny so that I could install this one and not have to worry about being stranded.
Realtyem
03-26-2007, 07:12 AM
This is a great idea. :) Kudos LAN for going through all the hard work and labor to find out how to make our cars last for another many years. I'm fortunate that I don't have any tranny problems yet (previous owner took good care of my car) and from my research here, I don't think I'm going to have any problems in the future(crosses fingers):cool: . If something were to happen though, how would I go about getting one of these modern marvels into my car out here in the middle of the country? Do you know anyone who can install one out here? :confused: Just in case.
I need a vacation, but I didn't want an unplanned drive to NY to be it.:D
longassname
03-26-2007, 08:44 AM
Thanks, I don't know who the trustworthy mechanics are out there but surely there are 1 or 2? Given a complete transmission from us a good shop should be able to put it in or if you are a do it yourselfer you could put it in.
This is a great idea. :) Kudos LAN for going through all the hard work and labor to find out how to make our cars last for another many years. I'm fortunate that I don't have any tranny problems yet (previous owner took good care of my car) and from my research here, I don't think I'm going to have any problems in the future(crosses fingers):cool: . If something were to happen though, how would I go about getting one of these modern marvels into my car out here in the middle of the country? Do you know anyone who can install one out here? :confused: Just in case.
I need a vacation, but I didn't want an unplanned drive to NY to be it.:D
UPnorth362
04-12-2007, 09:29 PM
what would the cost of the trans be to come and pick it up at your shop, in miami, or tampa?
longassname
04-12-2007, 10:12 PM
$2700 Are you doing the removal and re-installation yourself? I ask because if you have the flexibility of taking it out and leaving your car sit you could drop it off and I could rebuild it instead of charging you for a core until you bring me one.
what would the cost of the trans be to come and pick it up at your shop, in miami, or tampa?
UPnorth362
04-13-2007, 08:55 PM
I can drop the trans off the first week in June. I will have some shop space then to start on my svx build. how long does it take you to complete a rebuild? Can I drop it of somewhere in Miami?
Nomad
04-19-2007, 02:37 PM
okay , maybe thats a stupid question but , performance wise ... is it beter a 6spds or the rebuild ??? :(
TomsSVX
04-19-2007, 03:29 PM
a built auto will perform better than a 6spd. due to shift time and consistancy. I chose the 6speed for more fun
tom
Nomad
04-19-2007, 03:52 PM
hummm...fun or constistancy.... wellwell ..... i'll have to think about it...:D thanx !!
RojoRocket
04-19-2007, 03:57 PM
Michael,
...instead of charging you for a core until you bring me one.
What is your core-charge btw? Need to plan ahead when dealing with 3K-miles each way. My shop in Sac was eager to see the product too! He felt it an attractively priced option to the "factory" rebuilts, without even considering the upgrades :eek: . Will you be looking to maintain a "lead-time" expectation once you have some "stock" built up? Or should I get in line now? Only a matter of time for my autobox.
Glenn
longassname
04-19-2007, 07:41 PM
I'll try to keep up with demand and always have one ready to go for whatever that is worth. We'll just have to see. There's only one of me.
Michael,
What is your core-charge btw? Need to plan ahead when dealing with 3K-miles each way. My shop in Sac was eager to see the product too! He felt it an attractively priced option to the "factory" rebuilts, without even considering the upgrades :eek: . Will you be looking to maintain a "lead-time" expectation once you have some "stock" built up? Or should I get in line now? Only a matter of time for my autobox.
Glenn
longassname
04-19-2007, 07:42 PM
plan is $700 core charge.
longassname
05-16-2007, 08:48 PM
I'm driving on the prototype built transmission in my stock svx now. It's sweeeeeet. This trans will probably take 2 seconds off your 1/4 mile time. The shifts are lightning fast and you can forget about slippage--there isn't any.
Somewhat suprisingly, the light throttle around town shifting actually feels smoother and is less noticeable than with the stock transmissions (fyi: my comparisons are to the perfectly functioning subaru factory reman I swapped out with the built trans).
I have found that with the increased line pressure I had/am having some binding during turns at barely rolling speed. As my transfer clutches are settling in that binding is going away so it's yet to be seen if I need to pop off the extension housing and adjust the transfer clutch pack on this one or not but I will increase the lash on the transfer clutch pack on the next transmission so that it operates smoothly from the get go.
I can't say enough positive things to express the "awesomeness" that is this transmisison.
TomsSVX
05-16-2007, 08:57 PM
u mean .2 seconds right?:confused:
Tom
longassname
05-16-2007, 09:01 PM
NO, definitely way more than .2 seconds. You seem to have forgotten already how slow stock svx's are. I wouldn't be suprised to see them pull high 16's. You'll definitely improve quarters by more than a second on a stock svx......An svx with nitrous, easily more than 2 seconds. Man I remember doing runs with my 150 shot and I was spending more time in the shifts than in the gears.
u mean .2 seconds right?:confused:
Tom
TomsSVX
05-16-2007, 09:06 PM
as a result of just the transmission I would doubt that they will cut times by more than a couple tenths. An mt swap with a really good driver can drop a little over a second... I would expect this build to be just behind these
Tom
longassname
05-16-2007, 09:09 PM
I don't care how good a driver you are, you can't shift any where near as fast as this trans. You also have to shift through 1 or 2 more gears. Manuals also don't launch as well. A good race ready auto will spank a manual in the 1/4 any day of the week.
Earthworm
05-23-2007, 06:36 PM
I just read through this entire thread and I'm not sure if it was covered but are you doing anything to the torque converter, front diff or AWD? I'm assuming you are bolting the AWD clutch drum to prevent it from sheering off.
longassname
05-23-2007, 06:51 PM
The bolting of the awd clutch drum to the drive gear is seperate but offered and highly recomended if the car is looking to make serious hp.
I have the tools to set up the front diff but haven't seen any need to make modifications. If someone had something in mind that they wanted done I'd consider it.
I haven't seen any need to make changes to the torque converters either. I just use a new quality OEM spec unit.
I just read through this entire thread and I'm not sure if it was covered but are you doing anything to the torque converter, front diff or AWD? I'm assuming you are bolting the AWD clutch drum to prevent it from sheering off.
longassname
06-03-2007, 10:05 AM
I redid the transfer clutch and fixed the binding at parking speed so now the transmission project is a complete success and I'm about ready to get rolling on offering them.
For those who may read this and not know what binding is I'll explain it so that you understand that running into this problem as part of our build is actually a good thing--and not totally unexpected (that's why I've been so casual about it). When you are turning the wheels need to turn at different speeds. In order for this to happen in our awd car the transfer clutch needs to allow the slippage that equates to the difference in wheel speed. If it grips too much then it doesn't allow the slippage until some forces build up and then you get a shuddering as it grips, slips, grips, slips, etc. That is what we call binding. Since we increased the fluid flow and line pressure as part of this build I knew the transfer clutch would be much less inclined to allow slippage (just like all the other clutch packs) and I would likely have to make adjustments. So the prototype transmission was built,tested, and the adjustments have been made; this build is now the single best thing I've ever done for the SVX.
I'm getting crates made this week and will build the next two transmissions next week. They are already spoken for. I'm going to try to keep some in stock as soon as I can but it looks like they are going to be bought up as quickly as I can make them for a little while.
Earthworm
06-04-2007, 07:06 PM
Are you going to share what "adjustments" were made to correct the shuddering? At least if it was electrical or mechanical.
YourConfused
07-26-2007, 03:54 PM
So, has anyone bought and installed one of these yet? (for a second opinion on the shift improvements) Just curious.
Tiamat-red
07-26-2007, 04:30 PM
I wanna know too.
Not counting shipping(why can't everyone else be closer to me?) that isn't a bad price for ANY "new" transmission.
If it's a as good as advertised I might have to start towing large and heavy things with my SVX just to have an excuse to order one.
I have big plans for this car (read pipe dreams) but honestly knowing all the things I can do to this car, I STILL prefer to keep it auto....
I prefer the "rocket" method of driving......point and shoot...
nexus_7
08-20-2007, 09:08 AM
Check is IN THE MAIL!
Greg
iceman039
08-20-2007, 01:39 PM
I have a 4.44 on order from micheal. Should be installed in three weeks or so.:) I'll let you know about the shift modifications then.
longassname
09-05-2007, 09:39 PM
I started getting these out a few weeks ago so it shouldn't be too long before you start hearing more about them.
Here are a couple pictures of one of them being crated. I made half a dozen of these hardwood crates with the idea of being able to eventually have some transmissions in stock ready to go when ordered. The crates are really easy to open without dissassembling them. I even circled the screws you take out to open them and wrote on them to only take out the circled screws. Take out the new stuff, drop in the old stuff and back to me. I take care of the freight so that you get freight at my cost instead of yours and just deduct it from your core charge. Freight isn't too bad. Usually $100 to $150 each way.
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/DSC_4908.jpg
http://www.ecutune.com/posts/4eat/DSC_4917.jpg
TomsSVX
09-05-2007, 10:08 PM
whats that v-twin in the background there?? Nice long forks on that orange frame:) Nice work Mike
Tom
YourConfused
09-05-2007, 10:45 PM
It looks like I am in line as of 08/09/07. I'll let you know how it performs when I get it.
4.44 kids.
Tiamat-red
09-06-2007, 05:13 AM
Can't wait to see some more opinions!
nexus_7
09-09-2007, 03:10 PM
Looks good, cant wait to get mine also. gana be a lot of fun putting it all back together...along with replacing all these engine gaskets. Going to be better then new.
Stage one, super trans, 2 trans cooler, PS cooler, new gaskets, new spark plugs, and new radiator! Oh, and new exhaust.
I missed driving this car.
Greg
cdigerlando
09-12-2007, 01:41 PM
I redid the transfer clutch and fixed the binding at parking speed so now the transmission project is a complete success and I'm about ready to get rolling on offering them.
For those who may read this and not know what binding is I'll explain it so that you understand that running into this problem as part of our build is actually a good thing--and not totally unexpected (that's why I've been so casual about it). When you are turning the wheels need to turn at different speeds. In order for this to happen in our awd car the transfer clutch needs to allow the slippage that equates to the difference in wheel speed. If it grips too much then it doesn't allow the slippage until some forces build up and then you get a shuddering as it grips, slips, grips, slips, etc. That is what we call binding. Since we increased the fluid flow and line pressure as part of this build I knew the transfer clutch would be much less inclined to allow slippage (just like all the other clutch packs) and I would likely have to make adjustments. So the prototype transmission was built,tested, and the adjustments have been made; this build is now the single best thing I've ever done for the SVX.
I'm getting crates made this week and will build the next two transmissions next week. They are already spoken for. I'm going to try to keep some in stock as soon as I can but it looks like they are going to be bought up as quickly as I can make them for a little while.
How much are you charging for the rebuilt transmission?
longassname
09-12-2007, 01:48 PM
$2,800. In your case you should also get the through bolted drive gear/transfer clutch drum assembly upgrade which is another $200.
http://www.ecutune.com/4eat.htm
How much are you charging for the rebuilt transmission?
cdigerlando
09-13-2007, 02:06 PM
$2,800. In your case you should also get the through bolted drive gear/transfer clutch drum assembly upgrade which is another $200.
http://www.ecutune.com/4eat.htm
That is a damn good price. That is less than a subaru rebuilt transmission. I've got a level 10 built transmission right now. I'm hoping that it holds up. I have no idea what was done to it other than the rebuild with tougher friction plates?, higher stall torque converter, and tuned valve body. If I blow it I'll send you the core and definitely get it rebuilt by you. Maybe you can see some of the other mods they did that might also help with this project.
SVXMAN2001
09-19-2007, 02:07 PM
any one have one of these installed? I am looking to hear some feedback before i decide to lay out the $$$.
Also, Lan what is the warranty on these tranny's?
longassname
09-19-2007, 03:41 PM
If you break it in two you get both halves.
any one have one of these installed? I am looking to hear some feedback before i decide to lay out the $$$.
Also, Lan what is the warranty on these tranny's?
nexus_7
10-03-2007, 01:29 PM
Mine should be here next week so that weekend I will attempt to do the install. Looking forward to driving the SVX again. I really missed it...even though I like my Maxima also. But I see 20 of those a day...I miss my SVX...after this i can fix my other one. lol Stupid amazing cars!
Greg
SVXMAN2001
10-29-2007, 08:34 AM
Greg, have you gotten to installing the transmission yet?
SVXRide
10-29-2007, 08:37 AM
If you break it in two you get both halves.
:lol::lol::lol::lol:
-Bill
YourConfused
11-16-2007, 08:31 PM
Still no feedback? What's up w/ that.
longassname
11-17-2007, 08:16 AM
You guys are all racing for the guiness record for least timely transmission install.
Don't rush the install/converter install when you actually do get around to it though; It's absolutely essential that all 3 splined sections of the converter assembly are engaged. Unfortunately one purchaser of one of these transmissions didn't get his converter installed correctly and now I'm still waiting for some pictures so I can try to guide him to determine the condition of things now and into a successful install.
Just a tip to help others avoid doing the same: Your converter should not be pressed up against the flex plate when you bolt the transmission up to the engine. There should be around 1/8 of an inch space between the converter and flex plate until you install the converter bolts which draw the converter up to the flex plate. If you don't have that space when you are bolting the trans up don't bolt it up; the converter is not propperly installed.
YourConfused
11-17-2007, 12:57 PM
:Dwhat a bunch of slackers!:D
longassname
11-19-2007, 10:28 AM
Actually......
I have customers waiting for transmissions and have had to turn other customers who needed transmissions away because I haven't gotten any cores back to build.
If you guys don't hurry up and get your cores back to me I'm going to have to buy new cores in which case you'll default on your core charge.
From now on there is a 30 day limit on cores ...from my door back to my door.
Paulrio74
11-20-2007, 04:07 PM
Would there be a possibility to set up an appointment to rebuild over a weekend (or whatever time needed)? I'd like to spend some vacation time to drive over, get my trans rebuilt, and drive back (not for the next 3 months at least).
longassname
11-23-2007, 04:57 PM
sure, why not
Would there be a possibility to set up an appointment to rebuild over a weekend (or whatever time needed)? I'd like to spend some vacation time to drive over, get my trans rebuilt, and drive back (not for the next 3 months at least).
TomsSVX
11-24-2007, 06:27 AM
Mike, do you need an extra core??
Tom
SSSVX
11-25-2007, 03:57 AM
If you guys don't hurry up and get your cores back to me I'm going to have to buy new cores in which case you'll default on your core charge.
I have one extra if you want to buy, let me know. I could deliver to you if possible to save the shipping.
nextse7en
11-25-2007, 05:47 AM
Hi lan, I've got a core as well, still shifts well, as a matter of fact.
-Patrick
iceman039
11-27-2007, 12:26 PM
drumroll please:D
My new 4.44 built by LAN is in and fully functional. I am very happy with it. The shifts are very quick. My best estimation (not having taken the car to the track at all) is that the combination of both the 4.44 and the performance rebuild have resulted in a 2 second improvement in the quarter mile. Because I did the performance build and 4.44 swap at the same time, it is difficult for me to say just how much faster the shifts alone make the car.
I was a little worried at first because the darned thing shifted so hard i thought it was gonna tear my car in two! It settled down a little more each day though, and now after about 150 miles on it it seems to be comfortable in it's new home. I would now classify the shifts as fast and firm, not jarring.
Overall it seems that LAN has pulled through with this transmission. The real test for me is over the next 5-10 years. I wanted a faster transmission, but more importantly I wanted it to be rebuilt by someone who is familiar with the tendancies of OUR transmissions.
SVXRide
11-27-2007, 01:27 PM
Good news! How many miles are you going to put on the trans before you drain the fluid out and change the internal filter? 500? 1000?
-Bill
longassname
11-27-2007, 08:21 PM
He really shouldn't have to change his internal filter. It's just a screen. There's no reason to drop the pan. He doesn't even really need to change the fluid for a while.
Wow.. I was considering converting over to a manual transmission. But now I might wait to see how things turn out here. With all the mods and upgrades done how does the transmission shift on everyday driving and do you expect any failures as seems to be the case with other professionally rebuild and or reconditioned 4eats?
longassname
12-01-2007, 10:40 PM
I'm not sure who these questions are directed to but my opinion is great and no
Wow.. I was considering converting over to a manual transmission. But now I might wait to see how things turn out here. With all the mods and upgrades done how does the transmission shift on everyday driving and do you expect any failures as seems to be the case with other professionally rebuild and or reconditioned 4eats?
I'm not sure who these questions are directed to but my opinion is great and no
long....
so do you think with the mods and upgrades in the 4eat... is this just as good as going to a 5speed manual?
longassname
12-03-2007, 11:02 PM
The built auto certainly works better and races better than a manual. The only reason to get a manual transmission is because you want one.
long....
so do you think with the mods and upgrades in the 4eat... is this just as good as going to a 5speed manual?
doesnt the auto also use a computer?
longassname
12-04-2007, 08:56 AM
Yes the auto is controlled by a tcu (transmission control unit)
doesnt the auto also use a computer?
Yes the auto is controlled by a tcu (transmission control unit)
does that need to be upgraded as well? or is it just fine the way it is?
longassname
12-05-2007, 01:10 AM
i'm sure we could do some good stuff tampering with the tcu software but the mechanicals trump that. It takes more clutches, higher apply pressures, and higher coefficients of frictions to pass more torque.
does that need to be upgraded as well? or is it just fine the way it is?
sicksubie
12-05-2007, 07:29 AM
Does the built auto still have the same shift RPM as a stock trans? If yes, then my next question is can it be raised at all?
longassname
12-05-2007, 08:10 AM
That would be something you would need to change in the tcu firmware.
Does the built auto still have the same shift RPM as a stock trans? If yes, then my next question is can it be raised at all?
That would be something you would need to change in the tcu firmware.
how difficult is that? what about changing the torque converter for higher rpm's or is that also controlled by the tcu and not needed to be changed?
longassname
12-05-2007, 04:29 PM
neither I nor anyone else that I know of has gotten into the tcu yet.
There are places that will remanufacture a torque converter for a higher stall speed. I'm not personally interested in a higher stall speed. With my transmissions I supply an oe spec torque converter from daaco.
how difficult is that? what about changing the torque converter for higher rpm's or is that also controlled by the tcu and not needed to be changed?
TomsSVX
12-05-2007, 05:16 PM
the guys have gotten into the ECU and played with it already. just no drop in ROM socket for permanent changes
Tom
b3lha
12-06-2007, 06:18 AM
the guys have gotten into the TCU and played with it already. just no drop in ROM socket for permanent changes
Tom
There IS a space for a ROM socket on the TCU circuit board. I reckon it can be chipped just like the ECU.
longassname
12-06-2007, 10:15 AM
I was trying to get across that the mechanical build of the transmission and any prospective adjustments to the tcu are for the most part seperate issues--with the mechanical build being the first issue that needs attention. You need the solid foundation that is actually capable of transmitting more torque and locking up clutch packs quicker before you can start adjusting the tcu parameters to tell the box to do things like shift under higher torque conditions and shift faster. There's no point in telling an 80 pound boy to pull an 18 wheeler across a parking lot. First you grow the "worlds strongest man;" then you tell him to pull the 18 wheeler accross the parking lot.
Now of course the tcu can be socketted and I know Phil has downloaded the firmware from it as have I. I also have many of the parameters mapped out and am probably close to as far out in the forefront on the TCU as the ECU. I can't speek for Phil but I believe Phil is focussing his efforts on the ECU and still has lots of work ahead of him there. Putting a socket into the TCU is not in any way a hurdle to me nor I think him; there are just so many hours in a day.
If I should in the future find a real need to make an adjustment to the tcu firmware I'll do it now that I do have a solid transmission that can actually perform the mechanical operations I ask of it. When that time comes I'll make an appropriate thread to talk about. If Phil is doing more with the TCU than I am aware of or he digs into it in the future I'm sure he'll start an appropriate thread too. So least this thread continue down the hijack path....
This thread is about the mechanical build of the transmission.
SomethingElse
03-30-2008, 06:16 AM
Lan, If you dont ever plan to offer this kit in parts what kit would you suggest to someone who would like to rebuild there own transmission?
odepaj
05-07-2008, 12:04 AM
What exactly would it take (mechanically and electronically) to make a phase I 4eat rear-wheel bias?
longassname
05-07-2008, 01:36 PM
Different size drive and driven gears and space to fit them in the extension housing (I don't see any).
What exactly would it take (mechanically and electronically) to make a phase I 4eat rear-wheel bias?
SVXRide
05-07-2008, 02:17 PM
Michael,
I've got two TCUs ready to come your way. You still need them?
-Bill
SomethingElse
05-23-2008, 06:31 PM
Different size drive and driven gears and space to fit them in the extension housing (I don't see any).
wish I could get a response:confused:
longassname
05-23-2008, 06:53 PM
it's not reasonably possible. In order to get a rear wheel bias there would need to be a mechanism for slippage in the transmission of torque to the front which is gear driven.
wish I could get a response:confused:
SomethingElse
05-29-2008, 02:50 AM
it's not reasonably possible. In order to get a rear wheel bias there would need to be a mechanism for slippage in the transmission of torque to the front which is gear driven.
I was typing about post 122 ..copy...paste...If you dont ever plan to offer this kit in parts, what kit would you suggest to someone who would like to rebuild there own transmission?
longassname
05-29-2008, 06:53 AM
I don't use a kit and couldn't suggest one for you.
I was typing about post 122 ..copy...paste...If you dont ever plan to offer this kit in parts, what kit would you suggest to someone who would like to rebuild there own transmission?
longassname
03-08-2009, 04:38 PM
With the one exception of the transmission Yourconfused said didn't work right (and refused to send back or even trouble shoot over the phone)feedback on these transmissions has been excellent. A couple more forum members have them now so I'm bringing this thread back so they can find it and share their feedback with you as well.
longassname
03-08-2009, 04:41 PM
I'm also offering valve bodies now so those who can't afford the whole transmission can at least have fast shifts and higher apply pressures to help their current transmissions last. http://www.ecutune.com/4eat_valve_body.htm
VICSVX
03-08-2009, 05:21 PM
so on friday, i put the tranny in from ECUtune in my 94 L....WOW:eek:
it is so much different! its lyk a new car...literally!
shifts really smooth and the shifts are barely noticeable....the throttle seems more touchy, and install didnt take long.
Michael did a very good job and the wait was well worth while!
He gives recomened oils and additives which takes great deal out of searching for the best oils.
The tranny rebuild includes a torque converted but he also offers a beefer transfer clutch drum upgrade
i added an aux tranny cooler and temp gauge during the install and that was easy as well
if u need a new tranny but cant afford a MT swap or shady on buyin a used one, hit Mike up....you wont regret it!
ECUtune Performance 4eat (http://www.ecutune.com/4eat.htm)
Jnthn_Sctt
03-09-2009, 07:52 PM
FYI: New Tranny by Mike in my '92 Claret.
Nice smooth operation, low temps (likely due to using PWR radiator & original cooler) 165* under load.
Install by SVXFiles Tom and I would recommend him without reservations any job, any time. (Diane is also a pleasure)
Shifts as smooth as original, but cleaner (faster? tighter?) Just better all the way around as far as I'm concerned.
Still on a stock engine, but will update again with future mods.
So far?? Definite 2 Thumbs up!! Nice Job Mike (LAN)
VICSVX
03-11-2009, 08:29 PM
i agree 100%!
im still stock engine wise, but now that i got the tranny, engine mods are on the way!:D
FYI: New Tranny by Mike in my '92 Claret.
Nice smooth operation, low temps (likely due to using PWR radiator & original cooler) 165* under load.
Install by SVXFiles Tom and I would recommend him without reservations any job, any time. (Diane is also a pleasure)
Shifts as smooth as original, but cleaner (faster? tighter?) Just better all the way around as far as I'm concerned.
Still on a stock engine, but will update again with future mods.
So far?? Definite 2 Thumbs up!! Nice Job Mike (LAN)
SVXMAN2001
03-12-2009, 07:10 AM
Hey guys, are these cars your daily driver's? How many miles have you logged on the new transmissions?
Nomad
03-19-2009, 07:49 PM
Hi all ,
It's been a year now that i have that tranny ( with 3.90 ) and it's a great daily driver . I have the v1.5 chip , Stebro complete exaust, but still, will need a complete forced engine made by LAN when he will make them availlable .. so , still waiting for that !! :D
SVXMAN2001
03-19-2009, 08:23 PM
how many miles have you put on it?
Nomad
03-19-2009, 08:44 PM
About 14,000 Miles .
SVXMAN2001
03-19-2009, 09:13 PM
good deal, not sure if i recall correctly but didn't you elect to keep a stock spring in place vs. lan's upgraded spring, not sure what the spring was actually called or what it did, but having the stiffer lan spring caused shifts to be much more harsh....also i am assuming you had a tranny cooler installed, correct?
Nomad
03-20-2009, 12:15 AM
No tranny cooler , I have the stiffer spring for now , but i'll change that to have a smoother ride , he's sending me it as we speak ! :D
Great service by the way !
longassname
03-20-2009, 07:27 AM
I used to ask people if they wanted the stiffer 1-2 accumulator spring and everyone always said yes, probably because they couldn't imagine an svx transmission actually having such possitive grab any of its shifts could be characterized as "harsh." I no longer ask and no longer use a stiffer 1-2 accumulator spring; I still have one in my car though. If you have stock shift maps and accelerate lightly and then let off there are times the car will be shifting into 2nd while you are letting off. With the heavier 1-2 accumulator spring that shift could be easily be characterized as harsh. With my shift maps that doesn't happen because you don't go popping into 2nd gear too early to begin with. With my current valve body modifications and the oe spring the shift is still instantaneous but could never be characterized as "harsh."
Nomad
03-20-2009, 08:06 AM
ha well , maybe i'll just change the TCU now ... I didnt know that it would resolve that little point .... :) need to wait in April tough...
oab_au
03-20-2009, 06:25 PM
I used to ask people if they wanted the stiffer 1-2 accumulator spring and everyone always said yes, probably because they couldn't imagine an svx transmission actually having such possitive grab any of its shifts could be characterized as "harsh." I no longer ask and no longer use a stiffer 1-2 accumulator spring; I still have one in my car though. If you have stock shift maps and accelerate lightly and then let off there are times the car will be shifting into 2nd while you are letting off. With the heavier 1-2 accumulator spring that shift could be easily be characterized as harsh. With my shift maps that doesn't happen because you don't go popping into 2nd gear too early to begin with. With my current valve body modifications and the oe spring the shift is still instantaneous but could never be characterized as "harsh."
That is a good move, stronger accumulator springs make the engagement heavy all the time. It is better to let the throttle pressure ramp up the accumulator pressure to suit the torque that has to be carried.
Of course this will still be turned into a 'soft serve' by the TCU, unless a Quick Change is fitted to allow the box to make the changes the way the gearbox manufactures intended. :)
Harvey.
Nomad
03-28-2009, 11:33 AM
okay okay , I just paypaled Lan for a TCU ... So with his performance transmission @ 3.90 , and v1.5 , it should behave like a champ ? I'll post a note when i'll have tested it for a week or two ... :D Common LAN , it's been 10 min already ...WHERE'S MY CHIP !!!?? :rolleyes: ;)
Jnthn_Sctt
03-28-2009, 03:08 PM
Hey guys, are these cars your daily driver's? How many miles have you logged on the new transmissions?
I switch between SVX and Range Rover, but SVX is primary car. I drove from Orange County (NY) to White Plains at least twice a week in heavy traffic on Thruway and not a complaint about the tranny as a daily driver.
Since getting new tranny likely around 2,500 miles and no worries.
Hope this helps
VICSVX
04-19-2009, 05:29 PM
i've put 1k on mine now...still wrks like a champ!
btw she is a daily driver....about 230 a week
longassname
08-04-2009, 08:23 PM
these boxes are kicking butt and partial rebuilds are available now...so if you have an svx get one of these transmissions to turn it into a high performance sports car instead of a pending break down.
cdigerlando
08-05-2009, 06:53 AM
Has anyone pushed any HP through this tranny? As you know I have a level 10 rebuild. I would be interested in a shift map which would allow the engine to reach peak HP with the cams LAN sold. Anyone know where these cams peak yet?
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 09:50 AM
I'm planning on doing a tranny swap next month, and though I've been leaning more towards a 5mt swap my budget and my workspace are not looking promising for a job of that caliber, so I'm researching all options at this point.
What kind of warranty do you offer on your partial rebuilt transmission? And do you offer a package deal if I were to purchase an upgraded TCU with it? Also, if upgrading to a 4.11 would I still have to change out the rear diff just as if I were doing a 5mt swap? If so, which car would I have to pillage to get the diff?
Thanks in advance!
longassname
08-05-2009, 03:03 PM
I think you'll find the factory 3.545 gears are the best gears for the car once you upgrade your TCU. There is no package discount though and there is no warranty. If you were to put it in and it didn't work right I would have you send it back to me to redo it. That is very unlikely to happen.
I'm planning on doing a tranny swap next month, and though I've been leaning more towards a 5mt swap my budget and my workspace are not looking promising for a job of that caliber, so I'm researching all options at this point.
What kind of warranty do you offer on your partial rebuilt transmission? And do you offer a package deal if I were to purchase an upgraded TCU with it? Also, if upgrading to a 4.11 would I still have to change out the rear diff just as if I were doing a 5mt swap? If so, which car would I have to pillage to get the diff?
Thanks in advance!
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 03:40 PM
Okay, but if I wanted a 4.11 would I need to switch differential gears as well?
redlightningsvx
08-05-2009, 04:55 PM
Yes.............
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 04:59 PM
Thank you.
Most likely going to order one of these next month. Do you have them in stock currently LAN?
longassname
08-05-2009, 06:04 PM
Nope, I build it when you order it.
Thank you.
Most likely going to order one of these next month. Do you have them in stock currently LAN?
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 06:30 PM
What is your turn around time on a partial rebuild?
longassname
08-05-2009, 06:34 PM
would depend on where the core comes from. You should give yourself time. I won't be rushed through a build. That wouldn't be good for either of us.
What is your turn around time on a partial rebuild?
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 07:02 PM
I definitely would prefer you didn't rush through the build.
So you would need my core first? I was under the assumption you had cores already and i would send you mine in the same box that the newly built one came in.
longassname
08-05-2009, 07:13 PM
I would purchase a transmision (from someone else) to build after you ordered. I'm out of cores right now.
AyeJaye
08-05-2009, 07:16 PM
Gotcha. Well, if all goes well I'll be ordering one next month. Thanks for the info!
longassname
10-16-2011, 07:59 AM
I have one of these performance built transmissions in stock right now.
longassname
04-12-2015, 08:56 AM
Ok, so I just looked through this thread from the begining. I was thinking it had been 5 or 6 years since I built the first performance 4eat. It has been 8.
That first performance 4eat has been in my pearly since it was built. I used that car to develop a few things so it has been on the dyno a few times with some real power but it has mainly been a daily driver for my mom all of that time. I'm giving her my SUV now as I upgrade mine and reclaim the pearly to make it my personal SVX.
So, I've pulled the driveline out of the pearly to make way for the new one I'm building for it. I've gone through the 9.3 compression engine which is for sale/sold. And I've started going through this transmission which is also for sale. As far as I'm concerned this transmission is a piece of SVX history. I had really gotten jammed up blowing up every transmission I put in my ebony before I developed this rebuild. It's 8 years later now and I just opened up and inspected every clutch pack in it and every one looks and measures like new.
longassname
04-12-2015, 08:56 AM
There are a lot of parts in a transmission....so there are going to be a lot of pictures. I've gone through this
transmission now and as expected it shows virtually no signs of wear. It has really held up well. After 8 years every last
friction in it is still like new.
Ok, so out comes the torque converter:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0900.jpg
Then I cleaned up the outside with some wd40:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0901.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0905.jpg
Opened the extension housing and removed the transfer clutch:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0908.jpg
Opened the transfer clutch up and inspected the frictions. The transfer frictions are the only "tan" (tan = regular)
frictions I use. The transfer clutch is broken in so it operates smoothly but not at all worn. The original thickness of
the frictions when new was 0.071"...they are still 0.071" thick. You might also note that the fluid in the transmission is
very clean. That's because nothing in it has worn.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0910.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0916.jpg
Next, I destaked the stake nut which holds the driven gear to the end of the pinion, pulled the through bolted transfer
clutch hub/drive gear/output shaft assembly, pulled the driven gear, pulled the parking lock mechanism, and cleaned the
mating surface.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0921.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0924.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0926.jpg
longassname
04-12-2015, 08:57 AM
Next came unsnapping the harnesses so they hung free, removing the fill/dipstick tube, and removing the cooler lines so the
differential could be removed. The differential doesn't show any wear either. I actually have the Subaru specialized tools
for setting up the differential. When you set them up right and use the right fluid they don't wear. You might note that
the contact pattern is large and in the center of the teeth.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0929.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0932.jpg
With the extension housing and differential off it's time to stand up the transmission. The pump and pinion can be removed
as a unit.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0943.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0951.jpg
With the pump off the transmission is open and I could start pulling out parts. I pulled the brake band out and inspected
and measured it. Although it was just a regular brake band it wasn't worn. It measured the same as the borg warner band I
favor now and will replace it with.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0954.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0960.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0965.jpg
longassname
04-12-2015, 08:58 AM
The brake band wraps around the reverse clutch drum. It comes out next. The guts of a transmission are pretty much a stack
of parts which stack into each other. For a while here you'll just see pictures of disassembled clutch packs but that will
be followed with the lined up parts which will be followed by the stacking them all back together in the transmission. By
the end you'll see what I mean.
Here's the reverse clutch pack opened up. Still looking good.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0974.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0979.jpg
Next comes the high clutch. This one is the big deal. If something was going to be worn it would have been the high clutch
or the brake band. This is the clutch pack that is usually the culprit in a blown 4eat. It is also usually significantly
worn in a still normally operating 4eat. The stock clutch pack uses 5 frictions. I upgraded it with 6 high energy graphite
frictions and 6 kolene steels. Kolene steels are a hardened steel. They come with a black finish. The black you see on
them is finish that hasn't worn off. The 6 year old frictions are still the exact same thickness as the new ones I'm
replacing them with. There's nothing wrong with them but I'm replacing them anyway so that the next owner knows he has a
new high clutch.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0987.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_0997.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1001.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1010.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1020.jpg
Then there's the high clutch hub and a bunch of gear stuff I'll cover better during reassembly. For now here are the
planetaries, sun gears, bearings, one way clutches, etc etc all lined up:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1021.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1029.jpg
longassname
04-12-2015, 08:59 AM
Next is the forward clutch. The forward clutch drum is big. Most of the guts of the transmission fit inside it. With all
that removed and the forward clutch drum pulled out there's nothing left in the transmission case except the low/reverse
clutch which we will get to shortly. Now, the forward clutch drum houses both the overruning clutch and the forward clutch.
The forward clutch is the big one and it comes out first. The stock clutch pack uses 6 frictions. This clutch pack has 7.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1038.jpg
Ok, so first out comes the forward clutch. Again, the frictions look new and measure the same as new. Then out comes the
overrunning clutch. Again the frictions look new and measure the same as new.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1045.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1054.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1067.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1080.jpg
Now we can look in the transmission case and see the low reverse clutch which installs into the case itself. This 97 SVX
transmission originally had 6 frictions in this clutch pack. I changed it to the 92 style arrangement that uses 8. Like
every other friction in this thing they looked and measured like new:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1092.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1104.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1114.jpg
Before putting anything and everything back in the transmission case I removed the pan and installed a new OE gasket. I
like the genuine Subaru pan gasket.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1119.jpg
longassname
04-13-2015, 07:45 AM
The forward clutch drum is the first thing that goes in. For some reason I evidently didn't feel like taking a picture of that.
The next thing that goes in is the overrun clutch hub. You use Vaseline to stick the bearing to its bottom side and Vaseline to stick the plastic spacer to it's top side. Yes, petroleum jelly is the correct goo. It's pretty much impossible to build a transmission correctly without it. Almost every part in the stack has a bearing or a spacer stuck to its underside and you need something to make them stick so they stay where they belong while you are installing the part. Petroleum jelly mixed with atf is also great assembly lube.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1122.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1123.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1127.jpg
Here's the forward clutch hub and a one way clutch. It needs to be taken apart. Just because it came out in one piece doesn't mean everything stayed where it belongs. In fact the spacer between the two is out of place. The tongs that stop it from spinning are not in the holes where they should be. I take it apart, lube up the one way clutch (the part that looks like roller bearings but isn't), install the forward clutch hub, stick the spacer to the rear ring gear, and install the ring gear.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1131.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1137.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1140.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1144.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1150.jpg
Next I install the rear planetary and sun gear:
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1153.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1158.jpg
longassname
04-13-2015, 07:46 AM
Stick the bearing to the front planetary, install it, and stick the next bearing to it.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1159.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1163.jpg
Stick the bearing to the sun gear, lube it, and install it.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1165.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1168.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1171.jpg
Install the high clutch hub and and the next bearing and then the high clutch. There's a selective thickness washer on the high clutch. If I had changed anything I would have to break out my precision depth micrometer set and some specialized tools to take a bunch of very accurate measurements to select the correct thickness washer to put here which adjusts the end play of the whole stack. There are also selective shims for the pinion and reverse clutch drum. I have all of these things but I don't need to change them in this instance.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1172.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1176.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1179.jpg
Next, the reverse clutch goes in and then the brake band. At this point you need to tighten the band up enough that it doesn't fall apart but leave it loose enough that it doesn't make it difficult to install the pump.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1183.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1188.jpg
longassname
04-13-2015, 07:46 AM
We're ready to install the pump now so it's time to install the pump gasket to the case. There are two nuts that hold the pump to the case. After I torque them I torque the pan bolts. When I installed the pan earlier I installed the bolts with a screw driver so they were loose enough to let it be nudged by the pump if necessary.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1191.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1194.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1195.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1205.jpg
Now it's time to install the differential. I always use a new seal pipe. This is what keeps your atf and gear oil separate. You need your mating surfaces chemically clean so you get a good bond. Prep solve is the best solvent to use but others would work acceptably too. Ultra-grey is really the only acceptable sealant to use. You don't want to forget the rubber bushing for the fluid pass through and you should lube the ends of the seal pipe with petroleum jelly.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1210.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1215.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1221.jpg
One of the bolts attaching the differential to the transmission also holds the fill tube. It's best to install the fill tube now. You want to put all the differential bolts in finger tight, then torque the little bolt at the bottom of the fill tube down, then torque the differential bolts.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1222.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1223.jpg
longassname
04-13-2015, 07:47 AM
Now's a good time to change the crush washer on the pan. You always want to use a new crush washer.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1226.jpg
The transmission is pretty heavy now and it's time to lay it down before it falls over and hurts somebody then we can install the driven gear, parking lock, drive gear, transfer clutch, and extension housing.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1239.jpg
Speaking of new crush washers it's time to install the cooler pipes. You need new crush washers for these too. And look at that: we're done.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1247.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1262.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1252.jpg
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1265.jpg
longassname
04-19-2015, 04:50 PM
I'll probably get a chance to crate this transmission Thursday.
longassname
05-02-2015, 09:27 AM
I got a chance to finish the crate. I'm going to post this transmission for sale on ebay now. It's ready to ship and available now for $3500 plus freight. The crate is 36x21x25 and should be about 300 lbs.
http://www.subiechips.com/posts/my4eat/resized/DSC_1275.jpg
longassname
05-09-2015, 07:27 PM
This transmission is listed on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/231557187323
longassname
05-21-2015, 08:22 AM
Relisted: http://www.ebay.com/itm/231564260136
longassname
06-16-2015, 12:28 PM
The transmission from this thread sold to a good home. Subiechips is not going to be selling the performance transmissions like ECUtune did; however I do have the parts here to build another transmission in addition to the one I am building for myself. If someone needing a good transmission comes across this thread while I still have said parts I'll be willing to build a transmission and ship to Potomac Valley Performance for installation.
longassname
10-10-2015, 02:48 PM
Someone took me up on my offer to build one more performance 4eat. I'm starting the rebuild now and have found the front differential needs to be redone. I've started a new thread to give a how to on setting up front differentials.
http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/showthread.php?p=742193#post742193
ZoraSVX
08-06-2020, 05:34 AM
Just read through this whole thread - amazing. However, it's 2020 now - does anyone know if these rebuilt transmissions can still be ordered? If not, are there similar alternatives?
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